michaellinder Posted January 3, 2021 Share Posted January 3, 2021 You might say photography is a form of therapy similar to Wittgenstein's Philosophical Investigations. Arthur, can you please elucidate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaellinder Posted January 3, 2021 Share Posted January 3, 2021 "Concepts without precepts are empty. Precepts without concepts are blind." (from the Prologema ...., I think) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samstevens Posted January 4, 2021 Share Posted January 4, 2021 "Concepts without precepts are empty. Precepts without concepts are blind." (from the Prologema ...., I think) Sorry to be an anally exacting picker of nits, but ... a) it’s percept (short for perception), not precept b) it’s in the intro to The Critique of Pure Reason :) And here’s something cute I found on this particular quote ... 1 "You talkin' to me?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaellinder Posted January 4, 2021 Share Posted January 4, 2021 Sorry to be an anally exacting picker of nits, but ... a) it’s percept (short for perception), not precept b) it’s in the intro to The Critique of Pure Reason :) And here’s something cute I found on this particular quote ... [ATTACH=full]1370764[/ATTACH] 1. I hastily thought I was typing 'percepts'. 2. I deserve a 0 rating. 3. It's been a long while since I read Kant. Hence, my parenthetical reference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arthur_gottschalk Posted January 6, 2021 Share Posted January 6, 2021 You might say photography is a form of therapy similar to Wittgenstein's Philosophical Investigations. It's been a long time, but as I remember, Wittgenstein believed that linguistic analysis provided a "therapy" to language and the structures it presents. By extension, photography, IMHO, may provide a "therapy," or analysis, of our visual perception of reality. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arthur_gottschalk Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 I've been thinking lately about the photographer Lewis Baltz, whose work I increasingly admire. I do think his pictures are, among other things, an example of photography as a "therapy" applied to the visual universe. Put another way, "this could be photography as art criticism," as William Wilson wrote in the Los Angeles Times in 1912. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arthur_gottschalk Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 Mistaken Double Post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inoneeye Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 "... photography, IMHO, may provide a "therapy," or analysis, of our visual perception of reality." Good food for thought arthur. Photography offers me a visual means/language to express my perception of realities. i n o n e e y e Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samstevens Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 A good therapist asks significant questions. So do many good photographs. As importantly, good therapists often guide their patients to alternate perspectives, which is what photos pretty much can’t help but do. In both a literal and metaphorical sense, the photos from Abu Ghraib would seem to have been therapeutic. Ironically, many were taken by disordered people in severe need of therapy, not to mention punishment. Lewis Hines’s PHOTOS provided social therapy. Weston's PEPPER and ESCUSADO not only applied therapy to our visual perception but did so to our experience of reality itself. What is a pepper? What is art? What is a picture of a pepper? How does a picture of a toilet affect how I see a toilet? How does a picture of a toilet differ from a toilet? Is it just a picture of a toilet or is that too limiting a way to look at it? The common behavior of mankind is the system of reference by means of which we interpret an unknown language. —Wittgenstein The same might be said of photography. 2 "You talkin' to me?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 (edited) Does photography have any Categorical imperatives? Does "f/8 and be there" count? Does photography elevate a crap photograph? Just a thought. Edited January 16, 2021 by Allen Herbert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 With a endless spouting of banal words? Suppose it does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samstevens Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 With a endless spouting of banal words? selfie "You talkin' to me?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 "With a endless spouting of banal words? selfie" Sam. Me too, Sam. The good news is we will never walk alone. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 "Kant’s brilliance was shaped by a strict mindset" Sam. Shallow thoughts, with respect. His journey was a lot about deeper philosophical thought than a simplistic strict mindset. A Baker has a strict mindset as he kneads his dough. .Hello. Again folks like to talk fairy tales rather than reading actual historical facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samstevens Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Hmmm. You'd think that's the extent of what I said here about Kant and photography. When you set yourself up as the outsider, who knows better than everyone else, who feels entitled to call the conversations of others banal, who feels entitled to quote one phrase of a fellow photographer in order to willfully mischaracterize the thrust of his posts here, then You'll Never Walk Alone might just turn into ... "You talkin' to me?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Jeez, I feel all sort of wicked. Nobody loves me anymore? Do you still love me, Sam? Do you think if you love me lots of folks will also love me? Again look at the reality of the facts, How simple is that to do? Fairy tales are nice, but just fairy tales.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 "When you set yourself up as the outsider, who knows better than everyone else, who feels entitled to call the conversations of others banal" Sam. Call me sad, but I do believe in Democracy and Free speech; regardless of populist thoughts. If I want to call other folks thoughts banal so what. It is called free speech.! Hello. Sorry, if I have disturbed you with my thoughts and not following YOUR party line. Hey Ho I could not care a monkeys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samstevens Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 It's not your thoughts that disturb, it's your lack of them. You call our conversation about Kant banal but have nothing, yourself, to say about Kant or Wittgenstein and photography, which is what was being discussed. Perhaps your accusations of banality could be taken seriously or understood if you bothered to offer an alternative about Kant or Wittgenstein and photography that was something other than a generic platitude that showed no knowledge or understanding of Kant. I believe in free speech, too, which is why I've felt free to call you out on this. Free speech is not speech that gets no response. And intelligent speech can back itself up. Show us you know something about Kant that's different from the so-called banality of our words or your free speech is free of substance and value. "You talkin' to me?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samstevens Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 And, I'm not going to argue back and forth about free speech, loneliness, banality, or whether or not I love you, which is clearly all you want here. I'll only respond if you have something of substance to say about Kant and photography. "You talkin' to me?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 " His journey was a lot about deeper philosophical thought than a simplistic strict mindset" Allen This is the point I was making. Hence the vid. Sort of saves me writing a thousands words without the need to Understand, look, reason, open your mind.....and not write silly banal comments which you have not properly researched. Not that I mind the drama queen stuff, It's a fun cool thing. But if you want to discuss Kant in a serious way....I'm here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 (edited) Sublime or pretty? to start the ball rolling. Cannot be pretty also be sublime...or, are we talking boxes? Personally, I would argue the flower and the storm are both sublime; both having a unique perceptive, a subtly, in the eye of the viewer. Much like a photograph. The sublime exists along with the beauty, both being subline in their own way....without the mis guided perception of the obvious of beauty and sublime. Edited January 17, 2021 by Allen Herbert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samstevens Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Interestingly, Kant and photography go together well. Kant says that there is a real world out there but we can’t know it. We don’t have access to reality, just to our perception and experience of it. What we see is filtered through “categories” structured in our minds. An absolute good, for him, would be a human, moral way of being, not an activity like photography. But it seems to be that photographs which sometimes get mistaken for the things in the world they are photographs of are very much like Kant’s idea of human perceptions. Our perceptions, for Kant, bring us a representation and sometimes an enhancement and sometimes a restricted or even false view of reality. Photos can do the same. Great. Here's what I said on the matter. Respond to it specifically and tell me what you find banal about it. "You talkin' to me?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 These are all very obvious thoughts for anybody. Yes, the grass is green I get it. In that sense they are banal. His thoughts on beauty and sublime are more interesting. And are challenging to understand. Sam, just like you he sits on the bog every day...he is not a messiah. You can question his thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 "Our perceptions, for Kant, bring us a representation and sometimes an enhancement and sometimes a restricted or even false view of reality. Photos can do the same" Really. do you have to be called Kant to state the obvious? Or, Duffy Duck. Obviously he has the third eye;). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samstevens Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 His thoughts on beauty and sublime are more interesting. Describe some of his thoughts on beauty and the sublime, in your own words, that you find relevant or interesting. "You talkin' to me?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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