Hanging photos in an empty room with a wonky door lock

[Sandy Vongries]

Heaven knows, I'm no genius photographer, but every so often, like the proverbial "blind squirrel", I find a good nut -- I've been doing photography for a very long time. Pre PN "reincarnation" I used to get some number of views on my best shots, which was gratifying. Now almost nothing. I also used to see my favorite photogs new work automatically, no more. Based on the input of photos from most familiar names who I consider strong performers, I suspect I'm not the only one who wonders why I continue to post (outside No Words). Been doing a lot of Ranch work, so not as much time with the cameras. What have you experienced?

[DavidTriplett]

My experience and impressions match Sandy's. The interface has become too clumsy to encourage the kind of exploration I did on the previous version, much less identifying worthy images for comment. I was very disappointed with the very sparse response to a recent new gallery. I, too, am considering alternate venues...

[Rick Helmke]

I recall Shun commenting that the old version of PN was using an old software package of some kind and it was becoming difficult to support.Be that as it may the

new version seems to have alienated a lot of people here. It isn't as intuitive to use, not to me at least. I suspect a lot of the reason fewer comments are made is that fewer people are here to make them.

 

Rick H.

[rossb]

My photos are mostly family oriented shots and I do not want to post them on the net. I do post some general photography shots in a thread from time to time. Nobody comments on them so it is probably something I will move away from in the future. I have no photos in PN albums.

[Julie H]

Thumbnails are bigger. People can see your pictures without giving you a "view."

[Dieter Schaefer]

Now almost nothing.

Same here. Without the "almost". Uploaded a few images after the site update, got a few views etc. initially, now it's all dried up. Not that I make any effort on my part to change that. I occasionally venture into the "photo site" of PN but never really linger long (though whenever I do, I find some very interesting and very good photography; it's just that navigating the site is so tedious).

 

Thumbnails are bigger. People can see your pictures without giving you a "view."

Could certainly be a contributing factor.

 

Some of my favorite photographers' work I can't get to anymore (easily); the links have been broken (apparently all those who haven't posted after PN 2.0 was introduced). Can't even edit the list of favorite photographers.

[gordonjb]

Make those thumbnails smaller again and force people to click on pics to see them. That should sort things out.

[DavidTriplett]

it's just that navigating the site is so tedious

My issue as well, more than any other.

[michaellinder]

I totally agree with all of your observations. Thanks, Sandy, for getting this ball rolling.

 

I'd like to post a thread in Site Help to address the issues raised in this one. It might have more impact if I have everyone's permission to mention your names. Can you please let me know if that's OK?

[William Kahn]

Add me to the navigation complaint roster. If we can't manage it, how can any visitor?

[Sandy Vongries]

Michael, go for it! As you have seen I can get myself into more trouble than you ever could! ;-)

[DavidTriplett]

Je suis d'accord.

[Robin Smith]

I don't care about views of my stuff, but I too find I don't look at others' shots like I used too. Too slow, too much white space, too much scrolling.

[HoofArted]

Interesting thread. I've read a lot of similar threads comparing the "new" PN and the "old" PN.

 

Us new guys don't know how it was before, but it's a good bet that a lot of us haven't decided whether we're having problems navigating the forum because it's new to us or because it's not set up very well.

 

When I read long-time posters saying they're frustrated and are bugging out it makes me wonder if I should stay.

[Norma Desmond]

Michael, go ahead but it's beating a dead horse. It's all been said and heard. I can't imagine saying it again will make a difference.

 

Hoofarted, I've enjoyed your contributions to No Words. Hope you'll stick around.

[Dieter Schaefer]

Too slow, too much white space, too much scrolling.

Too many clicks needed for navigation. Something PN 2.0 shares with a lot of other sites who all seem to go by "Why stick to one click if two, three, or more suffice?"

 

It might have more impact if I have everyone's permission to mention your names. Can you please let me know if that's OK?

Sure. It's in the open here anyway.

 

When I read long-time posters saying they're frustrated and are bugging out it makes me wonder if I should stay.

Better to come to your own conclusions than relying on what long-time posters state.

[michaellinder]

Michael, go ahead but it's beating a dead horse. It's all been said and heard. I can't imagine saying it again will make a difference.

 

Hoofarted, I've enjoyed your contributions to No Words. Hope you'll stick around.

 

Fred, I've been engaged in a lot of contact with politicians (at all levels) concerning the current state of the Administration. I know this may not change anything, but I feel that I have to try. I feel the same way about PN2.0.

[michaellinder]

Here's a link to the thread I just posted in Site Help. System Issues; Attention - Glenn

[Norma Desmond]

Michael, as I said, go ahead and do what feels right to you. On your post, though, we ELECT politicians and the idea is they should be answerable to the citizens (even though they often don't quite get that). We did not elect anyone at PN and it's not run like a political body.

[Supriyo]

In the old PN, a sizable part of my portfolio traffic was from the photographers who made me their favorite. Whenever I would add a new photo to my portfolio, they would see it instantly and then comment if needed. Many of those people have either left or are less active now. Moreover, the updates from the favorite photographers are sidelined into a separate page away from the portfolio page, and not as noticeable as before. You really have to build a habit of clicking/looking into the updates from your favorites to check their contributions. I think, in my case, the less visibility of updates from favorite photographers is a partial reason for the decline in views.

 

One way to attract more visibility to your own photos is to write comments in the critic page. I have tried that, and found people have visited my work and commented when I commented theirs. This was true in the old PN, and is still true. You will have to make friends with new faces now, because many of the familiar faces are gone. Its like starting from scratch all over again.

Edited June 14, 2017 by Supriyo

[JamesFarabaugh]

It seems to me that PN activity was in decline before 2.0 rolled out. It was especially noted in the Canon Thursday thread. When I first joined we would get 10-12 pages each week, and at that time you could only post one image. But the page count of that thread dwindled before 2.0, despite the photo allowance being upped to 3. Also, the new thread topics were more plentiful and diverse when I was new here. Now it's just no words threads and the older guys lamenting about how it (photo.net or photography in general) isn't like it used to be. Not much content to engage in nowadays. Oh look, there I go lamenting about the good ol' days. Lol.

 

Anyway, I keep hoping that the activity here is cyclical, and it's just going through a trough right now. I myself am in a photographic trough, as having two kids under 3 and a wife who works evenings makes it near impossible to devote any time to hobbies. I admit that I haven't explored much more than the forums since 2.0 (or is it 2.1?) went live, but I don't have any trouble navigating.

[Sandy Vongries]

If you can keep up with hobbies, small kids and work, you're a better man than I. Nearly all I did photographically then was family snapshots. I did manage to ride my road bikes.

[zave_shapiro]

I've had the same sign-in for eighteen years. This time I couldn't see something on blogs because I don't have a sign-in. Or username. Or something.

[GerrySiegel]

Haven't followed the latest ups and downs here, not that much time these days and look to places that (modestly) help to improve my mind. Some day the backdrop story may get out. Like: " Hey, need a template for a photography place, move twenty years of data to something nifty and sharp. I got a deal for you. This startup in Kandahoor will do it for chump change. And if there are problems they give a six month guarantee. Here is their hotmail address.... And here is my card,,,nice paper stock you notice. You will love their work.... It may of course have a few bugs but it has been field tested in lots of sub Saharan countries. Can squeeze them out in a couple months usually.. And we are willing to negotiate $, if you got some people who can help on board or members who will do it for their proud support to the community..." ------Dick Arnold wrote a piece a year ago on what he "thought/speculated" IIRC, might be the mold or contours of the latest management philosophy slash business model. And if PN is really now a commodity, a shelf item in an inventory it will feel like a commodity. That, unfortunately and I say it not bitterly, is my take on PN, well lately last two years or so since Josh departed. Yes, true, the No Words and some of the Trendings come up with some good work. Some , otherwise mostly predictable. I have several other places that do inform me and some day I will list them if anyone seeks same. David Thorpe reviews and info on his methods is good. DPR on new items but is like back pages of Shutterbug Ads. A few others. Wrotniak for Olympus guides. I enjoy the old stuff coughed up by Shorpy for nostalgia. And so so many photo books, like Taschen to display remarkable images...RRS has a new magazine for customers on landscape stuff for instance.. B and H posts tutorials on studio lighting and video for mirrorless. With pictures and info on how made yet... Vendors do same. So lots of gear and even how to employ same. If one is new, (newbie is broad term) I know that a question will get help here. If not new, well, Sandy says it all above. I dig. A beginner question on balancing flash and ambient triggered my re thinking and I got out a 25 year old Minolta IV to re read that manual on mixing measurements. I count that as stimulation that is better than the normal spurs to think a little. Modestly improve the mind as I mentioned above. I guess I agree there is enought residual value that I drop by once a day or so. Which is not so bad. I do wish the programming were more up to snuff of course. If a car goes back to the shop too often, I would consider it a lemon. Would you not? Edited June 16, 2017 by GerrySiegel

[Mark Keefer]

The forums seem to work fine, even posting photos on the forums like No Words, Canon Photo Thursday, Monochrome is ok, I like that you can post a larger photo, the system makes it fit to 1000 pixels wide, but if it is a little bigger and someone clicks the shot it enlarges. But managing my photos and viewing galleries, the response and lag times are brutal. I think that is hurting that side of the site. Just looking at it realistically. People don't have patients like they did in the 56K baud days.

 

Not sure if it is software or hardware that will fix the problems or bigger pipes. What bandwidth do the servers have, is it network switch issues or the bandwidth PN has into their service provider, are they using multiple fiber Metro-E circuits to a major provider and if so how big are the circuits. It is something for their IT network engineers to look at.

 

I don't know if it is so much the layout of the web page as it is lag time and slow response that makes parts of the site appear non-functional. I know in telecom if people order a VOD movie or change a channel, that box better respond quickly or the MSO is going to be flooded with complaints. I realize PN is not a giant telco with the budget and resources of the large players, so it will be interesting to see what they come up with. I am thinking they have some challenges they are dealing with.

 

And it doesn't do the site much good if so many people get a case of the @$$ and throw a hissy fit and quit. But that is their right. Maybe some of the drop off of participation is something else entirely.

 

I'll keep enjoying the forums and see what develops here and do my best to see some of the galleries.

Edited June 27, 2017 by Mark Keefer