Sheesh ... Street Photography is HARD!

[Uhooru]

<p>Laura, just keep at it. If you are struggling with fear, find a couple of friends that want to get into photography. Check out flickr and find people in your area. A small group can be a gas, plus when people see a 2, 3 or 4 photogs shooting, they realize it's an activity, and are less paranoid about it. Make sure you stop for some beers along the way. Sometimes you will need to shoot alone, because of your focus. You will know as you keep doing it what you want to shoot. It all comes from you.</p>

[joshloeser]

<p>I actively prefer to engage people and talk with them. I like portraits most of all, and that's not really possible to do well without a good telephoto unless you're up close. The more you do it, the easier it gets and the more confident you become. People pick up on that and the cycles continues in a good way.</p>

[beligere]

<blockquote>

<p>John C: just swing it around and make a point of intently staring through it at something that is vastly different than the photo you just took, as though that is your intended subject.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Hehe, I do this all the time whenever I'm shooting street subjects. There was one instance where it didn't work for me, and I got a really nasty stare from a lady who saw me taking her picture. This was the picture: <a href="../photo/8463344">http://www.photo.net/photo/8463344</a>. The location wasn't exactly on a street - this is on the Grand Canyon's South Rim!</p>

<p> </p><div></div>

[peteradownunder]

<p>Just figure out what draws you to shooting street and work on that. Show people how you see the world and interact with it in a photographic sense if it turns you on you are on the right track.</p>

[barry_passaris]

<p>Street photography<br />1. small camera +35mm prime<br />2. get up close to your subject and become part of the scene<br />3. don't worry about shooting from the hip...make camera visible. This is an honest approach to photography...that is, honest to your subject..that you are not doing anything inconspicuous.<br />4. By making your intentions clear, as per point 3, you end up with more keepers, as well as less blurred shots.<br />5. I hate to say it, but those Leica rangefinders are perfect for this type of photography...buy used!!</p>

[william l. palminteri]

<blockquote>

<p ><a href="../photodb/user?user_id=1657057"><em>Jeffrey Prokopowicz</em></a><em> </em><a href="../member-status-icons"><em><img title="Subscriber" src="http://static.photo.net/v3graphics/member-status-icons/sub5.gif" alt="" /></em></a><em>, Aug 23, 2009; 06:46 p.m.</em><br>

<em>William, I don't want to go on about this since I was tongue-in-cheek in the first place, and someone on here is sure to get offended, but you're 100% correct about not being able to judge a book by its cover. Where the weightlifting thing shines, however, is because people DO judge a book by its cover, and even if a 150 pound dude could kick anyone's butt, human nature says that someone would be more apt to give a little guy crap before giving lip to a muscle-bound ape, and especially in a spontaneous moment if someone's anger flaired. Anger flairs, they see a little guy, they lash out; anger flairs, they see a muscular ape, they back off. :) Human nature. :)</em><br>

<em></em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>Jeffrey, you're right, it's all tongue-in-cheek, but yes, we'll probably annoy someone if we pursue this.<br>

It's true that size is inimidating, the rare case, as I'm sure you know, is being 6'4", 300 lbs of bulk and being the target for some 'shorty' with something to prove.<br>

Okay, next topic..... :-)</p>

<p>Bill P<em>.</em></p>

[william l. palminteri]

<blockquote>

<p ><a href="../photodb/user?user_id=3887205"><em>Laura Delegal</em></a><em> </em><a href="../member-status-icons"><em><img title="Subscriber" src="http://static.photo.net/v3graphics/member-status-icons/sub2.gif" alt="" /><img title="Frequent poster" src="http://static.photo.net/v3graphics/member-status-icons/3rolls.gif" alt="" /></em></a><em>, Aug 20, 2009; 09:57 p.m.</em><br>

<em>Thanks for all the pointers you gave me a couple of weeks ago. It helped me A LOT, but ... I truly think it takes a person of very special temperment to take street photos. You have to be both bold and patient.</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>Laura, let's add 'prudent' to the list. Years ago I was working on a film project that called for random shots of street ladies (hookers). I found that they are extremely aware of their surroundings, and typically spotted me before I spotted them.<br>

Having a certain street sense myself, I decided that I'd just leave well enough alone.</p>

<p>Homeless people fall into the same category if they're awake. Keep in mind that many homeless people suffer from mental illnesses of some sort.</p>

<p>Bill P.</p>

[Allen Herbert]

<p >“amount to much, investing a lot of time and effort without anything to show for and most important of all entering the comfort zone of others (and consequently your own) is not something everyone is able to get into.”</p>

<p > </p>

<p > </p>

<p >I don’t really think it’s about time and effort more about enjoying what you are doing. The time and effort will follow through in its own natural way much like a river finding its way to the sea…let’s not forget about natural talent and ability; some find it a slog others in comparison easy. The comfort zone of others is more about your own comfort zone and confidence and technique. If you are hovering around looking nervy and edgy your subjects will sense it and feel the same. I suggest you go on u tube and look at the technique of HCB, you will notice he is virtually invisible as opposed to Winogrand who just stood in the middle of the street. It’s about you. </p>

<p ></p>

<p ></p>

<p > </p>

<p >Confidence and technique takes time to master for anyone and initially it’s about pushing your comfort zones and studying technique. Rome was not built in a day. A good place to start is events where photographers are part of the crowd and no one will particularly notice you. </p>

<p > </p>

<p ></p>

<p > </p>

<p >Practice and patience and study the rest will follow on.</p>

[Uhooru]

<p>Very well said Allen, aces.</p>

[brian berry]

<p>I shot first, then introduced myself (in another language) and got some nice, more conscious pictures a few moments later. As you can see, the initial response was not grins. But it was the color I was after, and the ordinariness of waiting on the temple steps for the service to start. There is a little threshold of discomfort for me, every time I go out when it has been awhile. Push through it; don't see yourself as a sneak thief; take the risk and introduce yourself afterwards. Anything can happen. But I have learned a lot of little things to say, and ways to be, that puts people at ease. Practice, practice....</p><div></div>

[brian berry]

<p>I'm glad I have this followup shot, but I like the street shot better.</p><div></div>

[ymmij]

<p>Its a bit easier after a little 'liquid courage'.</p>

[johncrosley]

<p>ON 'LIQUID COURAGE' AND STREET SHOOTING --- Notes on good captures and personal safety<br>

'Liquid Courage' is probably the last thing any 'street' photographer should be using. <br>

Street photography requires as much as anything complete and absolute control over one's equipment, an ability to 'see' relationships that often are lost not only by most people but often by many able photographers, and so an adept and adroit mind and full use of consciousness are required.<br>

Moreover, the street photographer must be able to move on the street, often unobtrusively, and sometimes to wait patiently, and finally, on occasion, to interact not only with 'subjects' but also with others, including authorities.<br>

Being inebriated or even having booze on one's breath is almost certain to defeat most requirements of the street photographer, unless the photographer is so absolutely tied up in his/her own inability to relate or shyness that except for the booze he could not take a photo of a stranger at all, in which case that person should probably rethink whether or not he/she has the emotional or character wherewithal to even consider taking street photographs.<br>

This is not a moral lesson, necessarily. <br>

Drink has its place in many societies. <br>

But when you have one or several thousand dollars worth of equipment around your neck and your ability to take good to wonderful captures depends on your using it correctly and also working your way through crowds, or just 'being there' in an unobtrusive manner, that all militates against the use of 'liquid courage'.<br>

By its nature, imbibing dulls one's sensibilities (even if it frees the libido). <br>

If you need to free your libido enough that drinking is required to take street photos, you probably should review the steps proposed by me and a number of other photographers who posted above -- start at a public events such as parades, fairs, etc., where people expect to be photographed, review your work, find the 'good stuff' in reviewing your work, and see if the 'art' you find there doesn't justify quashing some of your (justified) inhibitions so that you become more comfortable the next time out. <br>

A drunk with a camera is not bound to be a good street photographer, and if you approach anybody, the smell of booze on your breath is apt to be a turnoff for many in Western Society -- in a Muslim Country which absolutely bans use of alcohol, you can only imagine the negative reaction.<br>

Also, you're very likely to be a crime victim if you go some of the very poor places I go, after imbibing -- any sign of impairment and every thief in range will target you and just wait for a chance to roll and rob you. Part of your 'bearing' and steadiness on the street will determine whether or not you are seen as a target or whether you walk around safely.<br>

In Odessa, Ukraine, I once met a big, burly Western member of a much-feared US bike gang,, who was there to visit the country of his ancestors. <br>

He could walk into any US bar and take no prisoners, sober or drunk. But he had been rolled and robbed three times in two weeks and left once for dead at roadside by his taxi driver, because he was impaired from too much drink. <br>

His impairment caused him to be a target. <br>

I never once have had a problem in this same country - I just don't drink there.<br>

I often am offered 'free drinks' by my subjects and even strangers, especially when I photograph in a nation where alcohol is 'common coin' and people drink on the streets - and in such places refusal of a drink offered in friendship can even be considered an 'insult'.<br>

But I always refuse; my safety as a photographer requires I do so, let alone the lost shots I might take if I were sober, which I could not take with even a little alcohol in my system. Alcohol dulls the reflexes needed for street photography as well as kills ambition.<br>

John (Crosley)<br>

© 2009, John Crosley, all rights reserved</p>

[eric_arnold]

<p>i'll agree with you there, john. alcohol isnt necessary for street shooting. the courage comes from being comfortable with asking strangers if you can take their picture. it helps to be able to operate the camera, too.</p><div></div>

[Uhooru]

<p>Crossley, what are you talking about? A set of cautionary tales. Try to use some perspective.</p>

[clive1]

<p>Hear, hear Barry!</p>

<p>Laura: Try to have a camera with you at all times and shoot whatever you're comfortable with. Alternatively, get liquored up, pump weights and take pictures of cats.</p>

[eric_arnold]

<blockquote>

<p>Alternatively, get liquored up, pump weights and take pictures of cats.</p>

 

</blockquote>

<p>best Photo.net advice EVER.</p>

[william l. palminteri]

<blockquote>

<p ><a href="http://www.photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=3670956"><em>Eric Arnold</em></a><em> </em><a href="http://www.photo.net/member-status-icons"><em><img title="Frequent poster" src="http://static.photo.net/v3graphics/member-status-icons/3rolls.gif" alt="" /></em></a><em>, Aug 25, 2009; 03:31 a.m.</em></p>

 

<p><em></em></p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>Alternatively, get liquored up, pump weights and take pictures of cats.</em></p>

</blockquote>

 

<p><em>best Photo.net advice EVER.</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>Eric, it's been my experience with cats that they really don't like people when they're "liquored up".<br>

They will, however, be more than happy do do a "lid" of catnip with you. Whether or not you're muscular seems to have no effect on felines.</p>

<p>Bill P<em>.</em></p>

[william l. palminteri]

<blockquote>

<p ><a href="../photodb/user?user_id=888636"><em>John Crosley</em></a><em> </em><a href="../member-status-icons"><em><img title="Subscriber" src="http://static.photo.net/v3graphics/member-status-icons/sub6.gif" alt="" /><img title="Frequent poster" src="http://static.photo.net/v3graphics/member-status-icons/1roll.gif" alt="" /><img title="Current POW Recipient" src="http://static.photo.net/v3graphics/member-status-icons/trophy.gif" alt="" /></em></a><em>, Aug 24, 2009; 10:22 p.m.</em><br>

<em>ON 'LIQUID COURAGE' AND STREET SHOOTING --- Notes on good captures and personal safety<br />'Liquid Courage' is probably the last thing any 'street' photographer should be using.<br /></em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>John, I've been involved in enough hazardous shoots to tell you that alcohol (or any intoxicant) has no place in anything I do on a professional (or hobby, for that matter) level. For example, I worked on a film once called "Fire".<br>

Need I say more ?</p>

<p>Bill P.<em> </em><em></em></p>

[johncrosley]

<p>Cautionary tales? <br>

Yes, absolutely.<br>

I think with good reason, as I shall attempt to document. <br>

Please read this and the link in its entirety.<br>

I was in the middle of the city referred to in this Wikipedia.org linked article below where 21 serial murders occurred during large parts of the two summer months the murders were occurring two years ago literally right around me. <br>

I was taking photos there day and night -- alone. I was oblivious to the murders, as was the whole city - they were a 'secret' of the government.<br>

I am very well known on sight in that city, and almost certainly I had been seen and would have been recognized by the murderers or their friends, as I was out and about constantly and very visible, a photographer well known on sight to most of the city's residents.<br>

For a very long time, I was an intermittent fixture in that city as I documented city and 'street' life there.<br>

[if in doubt about dates, check the posting dates in my portfolio. <br>

If I had been seen to be impaired, I might not be here now, I honestly believe.<br>

Please follow the attached link, and if it does not embed, please cut and paste it into your browser and read it. <br>

It is from Wikipedia.org. <br>

During much of the time of the 21 serial murders in question, June-July 2007, I was actively photographing in and around the area where these two murderers were bludgeoning their victims to death, videotaping at least one murder <br>

I was simultaneously and casually taking photos day and night, alone, completely unaware of the danger, but following my own 'cautionary rules of street behavior' which I have attempted to share above. My adherence to my rules of street behavior may well have saved my life.<br>

The two serial murderers sometimes killed multiple times a day, preying on those seen as 'vulnerable', and some victims were apparently chosen because they were 'under the influence of alcohol'. Ref. Wikipedia.org.<br>

They also sometimes stole from their victims. Ibid. They were caught when one murderer tried to fence something they stole. Ibid. I was known to almost the whole city of nearly 1 million, as 'the American with the expensive cameras' [my paraphrase]. <br>

Americans in that city are extremely rare, and only one had expensive cameras, and as such I was extraordinarily visible.<br>

I would have been an easy target if I had shown vulnerability, such as having been known to use alcohol on the streets and/or otherwise seen to be 'impaired'.<br>

Word of the murders never appeared in the press until after arrest and confessions, so no special defensive measures could be taken, such as staying indoors. Ibid. One's safety then depended on the 'manner and bearing' of one's 'normal' street behavior, not special precautions, because the murders were kept secret by authorities until after the crimes were solved when arrests were made.<br>

So, yes, I plead extremely culpable to spreading 'cautionary tales'. I am pleased to do so. <br>

I hope all readers here are safer because of it.<br>

It appears retrospectively my life may have been saved by adhering to my own advice which I have passed on above. It is good advice no matter what.<br>

I do have a very good sense of perspective, thank you, in response to the poster, above who told me to 'get a sense of perspective.'<br>

If you read this, perhaps you will understand that my 'sense of perspective' comes from a place of honesty and is well earned from enormous experience, including having been around the world numerous times, from being in war, in riots, in civil disturbances, and in general from being well exposed while taking photos to all sorts of danger.<br>

Whether in Columbia University's student riots, Viet Nam combat (as a photographer), the campus riots of the '60s including People's Park and San Francisco State, and having been in '72 countries, (many of them impoverished), I have learned how to watch my backside, and how to protect myself.<br>

Whether or not I was or was not known to these serial murderers in the city of Dnepropetrovsk, Ukraine, the Wikipedia.org article on them underscores the importance of always projecting strength on the street, and being aware of EVERYTHING that is happening around you as you photograph on the street, lest harm suddenly befall you. <br>

These two guys did kill those they saw as 'vulnerable' -- others were unaware of their murders or their presence.<br>

Letting yourself be seen as impaired which is one form of vulnerability, multiplies your chances of actually encountering harm on the streets.<br>

Here is the link (Wikipedia.org - Dnepropetrovsk maniacs)<br>

<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dnepropetrovsk_maniacs">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dnepropetrovsk_maniacs</a><br>

The 'street' photographer does not always take his/her photos from a place of complete safety. What is seen as 'safe' can sometimes change in minutes or faster.<br>

Remember much photo equipment is expensive, more so in countries where economies are weak and law enforcement weaker.<br>

My (sometimes) travel doctor who is from Brazil, tells me that if I carry just one expensive camera in Rio, I will be murdered for it (not 'might', but 'will') He is Brazilian and travels there frequently. I also have been to Brazil but not while photographing, and agree absolutely. I had my own encounter in Rio with a resident thief from the infamous 'City of God' which now has been portrayed in a movie of the same name 'City of God'. Watch it to understand about danger.<br>

As I wrote above, one's 'manner and bearing' on the street can help ward off trouble.<br>

Whether it's a mass (serial) murderer (as referred to above), or a thief of opportunity, if you project weakness on the street, you are offering yourself as a target for someone intent on doing no good. <br>

Most wrongdoers are essentially cowards and are deterred if they detect difficulty in accomplishing their goal.<br>

No place is totally safe.<br>

I have watched people be robbed in Paris outside a fancy restaurant in which I was eating (and no way to warn them - no nearby doorway and glass too thick to carry a tapped message).<br>

I have some substantial experience that is unique among most members, and am pleased to pass it along.<br>

I once was shot while on my way to take 'street' photos.<br>

I almost lost my leg from that wound, taken as I went to riots following the assassination of Dr. Martin Luther King. I was later released from hospital to police in a city along my route, and was driven by cops from the hospital through a forming riot, and later the new rioters stormed the police station with me and only two cops inside -- two rioters were killed that night.<br>

Several months later, recovered, and having gone to Viet Nam with a camera I was medivaced from Viet Nam's combat area with a bullet wound.<br>

Taking 'street' photographs means respecting your own safety.<br>

Photo awards don't mean much if they're posthumous.<br>

Be safe as you try to take your great street (and documentary) photos.<br>

I write from experience.<br>

Cautionary tales: Absolutely.<br>

John (Crosley)</p>

[clive1]

<blockquote>

<p>I was known to almost the whole city of nearly 1 million, as 'the American with the expensive cameras' [my paraphrase]. (JC)</p>

</blockquote>

<p>I find that very difficult to believe. Even if you appeared on local TV, radio and in print media regularly, it would be highly unlikely that almost 1 million people, in a city of almost 1 million, were familiar with you and your camera collection. Surely this is an exaggeration.</p>

[william l. palminteri]

<blockquote>

<p><em>Cautionary tales: Absolutely.<br />John (Crosley)</em><br>

<em></em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>You bet, John.</p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>Please read this and the link in its entirety</em>.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Did you read the article in its entirety ?<br>

No ? Go back and do it now.<br>

Seriously.<br>

This is one of the most sobering articles I've ever read. I can only guess at some of the bullets I've dodged doing "Street" photography.<br>

John, thanks for taking the time to write and post it.</p>

<p>Bill P.</p>

[tonmestrom]

<blockquote>

<p>The 'street' photographer does not always take his/her photos from a place of complete safety. What is seen as 'safe' can sometimes change in minutes or faster.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>That for the most part is a matter of choice. Despite all the horror stories to the contrary it seems to me that most street photographers have the good sense to stay out of trouble because they use their common sense. If you want to get into trouble it's not very hard but only a fool will go looking for it. I'm in Paris quite a lot and yes, people get robbed there but that happens in every major city. Often though this happens because people get careless. Pickpockets as well you can find everywhere.</p>

<p>I've shot in the banlieus where about two years ago there were a lot of riots. I haven't been there since because why go looking for trouble. I got scared shitless only once and it was all because I went somewhere to shoot where I shouldn't have been in the first place. My own fault, nobody elses and no reason whatsoever to scare other people away from shooting out on the street. Because if you keep your eyes open and use your common sense your not likely to get into trouble.</p>

<p>I sometimes shoot in a neighborhood just across our border that is known as a high crime area, nothing like the ganginfested neighborhoods like you in the States seem to have but still. It's a multicultural neighborhood and especially most of the young Arabs there don't like to be photographed (some of them are illegal which might have something to do with it as well). At one time one of them ran up to me pretty pissed because he thought I had taken his photo. It all ended with me having a nice chat and a good laugh with him and his friend. Respect works both ways and in all my years out there I've never gotten into trouble so far.</p>

<p>Better than scaring people it would be much more appropiate to tell them how much fun it is out there, because, truth be told, it is.</p>

<p> </p>

[william l. palminteri]

<blockquote>

<p ><a href="../photodb/user?user_id=3937630"><em>Ton Mestrom</em></a><em> </em><a href="../member-status-icons"><em><img title="Frequent poster" src="http://static.photo.net/v3graphics/member-status-icons/3rolls.gif" alt="" /></em></a><em>, Aug 25, 2009; 06:47 a.m.</em></p>

 

<p><em></em></p>

 

<p><em>I sometimes shoot in a neighborhood just across our border that is known as a high crime area, nothing like the ganginfested neighborhoods like you in the States seem to have but still....</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>My goodness, Ton, is THAT your impression of us here in the U.S of A.?<br>

It's sad that the news media, etc. gives the world that impression. <br>

Come visit us sometime, and I'll show you around.<br>

Midtown Manhattan is a riot, and Times Square at night is like being inside a giant pinball machine!<br>

Downtown is a shooter's paradise ! <br>

Here's an example..... <br>

Bill P.</p><div></div>

[Brad_]

>>> My goodness, Ton, is THAT your impression of us here in the U.S of A.?

It's sad that the news media, etc. gives the world that impression.

 

Where did he say the entire US is like that? There are neighborhoods I would be very careful in. And that's not an

impression from the news media.

 

 

>>> If you read this, perhaps you will understand that my 'sense of perspective'

 

If, indeed... John, without breaks, who would want to read your monster paragraphs? BTW, your last one is missing your

copyright claim. Maybe the mod can fix that for you. :)