'the paradox of negative emotion'

[inoneeye]

I am nearing the end of a long project. I have spent the last 13 months printing 11 portfolios of my photographs. The editing process has been a challenge and enlightening for me. as in "gesture and emotion". It has also brought a question to the forefront. One that has surfaced many times often triggered by responses from viewers over the years and one that i have never put out of my mind. In fact i probably have not ever settled on how to phrase it 'properly'. Why do I enjoy strong negative emotion in my photos. So let me phrase it as I stated it on google...  "taking comfort in negative emotion in creativity and art"
I found myself going down a rabbit hole, 

Aristotle said we don’t like to look at painful things in life but get pleasure from seeing these things in art. - (no doubt there is a context that I only skimmed and chose not to look into yet, that may be significant)

But I found many quotes and a lot of research supporting this from numerous sources. It's safe, it' cathartic, it's emotionally engaging, it's something we can empathize with... yada. And of course whether a photo brings positive or negative feelings is subjective, in affect and in degree.
A strong negative emotional response works on me. That paradoxical enjoyment of negative emotion is not for everyone but I like to tap into the feelings i get from a sad song, a dark poem, a photo of grief or sadness, .... i find a negative narrative in photography can be comforting and rewarding. it touches me emotionally and it is a rich and textured resource.

Edited January 27 by inoneeye

[samstevens]

My initial response has to do with risk. I think there’s a risk in using, exploring, and participating in dark or negative emotions. Not unlike athletes or adventurers who take risks, I think there can be an adrenaline rush or endorphin hit from this. 
 

Similar to but also different from risk is challenge. Beauty is often conflated with pretty. To find a deeper sense of “the beautiful” in pain, in ugliness, in our darker sides, requires something different from finding what pleases most in a sunrise or an eye-popping landscape.
 

Challenge can become provocation, which may just be a darker side of inspiration.

[Sanford]

11 hours ago, inoneeye said:

I am nearing the end of a long project. I have spent the last 13 months printing 11 portfolios of my photographs. The editing process has been a challenge and enlightening for me. as in "gesture and emotion". It has also brought a question to the forefront. One that has surfaced many times often triggered by responses from viewers over the years and one that i have never put out of my mind. In fact i probably have not ever settled on how to phrase it 'properly'. Why do I enjoy strong negative emotion in my photos. So let me phrase it as I stated it on google...  "taking comfort in negative emotion in creativity and art"
I found myself going down a rabbit hole, 

Aristotle said we don’t like to look at painful things in life but get pleasure from seeing these things in art. - (no doubt there is a context that I only skimmed and chose not to look into yet, that may be significant)

But I found many quotes and a lot of research supporting this from numerous sources. It's safe, it' cathartic, it's emotionally engaging, it's something we can empathize with... yada. And of course whether a photo brings positive or negative feelings is subjective, in affect and in degree.
A strong negative emotional response works on me. That paradoxical enjoyment of negative emotion is not for everyone but I like to tap into the feelings i get from a sad song, a dark poem, a photo of grief or sadness, .... i find a negative narrative in photography can be comforting and rewarding. it touches me emotionally and it is a rich and textured resource.

Would like to see some samples.

[ericphelps]

Those darker emotional responses are more complex, drawing from more areas of our experiences. I enjoy a photo of bunnies cavorting in sunny flowering clover, but cherish a photo that can make me choke up a bit, like David Bowie,  Ain't there one damn song that can make me
Break down and cry?

[inoneeye]

15 hours ago, samstevens said:

My initial response has to do with risk. I think there’s a risk in using, exploring, and participating in dark or negative emotions. Not unlike athletes or adventurers who take risks, I think there can be an adrenaline rush or endorphin hit from this. 

👍
Risk had not occurred to me. It doesn’t generally feel like any risk for me (beyond the occasional situation and subject) I find that exploring and reflecting on negative emotions to be comforting, cathartic, feel-good. It often Is provocative but most satisfying for me as a viewer, evocative.

The challenge I often have in my sights instinctually when I am shooting is capturing the beauty of imperfection.s that are all around us. Wabi-sabi. Aesthetically but also emotionally. This often means that I try to take negative emotions and play them with an optimistic attitude and mindset.

Edited January 27 by inoneeye

[inoneeye]

@ericphelps

There is a crack in everything, that's how the light gets in  - L.Cohen

@Sanford

samples … I would prefer not to post my examples at this time. I have a habit of using myself when I post in this forum. Often I see it not as a strength but as a distraction in this context. Even though this topic was born in self reflection it interests me more as a general curiosity. I found that in all art forms there was an abundance of negatively charged art. There are powerful examples everywhere …. Literature, music, film, flat art. 

[samstevens]

2 hours ago, inoneeye said:

It doesn’t generally feel like any risk for me (beyond the occasional situation and subject) I find that exploring and reflecting on negative emotions to be comforting, cathartic, feel-good.

Thanks. Interesting. I get that. Perhaps not related to you but, more generally, I wonder if risk can be comforting and cathartic for some. Maybe not as much comforting as comfortable?

[inoneeye]

good distinction. Yeah, i suppose if it was not comfortable it would be a risk to explore those emotions. 

[samstevens]

Probably the idea of risk reflects more about me. I find it risky to explore what might be considered my own dark side or negative emotions as well as to express them. So, when I see darker emotions portrayed, I do tend to think of risk.

In terms of the comfort of negative emotions, I'm taken back to losing parents. The grief is somewhat overwhelming and, of course, in the immediate aftermath changes shape a lot but is pretty much a constant. With both parents, in time, as I began to let go of the grief, I also felt myself wanting to hold onto it, cling to it, actually taking comfort in it because it became a kind of companion to walk with through the darkness ...

 

[Wayne Melia]

Nope. No tolerance for people vomiting their angst.

[inoneeye]

13 hours ago, Wayne Melia said:

Nope. No tolerance for people vomiting their angst.

Irony and hypocrisy with a visual reference. very succinct.
angst is a good example of a negative emotion, comes in many forms but usually is expressed with the eyes. 

 

 

Edited January 28 by inoneeye

[Allen Herbert]

"angst is a good example of a negative emotion" 

Really.

It has its place among human emotions. We are not yet machine intelligence,

yet.

[Allen Herbert]

Little girl photos, from a distance ,out of focus.

What does that tell you about the Photographer?

Anyway, not a little girl, from a distance out of focus.

Just a old lady trying to find her way.

 

 

[Allen Herbert]

I am a Photographer.

I take Photographs.

[inoneeye]

.

[samstevens]

In addition to paradoxes, double entendres have a place in photography!

Nicely visualized.

[Supriyo]

Visiting these forums after a very long time... Nice to see all the familiar faces still here.

I feel, there's a (sometimes big) difference in wading in one's own negative emotions vs experiencing them in a picture. It's somewhat like enjoying a dark rainy day vs being outside in one.

One reason, negative emotion in a photo is more appealing than lighter or happier themes is, we tend to perceive negative emotions as more authentic. Sadness or anger or frustration feels like more unfiltered compared to happy scenes (e.g everyone smiling for the shutter). These are my own thoughts though, so perhaps a bit subjective in their scope.

Edited February 14 by Supriyo

[samstevens]

14 hours ago, Supriyo said:

I feel, there's a (sometimes big) difference in wading in one's own negative emotions vs experiencing them in a picture. It's somewhat like enjoying a dark rainy day vs being outside in one.

@Supriyo I agree with this as far as it goes.

I also see a suggestion of something additional in inoneeye's OP. That's the implication that one's own negative emotions may be part of what inspires or what gets put into one's own photos. So, yes, for the viewer, it would be "experiencing them in a picture." But I think for a photographer, there can be an active and proactive involvement of the negative emotions ... creating with those emotions being a substantive part of the photographic project. In that way, I might see it less as the difference between experiencing rainy weather from inside vs. outside and more as using the internalization of rainy weather to externalize it through photographic expression.

[samstevens]

An additional thought.

Looking at an effective picture of a rainy day or something with negative emotions can be more than simply a representation or depiction. So it doesn't necessarily have to be like looking at the rain outside when you're safely inside. With a good photograph, the photograph is the experience. It's not just a representation of an experience. That connection to a photograph and to any art means less distance and less distinction between picture and reality. A photograph is a reality in and of itself and can be experienced as such.

[inoneeye]

24 minutes ago, samstevens said:

With a good photograph, the photograph is the experience.

🥂

[PapaTango]

I am not a forensic photographer, a horrific AI robot, or related to anyone named Eggelston.  I am a social actor manifesting personal agency in my decision to press the shutter button.  My decision cannot escape who I am in my real self. I suppose that makes me somewhat of a determinist.  I also suffer from indeterminacy, but that is far outside the scope of this thread...  🤔

Unless you are a blind photographer randomly snapping images, you bring an agenda.  But wait, even that starts with an agenda and action plan.  I understand this to be true because I know two of them...

If anyone thinks for a moment that they can detach themselves from who they are (conscious and unconscious) and then either create an image--or even more so attempt to curate and promote a collection--then they are deluding themselves.

One of the biggest reasons I departed from the local arts scene several years ago has been due to the imperative that for work to be relevant, it must be always be engendered somehow.  So trendy, and so wrong...

A collection tells us as much about the photographer as it does the subject.  🐒

Positive, negative, soothing, disjointing--it all depends on how each of us sees the world and the individual elements thereof.  We will leave repressed longings, trauma, and aspirations to another thread...  😎

Edited February 14 by PapaTango

[inoneeye]

 

3 hours ago, PapaTango said:

One of the biggest reasons I departed from the local arts scene several years ago has been due to the imperative that for work to be relevant, it must be always be engendered somehow.  So trendy, and so wrong...

wow that is unfortunate PT. Lucky for me i have never had to pay any heed to trends let alone imperatives! Not really catching the meaning of the escaping, detaching reference unless it simply means as you suggest that we reveal ourselves in our work and viewing? If so i concur but also believe that we can step outside our 'agenda' and offer and or perceive with a degree of subjectivety. and even respond with raw emotion lacking any apparent reasoning. - "A collection tells us as much about the photographer as it does the subject." Pretty much the way of all mediums. Usually a good thing, it feels genuine imo. But especially rewarding if it reveals something of me the viewer. which i think is often the case in the work i respond to most.

[PapaTango]

Josh, that is your imperative and I respect that.  Casting about the years of my life there are many lost dreams, closeted aspirations, and wishes.  For all too long I made images that I felt were appealing and signaled some 'universal' semaphores that could be accepted by a broader audience.  After 55+ years of photography, I pronounce this strategy a resounding failure.  I also made images that were not so much that.  The latter are not public, and possibly will never be.  It's hard to make Arbus blush...  🤔

An important photographer once told me that my output was "corporate art" and as such I should pursue the market of commercial interior design decoration.  Perhaps I should have, as my personal wealth in my senior days would be much better.  Although all of us are economic prostitutes to some major degree--I reject the premise that the worth of my work is as a faceless corporate interior design whore.

What's real is in the seemingly random and unrecognized stream of rubbish that I produce and post.  Do you see it?  

Edited February 15 by PapaTango
My cat suggested it

[inoneeye]

20 hours ago, PapaTango said:

The latter are not public, and possibly will never be.  It's hard to make Arbus blush...

Well I am intrigued 🤔
Arbus is a standout for the this topic. 

[AlanKlein]

When I shoot landscapes, I tend to seek beautiful light and subjects, although dark gray pictures have their own appeal.  Of course, negative emotions seem more applicable to street photography and photojournalism where you're telling a story.