Nikon Z equipment question: What are you guys using (or recommend) for wildlife photography now?

Mary Doo · October 14, 2023

Nikon has so many new products now and find it challenging to stay updated with all the changes. Could you please share your insights and recommendations regarding the ideal setup, along with your personal comments? What are you using or what you wish you are using, etc.? Thanks.

Mary Doo · October 14, 2023

In my recent Kenya safari, in our group of 11 wildlife photographers (including the group leader):

5 used Nikon Z - most had the 70-200 and 400 f/2.8 lens, I think
1 Nikon DSLR, 600mm
1 Canon with 100-500 and 600 (not sure)
2 Sony, with 70-200 and 400 f/2.8
2 Olympus M43 - this group included me - 40-150 and 150-400.

I could carry 3 Olympus camera bodies and the lenses in one camera bag, whereas just about everyone else had to carry their long lens separately.

Frequently, I found myself utilizing the maximum focal length of my 150-400 lens, equivalent to 800mm in full frame mode. Nevertheless, I must acknowledge the exquisite bokeh produced by Nikon and Sony's 400mm f/2.8 lenses. So sometimes I wondered if I should have used Nikon.

There are so many pros and cons to consider.

Mary Doo · October 14, 2023

2 minutes ago, Mary Doo said:

2 Sony, with 70-200 and 400 f/2.8

Or may be 70-200 and 200-600

joseph_smith3 · October 15, 2023

Hi Mary,

You are right that Nikon shooters have a lot of equipment choices to make especially since there are three Nikon Z mount lenses that allow you to reach 600mm without the use of a teleconverter. This and related topics has received considerable discussion on another site, Backcountry Forums.

Here s what I have done to date and what I might do if I had the funds to start all over again.

What I now use: Nikon Z9, Nikon D500 and Nikon D850. For the Z9, I got the 100-400mm S lens and its matching 1.4x tc. I did not buy a Z mount 70-200mm as I felt the 100-400mm covered that focal range. For longer reach on the Z9 I use my F mount Nikon 500mm f5.6 pf both with and without the F mount 1.4xtc. I also have the Z mount 24-120mm f4 lens for general purpose photos. And I use all three of my nikon F mount macro lenses with the adapter.

My D 500 and D 850 are my backup/additional cameras. These can use the 500mm pf or my 300mm pf or my 300mm f2.8 and my 70-200mm f4.

If I were starting from scratch, and flush with $$$, I would have to cameras, a Z9 and a Z8 or two Z9s. My lenses would all be Z mount: NIKKOR Z 400mm f/4.5 VR S, 600mm pf nd 800mm pf. And the 100-400mm zoom. And the matching 1.4x tc. If I needed a 70-200mm, I would likely get the 70-180mmNIKKOR Z 70-180mm f/2.8.

OR the Z180-600mm zoom and the Z mount 400mm f4.5, especially if I were a safari shooter, hiker, etc. And maybe the 600mm pf too.

I will likely buy the new Nikon 600mm pf lens. When I do this I might sell all of my F mount.

If I had to go small and light, then two Olympus bodies with the OM SYSTEM M. Zuiko 150-400mm f/4.5 TC 1.25 IS PRO Lens as my main tele lens supported by smaller lenses.

Dieter Schaefer · October 16, 2023

On 10/14/2023 at 6:00 PM, Mary Doo said:

Frequently, I found myself utilizing the maximum focal length of my 150-400 lens, equivalent to 800mm in full frame mode. Nevertheless, I must acknowledge the exquisite bokeh produced by Nikon and Sony's 400mm f/2.8 lenses.

Wouldn't that leave you short on reach?

My situation is a bit similar to joseph_smith3: I have a Z9, D850, and D500 - though the latter two haven't been used since I got the Z9. I no longer use the 200-500; it has been replaced by the 500PF for many years now. On the Z9, I can use it with the TC-14EIII - that had been a rather futile undertaking most of the time on the D850 and D500 because AF performance degraded too much. Both the 70-200/4 and the 300PF see the occasional use, as does the AF-S 80-400. My new (since earlier this year) workhorse is the 800PF, sometimes even with the 1.4x TC. I have no plans to get either the 100-400, 400/4.5, 600PF, or the 180-600. I am glad Nikon released the 600PF after the 800PF - otherwise I might have fallen into the trap of getting the 600 instead of the 800. The 400/2.8 TC and the 600/4 TC are not even on my radar screen; they are far out of what I am willing to spend. I do see myself getting rid of the D850 and D500 at some point and replace them with a Z9 (or likely, its successor).

Now, if I were to start fresh with lenses, it would be a tough choice. I would not get any of the F-mount lenses - and the first choice would be between the 400/4.5 and the 100-400. Not much of a fan of zooms in this focal length range anymore - so the logical choice would be the 400/4.5. The only thing that speaks for the 100-400 is its close-up capability - not sure it would win me over though. I would still get the 800PF - which kind of eliminates the need to have the 600PF or 180-600. Though that leaves me with a rather large gap between 400 and 800 - probably closed by adding the 1.4x behind the 400mm lens. But likely be eyeing a 600PF if it turns out that I need that gap closed with a better performer.

I need to add that I have the 100-400mm range covered within my Sony system.

Edited October 16, 2023 by Dieter Schaefer

Mary Doo · October 16, 2023

22 hours ago, joseph_smith3 said:

If I were starting from scratch, and flush with $$$, I would have to cameras, a Z9 and a Z8 or two Z9s. My lenses would all be Z mount: NIKKOR Z 400mm f/4.5 VR S, 600mm pf nd 800mm pf. And the 100-400mm zoom. And the matching 1.4x tc. If I needed a 70-200mm, I would likely get the 70-180mmNIKKOR Z 70-180mm f/2.8.

OR the Z180-600mm zoom and the Z mount 400mm f4.5, especially if I were a safari shooter, hiker, etc. And maybe the 600mm pf too.

I will likely buy the new Nikon 600mm pf lens. When I do this I might sell all of my F mount.

33 minutes ago, Dieter Schaefer said:

Now, if I were to start fresh with lenses, it would be a tough choice. I would not get any of the F-mount lenses - and the first choice would be between the 400/4.5 and the 100-400. Not much of a fan of zooms in this focal length range anymore - so the logical choice would be the 400/4.5. The only thing that speaks for the 100-400 is its close-up capability - not sure it would win me over though. I would still get the 800PF - which kind of eliminates the need to have the 600PF or 180-600. Though that leaves me with a rather large gap between 400 and 800 - probably closed by adding the 1.4x behind the 400mm lens. But likely be eyeing a 600PF if it turns out that I need that gap closed with a better performer.

I need to add that I have the 100-400mm range covered within my Sony system.

Nikon has made impressive strides. Thank you both for telling me what you use and hope for, and helping me get up to speed with Nikon. The 100-400 and 400 f/4.5 are appealing. The 180-600, 600mm and 800mm PFs look interesting. However, the F-stops seem high. (?)

22 hours ago, joseph_smith3 said:

If I had to go small and light, then two Olympus bodies with the OM SYSTEM M. Zuiko 150-400mm f/4.5 TC 1.25 IS PRO Lens as my main tele lens supported by smaller lenses.

This is what I use now - a fantastic lens. I'm still in the process of familiarizing myself with the entire system. While the new OM-1 model enjoys many impressive features, I've noticed that, on average, my images seem to exhibit more noise compared to those in my Nikon past. Please note, though, that I disabled noise reduction during my recent trip to Kenya (my testing ground), following the advice of some "experts". However, I've since come across conflicting opinions from other "experts" regarding this practice. I also came across the frightening experience of having both of my OM-1 units not responding to fresh batteries., Thankfully this issue resolved itself after one day (still not sure what the problem was). Hence, I am wondering if I made the right decision and would like to know what Nikon is up to now.

That said, I am still waiting, I think.

Edited October 16, 2023 by Mary Doo

ShunCheung · October 16, 2023

On 10/14/2023 at 3:00 PM, Mary Doo said:

In my recent Kenya safari, in our group of 11 wildlife photographers (including the group leader):

5 used Nikon Z - most had the 70-200 and 400 f/2.8 lens, I think

1 Nikon DSLR, 600mm

1 Canon with 100-500 and 600 (not sure)

2 Sony, with 70-200 and 400 f/2.8

2 Olympus M43 - this group included me - 40-150 and 150-400.

I could carry 3 Olympus camera bodies and the lenses in one camera bag, whereas just about everyone else had to carry their long lens separately.

Frequently, I found myself utilizing the maximum focal length of my 150-400 lens, equivalent to 800mm in full frame mode. Nevertheless, I must acknowledge the exquisite bokeh produced by Nikon and Sony's 400mm f/2.8 lenses. So sometimes I wondered if I should have used Nikon.

There are so many pros and cons to consider.

Of course this is merely one data point from one small group of safari photographers, but I am quite surprised by the camera brand/camera mount distribution among 11 photographers. Did some of those 5 Nikon Z users know one another before the trip and decided to travel together? Otherwise, at this point, October 2023, I would expect more Canon and Sony mirrorless users, and the very few DSLR users is pretty much expected. Or perhaps Nikon has indeed make major inroads into wildlife photographers in the last two years.

Today is 16 October 2023. As of two years ago, i.e. 16 October 2021, Nikon had exactly zero Z-mount lens longer than 200mm. Back then, the longest were the 70-200/2.8 and 24-200. Since then, Nikon have introduced (and I am color coding entries from different calendar years):

2021 October 28: 100-400mm/f4.5-5.6 VR S, along with the Z9 and 24-120mm/f4 S
2022 January 19: 400mm/f2.8 TC VR S
2022 April 6: 800mm/f6.3 PF VR S
2022 June 29: 400mm/f4.5 VR S, i.e. merely 5 months since the introduction of the 400mm/f2.8, and the compact and light-weight f4.5 is not a PF lens.
2022 November 2: 600mm/f4 TC VR S
2023 June 21: 180-600mm/f5.6-6.3 VR, this is the only non-S-class lens among these announcements
2023 October 11: 600mm/f6.3 PF VR S, 11 months since the 600mm/f4 announcement

Additionally, Nikon also introduced the Z8 on 10 May 2023, and it is more or less a "baby Z9" so that for those who would rather not carry a big and heavy pro Z9, there is now another option for camera bodies.

Those super teles with built-in TC are unmatched by other mirrorless mounts. Only Canon has an EF 200-400mm/f4 with 1.4x TC for their DSLRs. And Nikon's PF lenses, including the F-mount 500mm/f5.6 AF-S VR, are also unmatched; only Canon has two versions of the 400mm/f4 DO for the EF mount, but even the newer, 2nd version is quite dated by now.

So yes, Nikon Z is now a great choice for wildlife photography. I currently have lenses #1, 3, and 4 above plus many F-mount lenses. Cost aside, there is simply no way I can carry so many lenses. And Thom Hogan has a recent article on Z super tele choices: https://www.zsystemuser.com/nikon-z-system-news-and/telephoto-today.html

Incidentally, Tamron has also recently announced a Z-mount 150-500mm/f5-6.7 lens. It is a Tamron, not a Nikkor, but it is another Z-mount super telephoto lens: https://www.tamron.com/global/consumer/news/detail/a057z_20231010.html

thom_hogan · October 16, 2023

Noise and reach are tricky subjects.

Noise: the 4:3 versus 3:2 aspect ratio gets in the way of a clear comparison. But let's say that I cropped to 16:9 on both an m4/3 and FX camera: it's about a two stop differential in noise production because you're outputting at the same size, but you have a bigger capture area (more photons captured, all else equal). With DX versus m4/3 we're close to a stop differential.

Another problem with the "noise" discussions is that they rarely talk about what the dynamic range in the scene is. For a lot of wildlife scenarios (but not all, obviously), we don't need a huge amount of dynamic range, so noise discussions aren't very useful if you're maximizing dynamic range in your exposure. The exception tends to be white bird in sunlight.

Reach: you're at 20mp m4/3 and 800mm. The Z8 with the 180-600mm mounted is at 45mp and 600mm, or effectively 19mp at 900mm when you flip to DX image area. It used to be with the Olympus bodies/lenses, you could build a smaller, lighter kit with considerable reach. With Nikon's recent lighter lens offerings, that's not so clear cut any more, at least if you're comparing what you get at ~20mp. As I noted on my site recently, I just had a full safari kit in a 19L bag with room to spare (two Z8's, 70-180mm f/2.8, 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3). Travels light and compact and takes fine images. I'll be firing up a (delayed) daily blog on that trip soon.

Dieter Schaefer · October 16, 2023

45 minutes ago, ShunCheung said:

there is simply no way I can carry so many lenses

Indeed that is a major issue. My largest bag is a ThinkTank Harddrive - and it is filled to capacity with the 500PF (with FTZII), TC-14EIII, Z1.4xTC, Z9 with 800 PF attached, spare Z9 battery, card wallet. I could possibly manage to squeeze the 300PF in there but it'll be tight. Before I owned the 800PF, that backpack held the 500PF attached to the Z9, the 300PF attached to the D850, TC-14EIII, spare batteries for the D850 and Z9, card wallet. And still had space for one more lens - like the F-mount Tamron 35-150/2.8-4 or the Z-mount 24-70/4. Travel with the 800PF will be tough as I will have to limit my choices. The same would apply to the 400/2.8 or 600/4 I suppose.

I can't say what I would pack for a Safari trip. I definitely would want two camera bodies and would like to keep lens changes to an absolute minimum. Probably the D850 with the 35-150/2.8-4 and the Z9 with the 180-600.

ShunCheung · October 16, 2023

Yesterday I visited a friend and tried his Z8 + 180-600mm zoom, and that combo is quite heavy to hand hold in front of me for an extended period. The 180-600 is 2140 grams, which is ~90% of the 800mm PF's 2385 grams. I frequently use the Z9 + 800 PF hand held, but I typically put that down after a short while.

For international trips to remote areas, I typically take three camera bodies and some backup lenses. I think the new 600mm PF would be a good choice in conjunction with the 100-400. I would probably take another tele and some mid/wide zoom. Since one usually shoots from the hatch of a vehicle on beanbags, weight for hand holding is not a big issue, but you still need to carry such weight through airports, etc.

joseph_smith3 · October 16, 2023

Mary and others, here is some additional info on the 100-400mm S based on my use of it on my Z9. While I prefer wide apertures, for background control, I have found that f6.3, f7.1, f8 at 400mm render backgrounds better than I had expected. I do not like the cheap lens hood on the 100-400mm. If you are thinking of buying it, rent it and try it out especially to see how if renders backgrounds. It is my first tele zoom as I prefer prime lenses for long tele work.

ShunCheung · October 16, 2023

Any 100-400mm type zoom is going to be max f5.6 on the long end; some are even slower, e.g. Canon's RF mirrorless 100-400 is an f5.6-f8 @ $600. Otherwise, e.g. Nikon has an F-mount 180-400mm/f4 with 1.4x TC built in, but that is a much larger, far more expensive, $12K lens. And I used to have the 200-400mm/f4 AF-S VR that was $5K to 6K.

The 100-400 (and I also have the F-mount 80-400mm/f4.5-5.6 that I previously used a lot) is my favorite lens for whale watching and Antarctic trips where I do a lot of photography from Zodiac landing boats. It should also be very good for African safaris as a second tele, in addition to some 500mm or 600mm lens.

Here is a picture I took on the South Georgia Island last year, in the Antarctic. When the subjects are multiple animals, I typically close down a bit to gain depth of field.

joseph_smith3 · October 16, 2023

Mary and others, I am attaching five images I took on Saturday at Houston Audubon Raptor Center on a very bright sunny morning. In general backgrounds are close and busy, not the best especially when the sun is out.

Three of the images of the broadwinged hawk were taken at roughly the same position. The focal length changed and maybe the f stop too. 400mm, 220mm, 240. f5.6, f5, f5

The image of the kite was taken at f9 at 400mm. I was pretty close to him.

The red-tailed hawk had a bright and busy background. 290mm at f6.3

Background rendering with this lens (and maybe any zoom) is very sensitive to how close you are to the subject and how far away the background is.

All taken with a Z9, 100-400mm S, Bird detection, wide large, AF-C, Continuous Low in bursts. Auto ISO with Manual shutter speed at 1/320. All taken with a monopod with a wimberley monopod head. No processing or cropping. Jpegs made in DXO PL 6.10. Fstop and focal length used appears at the beginning of each file name.

Edited October 16, 2023 by joseph_smith3
added shooting data

Mary Doo · October 16, 2023

4 hours ago, ShunCheung said:

I am quite surprised by the camera brand/camera mount distribution among 11 photographers. Did some of those 5 Nikon Z users know one another before the trip and decided to travel together?

Not to my knowledge. Federico Veronesi, the group leader has always used Nikon. Currently he uses the D850 and Z8, He had always recommended the 400mm. Co-leader Melissa Groo uses Sony.

Sandy Vongries · October 17, 2023

Haven't got my Z yet, but my oldest friend says that the FTZ II is an invisible factor in terms of performance and the 200-500 works very well. My Z f should be here tomorrow and I'll find out. Hasn't been much near, but there are Elk I have yet to spot in my area. Note: Nikon is offering a 30 day free trial on the Zfc if that floats your boat.

Sandy Vongries · October 19, 2023

Got the camera late this afternoon, set up and running. Haven't used the FTZ yet, just the 40/2. Almost too easy. I will see if I can get some 200-500 samples posted tomorrow.

tcyin · October 19, 2023

I'm a heretic. I travel light. One Sony RX10iv with no need for additional lenses. So convenient and easy. I just returned from my first trip to Africa and have posted photos and travelogue on

www.neurotraveler.com

Have a look please.

Sandy Vongries · October 19, 2023