Tony Rowlett Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 You happen upon or contrive a scene and you make a photograph. Then you start a rescue operation. Maybe you start by rescuing a fleeting moment from your reactions to a scene. You then rescue a photograph from a mix mash of elements and background that hinder the real essence of it. Rescue it from a machine and a memory card or a backup disc. Rescue it from a bath of chemicals and acids and continuous agitation. Rescue it from a curtain rod. Rescue it from an ink jet printer. Rescue the One from a group of its inferiors. Rescue it from deterioration or grubby hands or loss. The photograph was conceived and has lived in multiple wombs and it is finally born into an object in and of itself. 1 Backups? We don’t need no stinking ba #.’ _ , J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Vongries Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 Disagree. Film or digital, done competently, simply a moment captured for as near forever as the internet can guarantee. Note: as a member. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samstevens Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 On 11/9/2022 at 6:20 PM, Tony Rowlett said: The photograph was conceived and has lived in multiple wombs and it is finally born into an object in and of itself. I like your metaphor of rescue. Not how I would generally describe the process but, nevertheless, a thoughtful way of looking at it. The quibble I have is with the above. Don’t see how the womb metaphor fits, since I never thought of a baby as being rescued from a womb. Rescue implies some sort of danger or threat to be rescued from. Can you say a little more about that quality related to a photo? Why rescue the photo from the elements and background as opposed to, say, isolate it? It seems like rescue gives the process an edge. Would be interesting to hear more about that. "You talkin' to me?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanford Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 More like "rehab". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemorrellNL Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 @Tony Rowlett Interesting point and a fascinating way of expressing it! I really like your metaphor: "The photograph was conceived and has lived in multiple wombs and it is finally born into an object in and of itself." ! I fully agree with your description of 'the processes'. Applying them to myself, I prefer to use terms such as 'selection' and 'creation' (of the One) rather than 'rescue'. But 'restoration' or 'rescue' are equally applicable in the case of grubby hands, deterioration or loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemorrellNL Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 (edited) On 11/10/2022 at 3:25 AM, Sandy Vongries said: Disagree. Film or digital, done competently, simply a moment captured for as near forever as the internet can guarantee. Note: as a member. There are many people who completely agree with your assertion, Sandy. And if this is your choice for your own photos, then that's fine by me. As a comment on all photography, I do think that your view is rather limited. I found this (historical/philosophical) 20 min. video on 'photo-editing' by UK photographer Sean Tucker interesting. Especially the examples he gives (within the first 5 minutes) of 'photos' published by Fan Ho and Ansel Adams. Yes, these are based on 'captured moments' but also heavily edited to create their 'vision' for how they wanted their final images to appear. Edited November 11, 2022 by mikemorrellNL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samstevens Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 2 hours ago, mikemorrellNL said: Ansel Adams. Do you think Adams saw his post processing as rescuing something. I don’t. I think Adams might have said post processing was part of fulfilling his vision. Doesn't make Tony’s metaphor in any way invalid for himself, but I wouldn’t apply it to Adams’s method or character. I would have been less inclined toward the notion of rescue if I thought Tony was just applying it to post processing, since I think too many people think post processing is not much more than making up for mistakes in camera, which it’s very often not. I was giving Tony credit for saying something different, part of the reason I asked for some further clarification. 1 "You talkin' to me?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanford Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 (edited) 36 minutes ago, samstevens said: Do you think Adams saw his post processing as rescuing something. As the story goes from people who knew him around here and taught his workshops, AA had every detail of exposure, development, and darkroom dodging and burning worked out before he pressed the shutter. Edited November 11, 2022 by Sanford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samstevens Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Sanford said: As the story goes from people who knew him around here and taught his workshops, AA had every detail of exposure, development, and darkroom dodging and burning worked out before the pressed the shutter. I know, Sanford. It was meant as a rhetorical question. That’s why I followed the “question” with, “I think Adams might have said post processing was part of fulfilling his vision” and a subsequent paragraph further explaining that. The perils of Internet lack of tone of voice. Sorry for any misunderstanding. Edited November 11, 2022 by samstevens 1 "You talkin' to me?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemorrellNL Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Sanford said: As the story goes from people who knew him around here and taught his workshops, AA had every detail of exposure, development, and darkroom dodging and burning worked out before he pressed the shutter. I have very little knowledge of AA or how he worked. I'm sure that he was a true master at 'envisioning potential 'final images' of what he was aiming towards when 'pressing the shutter'. Whether - when 'pressing the shutter' he truly had every detail of 'dodging and burning' (sometimes 25-35 steps) worked out in advance is a moot point. But I'm sure he had - at the time pressing the shutter - a clear idea of how he wanted the final photo to look. Edited November 11, 2022 by mikemorrellNL 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Rowlett Posted November 11, 2022 Author Share Posted November 11, 2022 I don’t disagree with any of the comments so far. But it is true that once the scene is captured, either onto film or digital media, it becomes trapped until the end a process. That process can be effected in as few steps as punching a WiFi button on the camera, or as many as what a poor negative has to go through. A painter, of course, dabs paint from a tube onto a canvas and pushes it around to create her masterpiece. The only thing being rescued is the paint in the tube. The mechanical process can be rough on a vision. Even after the image emerges onto a computer screen, it is still subject to the treatments of the sliders. Yes, you do all the “properly” and “successfully.” 2 Backups? We don’t need no stinking ba #.’ _ , J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanford Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 AA invented the Zone System, which allowed him to pre-visulize the finished product by mentally assigning zones of light and dark and adjust exposure to increase the dynamic range. Over expose and under develop...or was it the other way around. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samstevens Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 23 minutes ago, Tony Rowlett said: The mechanical process can be rough on a vision. Sure it can. It can also be integral to it and help it be fulfilled. 24 minutes ago, Tony Rowlett said: what a poor negative has to go through. Why do you feel sorry for the negative, which is simply the beginning of a process? Do you feel sorry for the baby coming out of a womb (to use your analogy)? Or do you sometimes experience a sense of wonder and joy at the mother-child relationship and the love and care that mother gives to baby? 1 "You talkin' to me?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
za33photo Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 Photography captures an instant in "Time". The true nature of "Time" is not fully understood , the Mathematicians will probably not agree with this statement , "The true nature of Time" can be debated "Ad-Nauseum". 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Rowlett Posted November 11, 2022 Author Share Posted November 11, 2022 2 hours ago, samstevens said: Sure it can. It can also be integral to it and help it be fulfilled. Why do you feel sorry for the negative, which is simply the beginning of a process? Do you feel sorry for the baby coming out of a womb (to use your analogy)? Or do you sometimes experience a sense of wonder and joy at the mother-child relationship and the love and care that mother gives to baby? I think you make a great point! 1 1 Backups? We don’t need no stinking ba #.’ _ , J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 Methinks, a moment in time does not need to be rescued...but perceived. Rare, the photographers that can dance with that moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 Dancing with a moment in time.... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Rowlett Posted November 11, 2022 Author Share Posted November 11, 2022 Sympathy for the Photo. 😎 Backups? We don’t need no stinking ba #.’ _ , J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 I'm rather fond of that photo. Hey, every photo does not work for everybody What sort of photo do you like, and I'll try to oblige. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 Perhaps, this. If not pray do tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 Not a Begger, just a bloke with a dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 Perhaps you like a pretty picture? Me too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 Or, You love our fellow species who we share this earth, ball of fire, with us. Maybe, we don't share as kindly as we should. What would like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 Don't be shy. Papa has put you in long pants, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Herbert Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 2 minutes ago, Allen Herbert said: Or, You love our fellow species who we share this earth, ball of fire, with us. Maybe, we don't share as kindly as we should. What would think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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