Capa on Capa: The Omaha Beach Photos, "The Eleven" :

[finnegan]

<p>I looked at those again on Memorial Day - they ARE Memorial Day in Image, for me at least. I read somewhere those few photos that survived plus those that didn't were taken in the first wave at Omaha Beach. I knew a woman whose husband drove an LST onto the beach that day, what wave I don't know. He said the soldiers name for it for awhile after was "Intestine Beach", because that was the state of the beach after the battle, I also read that Spielberg when complimented on the great documentary-handheld camera effect and sound of first 30 min. of the film and it's realism, would poo-poo it. He said from his research and talking to many survivors he couldn't create the way it really was. I believe the section of OMAHA BEACH that PRIVATE RYAN showed was "EASY RED". That was the section where Capa's LST hit the beach.</p>

<p><br /> This is Capa's description of what I always wondered: how the hell did he take these photos without being killed. And after taking them how did he make it to safety.</p>

<p><br /> Many of you may know this, and know his words. For those who don't:<br /> http://www.skylighters.org/photos/robertcapa.html</p>

[lex_jenkins]

<blockquote>

<p>"...how the hell did he take these photos without being killed. And after taking them how did he make it to safety."</p>

</blockquote>

<p>He didn't. He just got lucky that time. Eventually <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Capa#First_Indochina_War_and_death">Capa</a> and <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerda_Taro#Death">Gerda Taró</a> both died photographing combat situations.</p>

[finnegan]

<p>I know, he died as he lived..<br>

As we see now in the Middle East, war correspondents including photographers, stand in high-risk not only in battle but now taken prisoner by murderous groups, one correspondent is about to go to Trial in Iran, a SECRET Trial.<br>

I can't recall any of this stuff in Vietnam and from readings on WWII, kidnapping and hostage-taking of press etc. Even from the Japanese, who were atrocious to POWs.</p>

 

[Spearhead]

<blockquote>

<p>I can't recall any of this stuff in Vietnam </p>

</blockquote>

<p><br /><br />The Khmer Rouge, close enough to Vietnam, killed photojournalists. And I'm not sure why it matters whether you get blown up by a land mine or taken prisoner. Dead is dead.</p>

[finnegan]

<p>It matters if it's an intentional focus of those groups doing the hostage-taking and kidnapping, as it adds additional victims to those killed in battle. <br /><br /></p>

[lex_jenkins]

<p>In military conflicts there have always been shifting attitudes toward messengers and reporters, including killing them to make a point to the opponents. And there's always the risk of being suspected of spying. To some combatants there's no difference between our perception of objective reporting and their perception of spying. If it involves disseminating information that's contrary to the preferred position of the "enemy", or any information at all, what's the advantage to them to allow reporters?</p>

<p>Journalism has always been a hazardous occupation. Nothing new there. Journalist should expect this and either prepare to survive it as well as possible or decline to take the risk. Humanitarian aid agencies, medical staff, missionaries and religious organizations, and many other folks face similar risks.</p>

[finnegan]

<p>Well Lex, go back in time to the waters of Omaha Beach in the first wave, take a few pix as <br /> .50cal machine gun bullets hit the water around you and the tell us all about it's: just part of the job.</p>

<p>I credit Capa and some others of going way above and beyond the call of professionalism as he did generally in his work throughout his Short life, and most certainly here. He could have taken photos of that LST being loaded with men on the mother ship, or gone into Omaha once it was finally secure. I don't think his Editors ordered him to go into an LST in the first wave and stand near the front as the ramp went down when thus began the slaughter of the First Wave and near defeat of the Beach. He told the story of common soldier-heros, and died while doing it in a later war/ Surely that deserves more than a blasé comment.</p>

<p>Fireman have a very high-risk job, sometime involving injury and death. Is that your attitude to the three or four hundred who got killed on 9/11. "....just part of the job..."</p>

<p>If so I suggest you not tell that to a lot of NYC Firemen. You might end up in a car trunk in Jersey.</p>

<p>Anyway, this Thread is about how a renowned war photographer took world-renowned photos under perhaps the most dangerous conditions possible, and how he escaped death: this for any on the forum interested. It's not about private attitudes toward War-Reporting.<br /><br /><br>

And now, back to the Tread:</p>

<p> </p>

[Norma Desmond]

<p>What strikes me about the photos at Normandy is the unusual combination of intimacy and their iconic nature. The intimacy seems to stem to a great extent from the combination of a low perspective and an adeptness for capturing expressions and gestures at the right moment and in great detail. There seems to be genuine empathy at work here. There's a sense we're seeing something both personal and monumental. The monumental aspects are also helped by the perspective, by the starkness of the black and white, black figures against large stretches of lighter sand, water, and sky. Also, history itself helps make the photos iconic. Iconic photos often have a sense of having been staged, whether that's actually the case or not. They are often taken in such a way that a viewer feels a certain orderliness and rightness about the photo. Here, we have movement, grit, and what appears to me to be a looser and more spontaneous approach that shows a gut instinct toward taking photos. The series doesn't seem to be "playing" to emotions, as so much of all types of photography does. It seems to be in the midst of those emotions. </p>

[ellis_vener_photography]

"I don't think his Editors ordered him to go into an LST in the first wave and stand near the front as the ramp went down

when thus began the slaughter of the First Wave and near defeat of the Beach."

 

Going in with the first wave was an assignment he took on willingly. It's where the action was and unlike writers

photographers need to be where the action is, especially if they want to be published.

 

But no one expected Omaha Beach to be as highly and vigorously defended as it was. Other D-Day beach landings were

easier going.

 

From looking at the films John Morris, Capa's photo editor in London, and later at Magnum, now thinks that the only

frames Capa actually shot on Omaha Beach were those 11 frames. Either his cameras broke or Capa was (rightfully) so

shaken that he misloaded the other rolls, and the streaking of the negatives is caused by Capa's shaking.

[Norma Desmond]

<p>Photo Historians or Photographers? The question arises.</p>

[finnegan]

<p>Dear Fred,<br>

I loved your insight into these great photos. And to answer your last question: "Photo Historians or Photographers?" you already answered it: PHOTOGRAPHER in Capa's case. The raising of the Flag on Iwo Jima was staged, a re-do of the real thing for photographers. Omaha Beach was not staged anymore than WWII was staged.</p>

<p>From the report I first posted by Capa, that low perspective you mention stemmed from his precarious position: trying to escape death behind one of those steel obstacles IN the water taking photos of soldiers behind nearby ones doing the same thing. Talk about empathy! And one soldier he stated he shared his obstacle with for a bit until the man got up the courage to move on forward. God...</p>

<p>The casualties, mostly dead, in the First Wave were so overwhelming there is more than a good chance most of those soldiers Capa photographed were killed a few minutes later.</p>

<p>His empathy is palpable for those around him. And that's what makes him so unique.</p>

<p>Again: Great Post!</p>

[finnegan]

 

<blockquote>

<p >"<a href="/photodb/user?user_id=17942">Ellis Vener</a> <a href="/member-status-icons"><img title="Hero" src="/v3graphics/member-status-icons/hero.gif" alt="" /><img title="Frequent poster" src="/v3graphics/member-status-icons/1roll.gif" alt="" /></a>, May 30, 2015; 12:50 p.m.</p>

</blockquote>

 

<blockquote>

<p>"I don't think his Editors ordered him to go into an LST in the first wave and stand near the front as the ramp went down when thus began the slaughter of the First Wave and near defeat of the Beach.<br>

Going in with the first wave was an assignment he took on willingly. It's where the action was and unlike writers photographers need to be where the action is, especially if they want to be published."</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Especially noting the insight of FRED G about CAPA'S empathy, I don't really think he did what he did here and when he later was killed to further his publishing. That would be a massively egotistic affair.<br>

No, most such self-centered folks drop out way before these moments and accomplish their ends by much safer politicking for honors in name. The deeds go to others - and sometimes no honors accrue to them.<br>

Now I can't prove that. Nor can I "prove" that Capa's assignment wasn't generated by his own requests. Anyone with half-a-brain, which must include Capa's editors, would know well that anything could happen to those first waves when they hit the Beach and any "assignment" would have to be a request. Are Medal Of Honor Award Receivers awarded for merely obeying orders? Then there wouldn't be a Medal Of Honor. It's a rough metaphor but not unrealistic I think.</p>

 

[ellis_vener_photography]

"That would be a massively egotistic affair."

 

Yes it would. It is also how he made his living. And he was famous for it. Most working photojournalists I know and have

met over the years (several from National Geographc, as well as more than a few and Pulitzer and similar award winners,

as well as just guys doing their job for the news services and daily papers) are simultaneously massively egocentric and

hugely empathetic. Its pretty much how you get to the top of that field: by first having the empathy for others and

simultaneously holding yourself in very high regard when dealing with editors, publishers, and the other people you have

to deal with to first get into position to make those pictures and then get them published.

 

Of course Capa volunteered and begged his way into the first wave. You think a Hungarian Jewish refugee was beloved

by the Army brass? He got the assignment because Morris thought he could do the job because of his record. Sure he

could have died (and later did) died covering war, but it was a subject he hated with a passion.

 

Have you read the Capa biography?

[finnegan]

<p>What evidence is there of massive egoism? My impression, through his work, is that he gave of himself to others, and in war, as I said before, to common-soldier-heroes. Biographies can enlighten or tell the story of false-people.<br>

At the end of the day when we admire someone's great work and what is subliminally present in it like empathy, we are focusing in the right order. If he wasn't a brilliant photographer and one taking on high-risk forms of it, there would be no need to speak about the man.<br>

The photographs give homage to these common men, they tell their story in the beginning of a great battle. His photos serve humanity by bringing home both the carnage of war, it's dream-like experience to those in the middle of it and it's horror.<br>

I think CAPA the man had those qualities but that's a hunch.</p>

[pjmeade]

As an aside, my father went in on Sword Beach that day.

[Norma Desmond]

<p>Biographies can also be true and accurate and yet photos can sometimes show true and insightful things about a person that a biography doesn't. What is expressed in photos can also be counterintuitive to what one may learn in a biography, as even apparent jerks can make empathetic photos and apparently empathetic people can make photos that don't show that empathy. I think much more often than not some kind of truth about the person comes out in his or her photos, but I think it may take knowing the person more than having read a 2nd-hand biography or even an autobiography (which can be skewed, of course). What to read about a person through his or her photos often takes a nuanced reading of both photo and person.</p>

<p>Regardless of any of this—of the story of Capa's life and professional career—the photos show something special and tell a very distinct and important story. I haven't read his biography but have to wonder how he'd feel if these significant, meaningful, historical, and poignant photos got reduced to being about HIM, HIS career, HIS choices, etc. instead of being about the people, the events, and the moments they so tellingly and convincingly convey.</p>

[ellis_vener_photography]

"What evidence is there of massive egotism?" You ask.

 

Well for starters there are his words, the words f those who knew him best, and then there are his actions. For example:

no ne I inow with a weak or mild ego would push to be in the first wave of the Allied nvasion of Festung Europ; nor would

they be a legendary womanizer (which Capa was); they don't start photo agencies and have the charisma to other equally talented and driven photographers to join it, and name it after a very large size of Champagne bottle; and when money was extremely tight at the agency and salaries and expenses could not be paid,

take the cash on hand and go to the track in the hopes that the horses he bet on would win and he'd return to the office

flush with enough cash to make the payroll and then some. They also don't write memoirs and then try to get them sold

to Hollywood. And finally they tend not be war photographers. And that's just for starters.

 

Robert Capa had a massive ego, but none of his egotism makes him a bad person, it makes him an interesting person

with an extremely interesting life, and arguably it it is a large part of what makes Rbert Capa a great photographer, and it doesn't lessen the empathy apparent on his work.

 

As I suggested: read Whelan's biography of Capa. And if you have access to Amazon Prime or YouTube, look up "Get

The Picture", a biographical documentary of John Morris.

[finnegan]

<p>Well, giant ego may be your word but what you describe is extreme commitment, courage and energy to others so for them it elevates, not deflates.<br>

That he bet on the horses or had a lot of women has nothing to do with egoism as in conceit, it's a style, that could be described as "the common man".</p>

<p>If he had money problems trying to sell memoirs to Hollywood was a great idea, and writing memories has been done by greats and "smalls", it's value-neutral.</p>

<p>But all this is off the Thread point, which is about photography and shooting in extreme conditions, fast, setting the camera ahead of time, how did he do that, how could one consider the esthetics of photography in mortal danger or is instinct at play,.... all of these things is what I posted for. Not attitudes towards one person.</p>

<p>His photos are great: How, is my interest - given the shooting circumstances. That I can learn from, not for war photography but for street and other photography of my own in my little world.</p>

<p>You see....?</p>

 

[ellis_vener_photography]

You ask: "(how did he shoot) in extreme conditions, fast, setting the camera ahead of time, how did he do that, how could

one consider the aesthetics of esthetics of photography in mortal danger or is instinct at play(?)"

 

Yes I do see.

 

To answer your sincere questions directly. Yes, he was working on instinct earned over years of hard earned experience in dangerous circumstances.

 

From Marie Brenner's article in the June 2014 Vanity Fair, which includes excerpts of Capa's own words, as well as profile of the man:

 

 

“Bullets tore into the water around me,” Capa wrote. The beach was 100 yards away, and the steel barriers rose like the

remains of a ghostly city in a mist. Capa ran through a barrage of shells with his Contax and waited behind the nearest

steel obstacle. “It was still very early and very gray for good pictures, but the little men dodging under the surrealistic

designs . . . very effective,” Capa wrote. He clung to the pole, his hands shaking, shooting picture after picture. In front of

him, on the beach, rose a half-burned amphibious tank. Capa dropped his Burberry raincoat into the water and made for

the tank. All around him bodies floated in a sea of blood and vomit. It was not possible to retrieve the dead, and the living

were unable to advance. Crawling on his stomach, he joined two friends, an Irish priest and a Jewish medic, and then

began to shoot with his second Contax. “The foreground of my pictures was filled with wet boots and green faces,” he

wrote.

 

Suddenly, from the boil of the red ocean, Capa caught the face of a young, helmeted soldier under fire, manning his

position half submerged, with the eerie towers of German obstacles behind him. Capa raised his camera and caught what

would emerge from Omaha Beach as arguably the iconic image of the war. “I didn’t dare to take my eyes off the finder of

my Contax and frantically shot frame after frame.” Then his camera jammed. In front of Capa, hundreds of men were

screaming and dying, body parts flying everywhere. Sam Fuller, on the landing boat behind Capa, temporarily lost his

hearing from the noise. In his memoir he describes Capa taking out a telephoto lens to shoot a German officer on the hill

with his hands on his hips, shouting orders.

 

“I held my camera over my head. . . . I stepped into the sea between two bodies . . . and suddenly I knew I was running

away,” Capa wrote. As he reached a medical transport boat, he felt an explosion and found himself covered with feathers

from the down jackets of the men who had just been blown apart. As the boat pulled back from the beach, the skipper

cried; his assistant had literally been exploded all over him."

 

If you'd like to read more you can find it at http://www.vanityfair.com/unchanged/2014/06/photographer-robert-capa-d-day

 

And there is also this, if you don't have the time or inclination to either read Whelan's biography of Capa or watch "Get

The Picture": http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/3d37a03e-c8be-11e2-acc6-00144feab7de.html#slide0

 

Now if you are truly interested in knowing how photographs make great photos under great pressure and in extreme

circumstances , I do very seriously urge you to watch "Get The Picture". It will answer many if not all of your questions.

http://youtu.be/SNIl1p1yTK8

[ellis_vener_photography]

I hope all of the above helps you get a better and truer mental true of Robert Capa, the man who once wrote on his

helmet "Property of Robert Capa, great war correspondent and lover.”

 

If not, maybe these anti-hagiographic views of Capa, Morris, and Capa's D-Day photos will help:

 

http://www.nearbycafe.com/artandphoto/photocritic/2014/06/23/alternate-history-robert-capa-on-d-day-7/

 

http://www.nearbycafe.com/artandphoto/photocritic/2014/06/06/guest-post-11-j-ross-baughman-on-robert-capa/

[ellis_vener_photography]

One very last me, which is tangential to what Capa did on D-Day but apparently crucial to the perpetuation of the myths:

http://www.nearbycafe.com/artandphoto/photocritic/2014/06/26/guest-post-12-rob-mcelroy-on-robert-capa/

[finnegan]

<p>Yes, and did you know that LBJ ordered the assassination of John Kennedy? My experience of conspiracy theorists from that nation-changing day in Dallas has stood me in good stead for whatever drives you to denigrate CAPA and the source you rely on - which finds no problem with the D-Day photos by the way but blames CAPA for the ruined ones. Who Cares about what doesn't exist when you have such magnificent leavings. That CAPA would have not screwed up all of them is remarkable because most would not have bothered to remove their lens caps and touch their camera they would be so intent on saving their lives. The man was in the middle of OMAHA BEACH ON D-DAY for god's sake.</p>

<p>This is the truest statement:<br /> <strong>"</strong><strong>One very last me, which is tangential to what Capa did on D-Day..."</strong> All of it is. The photos are important, not a slogan like the witty one you quoted on a man's helmet - or the other struggles for evidence of a snake-like character.<br>

<br /> <br /> On the other hand, Thanks for the useful links about photography. </p>

<p>For the rest of this stuff, all I can say is you have a very odd attachment to finding fault with CAPA, why is beyond me, but it's described well by the misspelling: "One very last me". And for me every Memorial Day I'll be pulling out CAPA'S Great 11 as I always do.</p>

<p>Now if anyone has anything to say about photography and these photos welcome: and just put 'em next.</p>

[ellis_vener_photography]

You take great offense over nothing! There is nothing I've written that denigrates Robert Capa's life or work.

[Robin Smith]

<p>The interesting thing about the D-Day photos from my perspective is that, although they are the only shots on the beach at Omaha during the initial landing, they have never had much impact on me, and until about 15 years ago I had never really seen them or heard them referred to as "iconic" (how I hate that word). Capa certainly had a lot of courage to be there and to take them, but unfortunately it was not really worth it. Maybe if the others had been OK, I might have changed my tune, but I find them curiously uninvolving. Just because they were hard to take and the situation was grave, unfortunately, does not make them great photographs. I agree with Ellis about Capa too - his character is well-known and has been described often, a great guy to meet at a bar. A highly gregarious Hungarian. In my youth the one picture everyone knew by Capa was of the death of the Republican soldier - that was his "iconic" picture. Now it seems to have become "the magnificent 11". What shots will he be famous for in 15 years time?</p>

[finnegan]

<p><strong>"You take great offense over nothing! There is nothing I've written that denigrates Robert Capa's life or work."</strong><br>

<strong> </strong><br>

You gotta be kidding, you are, you're kidding. You have gone so far as gathering material that all is negative to him, insisting he's an egomaniac because he likes women and gambling and wears funny slogans on his helmet - that he lies, makes up myths about himself - all of its denigrating and degrading. That he made mistakes with his camera, that he got water on it! ON OMAHA BEACH, D-DAY, First Wave, - and HE GOT WATER ON HIS CAMERA!!!!! you link this guy who said it.</p>

<p>OK, enough of all this weirdness. I'm back to planet Earth</p>

<p> </p>