New F1 Appears Stuck on BULB

[gnashings]

<p>Hi All,<br>

My beloved New F1 has let me down for the first time..ever... It appears to be operating in bulb regardless of what speed is selected.<br>

I installed a new battery (same brand, etc, as I have had flawless operation with for years), meter works, self timer etc., I suspect the issue would be in the speed selector itself - this occurred after a somewhat lengthy period of being left unused. <br>

It cleared up momentarily after trying it with various speeds on self timer (making me question if this may be related to the actual shutter release, which i doubt), but the problem returned after the camera was left alone over night...<br>

Has anyone encountered this issue? Obviously I am asking for a DIY solution before I decide to have it looked at by a repair specialist - thanks in advance,</p>

<p>Peter.</p>

[Farkle-Mpls]

<p>Peter -- did you try a second battery, just in case the new one is flat or nearly so? Also, when you remove the battery, how does the shutter behave? If memory serves, you should get mechanical speeds 1/90s and faster.</p>

[jim_bielecki1]

<p>Carl is right, with the battery removed you'll have speeds from 1/90 to 1/2000, plus bulb. I'd remove the battery and see what happens.</p>

[rick_janes]

Just a bit of personal experience with this: it once happened with a fresh battery installed only a week earlier. When I

replaced it with another new one, almost as a last resort, the camera worked perfectly from there on.

[gnashings]

I suppose a $20 battery is an

experiment worth trying, these things

do sit on the shelves for a long time I

guess. What perplexes me is that it's

not just operating in the mechanical

range, but always on bulb, regardless

of speed selected...of to Wally World I

go I guess:)

[russ_britt3]

<p>Do you check these battery's with a meter?<br />If not, why not?<br /><br />You can pick up a volt meter for very little these days, and battery can be bad, even a brand new one.</p>

[gordon_yee]

<p>In an earlier thread, I wrote:</p>

<p><em>The F-1N has a mechanical shutter as well as an electromagnet that is used to provide electronic control of the second shutter curtain. With no battery installed, the shutter speeds available are those noted by Steven. The actual speed at settings 1/60 and lower will be about 1/90, and about 1/2000 at the "A" setting. If a good battery is installed, shutter speeds from 1/2000 down to 1/125, X and B remain mechanically controlled, while speeds 1/60 through 8 seconds are electronically governed. However, if the shutter dial is set to "A" (aperture priority AE mode), all speeds are electronically controlled, except that the fastest shutter speed is capped at 1/1000. The shutter will be totally inoperable if a weak or dead battery is installed.</em></p>

<p>I suspect that the electromagnet that traps the second curtain is stuck due to dirt and/or corrosion. If the shutter isn't working properly with no battery installed, I'd doubt that buying a fresh, new battery will make any difference. The steps I would take to troubleshoot the problem would be as follows:</p>

 

<ul>

<li>Remove the battery. Exercise the spring loaded plunger at the bottom of the battery chamber several times. This plunger switches the shutter button's function between a purely mechanical trigger and an electromagnetic one. This is why you can't trigger the mechanical shutter speeds when a dead battery is installed.</li>

<li>Test the shutter at different speed settings with no battery installed. If shutter is still malfunctioning, install a battery that has been verified to be fresh and strong. Use the F-1N's battery check to confirm that the battery contacts are conducting current. Test the shutter.</li>

<li>If the shutter is still malfunctioning, a CLA and/or professional service may be needed.</li>

</ul>

<p>If you're willing to assume the risk, you could try to dislodge the electromagnet with mechanical force by tripping the shutter and whacking the camera on a firm flat surface at the same time.</p>

[gnashings]

Thank you! All suggestions are much

appreciated and will be tested ASAP, I

will report back just in case someone

has the same issue going forward. As

far as the electromagnet goes, I know

that on my ae1 it was pretty ease to

access and clean by removing base

plate. I imagine this would not be the

case here?

 

 

Russ: I am ashamed to say I have no

good answer

[gordon_yee]

<p>A couple more thoughts on this problem:</p>

<ul>

<li>If the shutter operates at all with a battery installed, the battery is probably OK.</li>

<li>If, with no battery installed, the shutter only operates on bulb irrespective of the actual speed selected, it may be a mechanical problem. The shutter speed selector could be defective. Or the latch that holds the second shutter curtain may be out of adjustment, releasing the curtain only when you remove your finger from the shutter button.</li>

</ul>

[User_4136860]

<p>The New Canon F1 camera has more than 20,000 components, I wouldn't attempt to try and repair mine, and I have three F1 N bodys, I would advise you Peter to have it repaired by a professional because having your equipment properly maintained is part of the cost of being a serious photographer.<br /> P.S . Many professional camera repairers in my experience won't attempt to repair equipment that has been tampered with by the owner.</p>

[jim_bielecki1]

<blockquote>

<p>The New Canon F1 camera has more than 20,000 components<br>

</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Citation needed.</p>

[User_4136860]

<p>Read The Canon New F1 World<br>

<a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20070416051243/http://www.canonfd.com/newf1world/f1worldind1.html">http://web.archive.org/web/20070416051243/http://www.canonfd.com/newf1world/f1worldind1.html</a></p>

[rick_janes]

I am looking at a copy of "The New F-1 World" and find two mentions of parts count- on page 10 it describes the original

F-1 body as containing over 10,000 parts, on page 160 it says the New F-1 has 1500 manufactured components (I read

the latter as meaning pieces made by Canon).

 

What constitutes a part or component is not clearly defined, of course! Is a circuit board one part or a system of many, many pieces?

Is each tooth on a gear a manufactured component? Depends on how you look at it.

[User_4136860]

<p>Read The Canon New F1 World</p>

[rick_janes]

Page number?

 

(for those of us with sub-par skimming technique and/or whose attention is focused on preparing several FD bodies and

lenses for a weekend film shoot)

[jim_bielecki1]

<p >I have the "New Canon F-1 World" book. On page 160 it says "the New F-1's production process assures precise manufacturing of the 1500 components that go into the camera…"</p>

<p > </p>

<p >You're confusing the camera system with the camera itself. I can believe the F-1N SYSTEM has 20,000 parts, but the camera itself? No way.</p>

[jim_momary]

<p>1750 pieces in a Nikon F4 body, Canon F1 has to be in that league.<br>

<a href="http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/nikonf4/reliability/index1.htm">http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/nikonf4/reliability/index1.htm</a><br>

Yet here, they indicate 10K parts?<br>

<a href="http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/canonf1n/concept.htm">http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/canonf1n/concept.htm</a><br>

Oopsy ...<br>

Jim M</p>

 

[andrew_brown7]

<p>Hi,<br>

...and whacking the camera on a table will knock any loose parts out of that round hole in the front.....!<br>

Andy.</p>

<p> </p>

[w_t1]

<p>dont know if this has been solved or not...instead of a table try whacking into your other palm, a pillow or a mattress. I released my t90 shutter a few years back by doing that...turn camera on and hold shutter down as you "hammer". it took a couple of minutes for me but it worked and has stayed free since.</p>

[User_4136860]

<p>I sugges if you do "love your camera", you ignore the previous two posts Peter, and have your camera serviced by a professional.</p>

[marcbrown]

<p>I know, old thread. My standard disclaimer, information never gets old.<br /> My New F-1, F1N, F-1 New was having this problem and it was driving me nuts. I found a tip on the Analog Photography Uses Group:</p>

<blockquote>

<p>Something else that helps if the magnet's sticky, is an abrasive to clean the contacts.<br />I use a small strip from one of our dollar bills*. Maybe around 2mm wide. put some alcohol on it,<br />put it between the contacts; hold the contacts together and withdraw the paper.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>I tried this and it works. To push the contacts together, you can use the winding lever to advance the mechanism, watching as you do this otherwise you can advance too far and the contacts will touch and move apart. I used some printer paper in lieu of the dollar bill but the effect is the same. Something between the contacts is preventing an electrical contact. I gingerly tried the "body slam" to confirm that something was wrong with the contacts before I found the method to clean the contacts. I'm not sure if I had oil or dirt, etc on my contacts but before I cleaned them the electronic shutter release wouldn't function on the "A" or "S" selector. Now both of them work.<br /> I've added some meta-tags to help search engines. Canon F-1, F1, F-1 New, F1N, New F-1, New F1, electromagnet, electromagnetic, magnetic, shutter, release, circuit, not working, broken, trip, close, click.</p>

<p>Note, the image below is of the 1st curtain electromagnet and contacts.</p><div></div>

[marcbrown]

<p>2nd curtain electromagnet and contacts.<img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-IZe2Mgsi_dI/VOdga09wu0I/AAAAAAAALHs/dOR9iTHlHms/w650-h608-no/2ndCurtain_sm.jpg" alt="" width="650" height="608" /></p>