Manual Mode Problems

[dorothy_kay]

<p>I am trying to learn to shoot in manual mode and have not been successful. I have a D7100 (upgraded from D90). I have only always shot in aperture priority or sometimes shutter priority, but no matter what I try, all my images turn out black. I try reading the manual, to no avail, and these images just frustrate me to no end. Can someone please help???</p>

[SCL]

<p>Start easy. Take a shot in aperture priority...note the shutter and f stop settings. Now set your camera in manual mode and apply those same settings to the same scene. You should have an exactly same result as your first shot.</p>

<p>Now, leaving your camera in manual mode, go outside. if it is sunny, set your f stop to f16 and your shutter speed to 1/your ISO. Take a shot..you should have a perfectly exposed picture...which you have shot using the "sunny 16 rule".</p>

<p>Now, with a few successes under your belt, reread your manual and experiment a little more. Pretty soon you will have it down pat.</p>

[dorothy_kay]

<p>Thank you so much Stephen, there is hope on the horizon and I am anxious to follow your suggestions tomorrow.</p>

[johnw63]

<p>Dorothy,</p>

<p>Good advice, above. </p>

<p>I would also suggest a very common book for people to suggest, round these parts. " Understanding Exposure " . By Bryan Peterson. <br>

<br />Not a huge book and it covers all you would want to know and WHY you would want to know it, in this subject. </p>

<p> </p>

[dave_redmann]

<p>I agree with Stephen's first suggestion--it's a good way to learn, and to get a starting point from which to experiment. Also, when you say, "[A]ll my images turn out black," are you shooting inside or at night? Because the camera probably defaults to ISO 100, and if you just semi-randomly pick settings that sound normal / reasonable--say, 1/60 s and f/8--inside most homes (or even offices, and especially at night) that will be <em>waaaaaaaay</em> under-exposed.</p>

<p><em>Now, leaving your camera in manual mode, go outside. if it is sunny, set your f stop to f16 and your shutter speed to 1/your ISO. Take a shot..you should have a perfectly exposed picture...which you have shot using the "sunny 16 rule".</em></p>

<p>Sorry, I can't agree with that. Although I think anyone who aspires to be a photographer should learn the Sunny 16 rule, that is not it, or at least not a usefully-full version of it. The statement above assumes (1) full sun, i.e., (a) enough sun to cast sharp-edged shadows and (b) the sun reasonably high in the sky; and (2) the sun directly behind the camera's back. If the sun is directly behind the subject / right in front of the camera, the exposure should be increased by at least one stop and probably more like two stops. If it's sunny but the shadows have blurry edges, the exposure should be increased by a stop. If it's bright outside but there are essentially no shadows, the exposure should be increased by two stops. And there are other fairly essential modifying guides for the Sunny 16 rule.</p>

[SCL]

<p>Dave --- this is an introduction. Make it too hard in the beginning with all the ifs ands and buts and the photographer will probably become discouraged....give her a chance to succeed in small steps and progress to larger ones.</p>

[jcuknz]

<p>Sixty years into photography, including professional time, I have never used the sunny-16 rule though I think I may have worked off what the film box told me to use early on.<br>

With what Steven Lewis suggested you do not even have to take the first photo but simply take half trigger to get the camera to assess the scene and then transfer the readings, adjusted according to my experience and assessment of the scene, and take the picture.<br>

The Canon DSLR I had, and since my current Panasonic has similar, I am sure if you look through the viewfinder in manual mode [or any mode, you may need to take half trigger ] you will see an indication of where the settings are leading you ... bring the indicator back to the centre* and fully press the trigger and you will have the manual exposure which the camera thinks is correct If you think the camera is slightly wrong you can leave the indicator to one side or the other of centre position to under or over expose. With my camera to the left is under exposing and to the right is over and from memory I think my camera also has + and - marks to emphasise what is happening on each side<br>

*With aperture the smaller the number the more light is entering the camera, with shutter speed 1/big numbers lets in less light...... But you must know that from working in A and S modes ... Sorry! :-)</p>

[colin carron]

<p>In the day when all cameras were manual my normal SLR exposure technique was this :<br /> (note: pretty much all SLR exposure meters were centre-weighted so perhaps select that mode in your camera)<br /> For a 'normal' exposure :<br /> Look at the scene in the viewfinder and select an area that is about average brightness and tone. That means something that is not in either deep shadow or bright highlight. Usually a facial skin tone works as normally does grass.<br /> Aim the camera at that average lit part of the scene and meter the exposure by half-depressing the shutter button. (check your manual if you are not clear about this)<br /> Maintain that exposure by keeping your finger on the shutter button in the half-depressed position and adjust either shutter speed or aperture until the meter shows you have it right. Then recompose the scene as you want it.<br /> Fire the shutter. That is it for normal exposures.<br /> If you want a picture with a darker tone or a lighter tone do the same thing but select a darker or lighter tone when you do the metering bit.<br /> Sounds complicated like this but in practice it becomes second nature. I spent a couple of decades from the 1980's doing this all the time and it worked pretty well. Best of luck.</p>

<p> </p>

[simon_hickie1]

<p>Take a look at Fred Parker's ultimate exposure guide http://www.fredparker.com/ultexp1.htm and have a play! Also try looking at the histogram after taking an image: it should not <em>normally</em> be skewed completely to the right or left.</p>

[lauralewis]

<p>"Understanding Exposure" changed my "photography" life. It was the single most important book I have read so far for photography. So worth it.</p>

[Wouter Willemse]

<p>Dorothy, Stephen explained it clear and simple - and yes, there is more to it (as others noted), but first things first. Manual mode isn't vastly different from A or S, basically.</p>

<p>A thing to consider; there is nothing wrong with using the Aperture and Shutter modes. They still allow you full control (for all normal intents and purposes) over your exposure (using exposure compensation). The advantage is these modes is that your "starting point" for setting exposure in these modes is the meter reading, which usually is OK or near enough.<br /> In Manual Mode, the exposure settings remain whatever you used last time. So, imagine you shoot a landscape in normal daylight - ISO200, 1/400th, f/11. Next, you go indoors, and the camera will still be at those settings - but now either 1/400th is way too fast or f/11 way too small. Would you use A or S, either shutter or aperture would already be adjusted for the fact you have far less light.<br /> Shooting manual is not some holy grail in photography that will make your photos better. The key point is understanding how to adjust your exposure in tricky situations. Whether you then use manual mode, or exposure compensation to correct is not all that important - the important thing is getting the exposure values right for the photo you want to make.<br /> So if you find you're battling your camera in order to use manual mode, consider to stop using it. Focus on understanding the exposure values, rather then how to set them. Aperture priority and shutterspeed priority mode can work just as great, and leave you more focussed on making as good a photo as you can.</p>

[James G. Dainis]

Why do you want to use manual.? The auto modes were designed to make things easier. In the old days photographers used hand held light meters. A glance at the the light meter scale may have shown:<P>

 

f/22 1/60sec <BR>

f/16 1/125 <BR>

f/11 1/250<BR>

f/8 1/500<BR>

etc.

<P>

If the photographer wanted to use f/16 for greater depth of field he would have set the aperture to f/16 and then set the shutter speed dial to 1/125. With today's aperture priority, he would set the aperture to f/16 and the shutter speed would automatically set to 1/125 giving the same exposure and saving him a step. <P>

 

If the photographer wanted to use 1/500 sec to freeze action he would have set the shutter speed to 1/500 and then the aperture to f/8. With today's shutter priority, he would set the shutter speed to 1/500 and the aperture would automatically set to f/8 giving the same exposure and saving him a step. <P>

 

In changing lighting conditions, clouds passing over, he would not have to constantly check his meter and make new settings. In either aperture or shutter priority the camera would automatically select the correct corresponding shutter speed or aperture for the changing light conditions.

[keith reeder]

<p>I quite agree, James - there's a lot of snobbery about shooting manual, but it doesn't make for better images, and the camera's generally better at setting exposure than we are...</p>

[jcuknz]

<p>Go Keith GO ... LOL ... agree whole heartedly :-)<br>

Though they can be wrong and probably the most often is burning out the sky and the solution, quick and easy, is to point the camera to include more sky while taking half trigger, continue to hold HT while you lower the camera for your shot and then complete full pressure when the 'critical moment' arrives. Use of this technique does mean it is likely you will need an editor to lift some dark tones in the picture but PP is a legit part of making photos.</p>

[William Michael]

<p>I agree that most / many of the TTL Meters in modern Cameras are very smart: and the camera’s meter gets the exposure correct or close enough to correct often.<br>

When the TTL Meter does get it wrong, it is almost always because the TTL Meter is attempting:</p>

<ul>

<li>to meter an unusually lighting scenario</li>

<li>to meter something OTHER THAN what the photographer desires in the 'correct exposure'</li>

</ul>

<p>In this respect most / many photographers don't take the time and put in the effort to understand how the different metering modes work and what mode is best suited for what shooting scenario and also to know when to NOT trust the TTL meter.<br>

It has been my opinion for a long time that understanding the uses of the metering modes is necessary BEFORE understanding the uses of the CAMERA MODES (Av Tv M P and B).</p>

<p>WW</p>

 

[jcuknz]

<p>WW ... I understand the funny Canon names for A and S modes but B? <br>

To me B is short for Bulb and is a shutter function not a mode.<br>

I do not really think an understanding of metering systems is all that important except to avoid spot metering until you do appreicate how it works, and even then. <br>

One uses a system and based on the results it gives you adjust away from its readings for future images. <br>

Centre weighted is the closest to using a handheld meter so that is what I use.<br>

There are others with fancy names which I don't have a clue about but don't see a need to know</p>

[William Michael]

<p>Hello JC,</p>

<p>Both Canon and Nikon refer to the selection of Av(A); Tv(S); M; P and B as “Modes” selected by the “Mode Dial” - I was just keeping the correct nomenclature.<br>

Yes, “B” is Bulb Mode. Not all cameras have B Mode.</p>

<p>I have two Gossen and one Sekonic Hand Held Light meters.<br>

I understand that none of the three Hand Held LIght Meters I have, will make a reflected meter reading and then interpret it (i.e. “weight it”) similar to how the Nikon and the Canon metering systems do, when they are set to “Centre Weighted Average”.<br>

I have no idea how close my Hand Held Meters would be to the Centre Weighted Average formulae, and anyway it would not be much use me testing it out, as when using my Hand Held Meters, I mostly always am making and Incident Light Reading anyway. </p>

<p>Best if we agree to disagree, about the relative importance of knowing how one’s Cameras Meter Modes function. </p>

<p>WW </p>

 

[robert_k1]

<blockquote>

<p>Why do you want to use manual.?</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Dorothy, that's a good question. Most beginners these days won't bother, and are quite happy to let their cameras' auto/semi-auto modes do the job for them, and are satisfied with the results.</p>

<p>As you can see, there are two camps about using manual modes. Since I started out with manual mode on film bodies, I tend to agree with William that shooting manual mode is a great foundation in understanding how a camera operates and getting the most out of it. In addition to finer control of exposure, manual mode also taught me how to control dof and sharpness due to motion. With that under my belt, I know what the auto/semi-auto modes are doing and not doing, and can use them appropriately.</p>

[dorothy_kay]

<p>Robert, the question of why I want to use manual mode is a good one. I would like to understand the fundamentals of how my camera operates rather than just rely on auto everything.<br>

I'd also like to thank everyone for your valuable insights and suggestions. I look forward to reading the recommended book and taking a systematic approach to exploring manual mode.</p>

[jcuknz]

<p>I used manual mode exclusively for some fifty years and luxuriate in semi-auto modes of digital but I agree that one should learn how the camera operates ... if I didn't have the knowledge of manual from the past I doubt if I could use semi-auto modes properly. I just suggest one should not get too hung up on manual that you spoil unrepeatable results.<br>

It has been mentioned on blogs from time to time that when one starts using manual the percentage of 'takers' drops considerably. A digital moral could be "When in doubt trust your camera"</p>

[john_tran14]

<blockquote>

<p>I am trying to learn to shoot in manual mode and have not been successful</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Shooting in manual mode should not be more difficult than in A mode or S mode at all. You should be able to get exact same result in M mode instead of A mode or S mode and that should be easy. What you need is to know where the meter value displayed and adjust the other value so that the meter value is 0. Adjusting manually may be slow but should not be difficult at all.</p>

[robert_k1]

<blockquote>

<p>I would like to understand the fundamentals of how my camera operates rather than just rely on auto everything.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>I congratulate you for your endeavor.</p>

<blockquote>

<p>I look forward to reading the recommended book and taking a systematic approach to exploring manual mode.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>There are only three simple(?) ingredients in an exposure recipe: ISO, aperture and shutter speed. Start by understanding what each ingredient does and how it influence the exposure, dof and sharpness of an image. In a recipe using honey, vinegar and hot pepper, you would taste for the "right" sweetness, sourness and heat of the finished dish. Like wise, in an image you should shoot for the "desired" exposure, dof and sharpness. NOT just the exposure.</p>

<p>With the D7100, you have a distinct advantage of knowing what a captured image looks like, and immediately make correction. The iterative learning process is speedy. Each shot's info are automatically kept for reference. In the film days, I had to manually (or audioly) record how a shot was taken. Then wait for the development and printing before seeing anything. Often I would lose patience.</p>

<p>Last but not least, the D7100's histogram will tell you what adjustments need to be made, and by how much. Again speeding up the iterative process. After a few trial shots using the histogram, you can nail the exposure. None of this was possible on film.</p>

[Wouter Willemse]

<p>I full agree it is a good endeavour to learn how to operate a camera properly. I just remain baffled how easy people keep telling that manual is the way to do that; for example:</p>

<blockquote>

<p>shooting manual mode is a great foundation in understanding how a camera operates and getting the most out of it. In addition to finer control of exposure, manual mode also taught me how to control dof and sharpness due to motion.</p>

</blockquote>

<p><em>(not specifically aimed at Robert, this is just the nearest found example of many such posts).</em><br>

How does manual allow a finer control of exposure than P, A/Av or S/Tv? It doesn't. How do I need manual to teach me how control DoF? I learnt how to control DoF and 'sharpness due to motion' not by shooting manual, but instead by understanding what aperture does, and what shutterspeed does. Never actually used Manual specifically in order to learn that. It's putting the cart before the horse.<br>

As the other WW said about understanding metering modes before learning how to use the semi-automatic modes (to which I agree), in the same way I am a firm believer that it is not about shooting manual. Shooting manual doesnt teach you all that much. It only makes selecting settings for each shot more of a nuisance if you're not used to it.<br>

I see too many people shooting manual just because of it, firmly relying on whatever the default metering mode in their camera is telling them. When I ask "so why did you choose f/8 for this scene?" they can't tell me. How did you meter? No idea. Then, really, what is the use of shooting manual?<br>

What it really should be about, is learning to understand what effect aperture has on your photos, what shutterspeed is about and what ISO does to your photos. If you do not understand the photographic/pictorial effects of those three, shooting manual is about as useful as being able to operate a manual gearbox in a car while not having a driver's license, and no clue what the steering wheel is for. It is a total package you need to learn; it's not about how to operate a camera - that is the easiest and least interesting part.</p>

<p>Luckily, the Bryan Peterson book is very good at explaining what's what. Just remember that setting manual exposure is just a choice in how to operate a camera, one out of many. The brains are behind the camera, and those need to understand when to do what. Once you know what settings to select, how you actually set your camera is done whatever way you prefer. Can be manual, can be semi-automatic. The viewers of your photos won't notice the difference.</p>

[bebu_lamar]

<p>Wouter! I would certainly agree that people should do whatever they want as long as they get the result that they want.<br>

To me I think manual mode has a couple of advantages. First it's easy to understand for new comer although it's slower because you have to make supply the muscle to turn the controls. Second in manual it's also easier to set the exposure to anything you want. One can do that in any auto mode as well by using exposure compensation, exposure lock and program shift controls but it's not as simple or as easy as just set what you want manually. I promote the use of manual mode whenever it becomes easier to use than automatic which actually for me quite often. </p>

[Spearhead]

<blockquote>

<p>First it's easy to understand for new comer although it's slower because you have to make supply the muscle to turn the controls.</p>

</blockquote>

<p> <br>

I've never understood how something going slower is going to help anyone. If there's a problem slowing down, it has to do with self-control, not equipment.<br>

</p>

<blockquote>

<p>Second in manual it's also easier to set the exposure to anything you want. One can do that in any auto mode as well by using exposure compensation, exposure lock and program shift controls but it's not as simple or as easy as just set what you want manually</p>

</blockquote>

<p> <br>

That's not true at all. Use Av and exposure compensation and it's just two settings, just like manual mode.<br>

</p>

<blockquote>

<p>What it really should be about, is learning to understand what effect aperture has on your photos, what shutterspeed is about and what ISO does to your photos. If you do not understand the photographic/pictorial effects of those three, shooting manual is about as useful as being able to operate a manual gearbox in a car while not having a driver's license, and no clue what the steering wheel is for. I</p>

</blockquote>

<p> <br>

This is what is true. I have observed plenty of people who simply transfer a setting from a meter or line up the needle or dots in the finder with absolutely no idea that using manual isn't going to help their photos look the way they want.</p>