How many 645 Mamiya different bodies?

[emmanuel_b1]

<p>Hi there,<br>

I'm a bit confused between M645 and 645 Pro.<br>

Just to be sure, they are different?<br>

How many different 645 models were made by Mamiya?<br>

I own a 645 pro TL.<br>

Thank you!</p>

 

[Giovanni Cappai]

<p>Here is a thread with lots of info:<br>

http://www.photo.net/medium-format-photography-forum/00VuCe</p>

[rodeo_joe1]

<p>There were 3 models of the original metal-bodied M645. Top of the range was the 1000s, with a shutter speed range from 8 seconds to 1/1000th. It also had a stop-down preview lever, mirror-up facility, multi-exposure and self-timer. Then there was the 645M without a self timer and limited to a top speed of 1/500th. The lowest priced model was the 645 J (for Junior) with shutter speeds that ran from 1 second to 1/500th and without MU or multi-exposure facility, IIRC. All of those models had a fixed back that took 120 or 220 inserts and were sold concurrently with each other.</p>

<p>The newer plastic cased interchangeable magazine models began with the 645 Super. This was a rather square-ish design that looked quite similar to the old 1000s. Then came the 645E (for economy) model with a fixed back and rather flimsy build-quality. Next the design of the Super was rounded off a little more, the body shell beefed up a little and introduced as the 645Pro, with a slightly different style of magazine, although they were still compatible with the previous ones. Then came the 645 ProTL. The only difference being the addition of quite basic TTL flash metering. The final incarnation before digital was the AF version with a redesigned lens mount to take AF lenses.</p>

<p>So all in all there were 8 different models of Mamiya 645 film camera made. With a range of lenses from 35mm to 500mm in focal length, a shift lens, and at various stages 4 different focal lengths of lens fitted with leaf shutters.</p>

[harveysteeves]

<p>there was the AF, then the AFD, then the AFDII, then the AFDIII ... I think the 645E came out after the Pro - it had that tube finder on it. It is interesting that the film inserts were interchangeable between cameras and backs right up to the first AF model.</p>

[emmanuel_b1]

<p>Great answers!<br>

I'm looking for finder screen.<br>

Am I right if I suppose a one for a M645 can work with a 645 pro body?</p>

[Dustin McAmera]

<p>No, I'm pretty sure they're not exchangeable. The screens for the original series of cameras (the M645 and the 1000s) have lugs (two little ears at bottom corners of the screen, so you can't put it in upside-down) and two bright-metal studs on the top, visible when you take the finder off. I think these screens lift out from the top of the camera. The screens for the Super, Pro and Pro TL are in a plain frame, and are inserted through the lens mount with screen-tweezers (they should be supplied together with the screen).</p>

<p>Articles at Camera-wiki.org:<br>

The original series: http://camera-wiki.org/wiki/Mamiya_M645<br>

The Super, etc.: http://camera-wiki.org/wiki/Mamiya_M645_Super,_Pro,_Pro_TL_and_E<br>

The auto-focus cameras: http://camera-wiki.org/wiki/Mamiya_645AF</p>

 

[emmanuel_b1]

<p>On 645 Pro user manual it said that 645 pro focusing screen is the same as M645 Super; it is probably the only M645 which allows that.</p>

[rodeo_joe1]

<p>Thanks for filling in some blanks Harvey. I'm a bit vague about the "E" version, having never owned one, nor wanted to own one. I also lost interest in expanding my collection of Mamiya 645s shortly before the AF versions were introduced.</p>

<p>Screens definitely aren't interchangeable between the early M645 series and the Super, Pro and ProTL etc. Early screens were a composite glass condenser/plastic Fresnel assembly in a metal frame that's fitted from the top of the camera, while the later screens are a much slimmer moulded plastic Fresnel that's removed and replaced through the lens throat. Finders, hoods, eyepiece fittings and winding knobs aren't interchangeable either.<br /> Practically the only things that can be swapped between the early and later cameras are the film inserts and lenses. And even the film inserts are a lighter weight design, with more plastic and less metal used on the inserts for the Super and Pro/TL. (The shutter blinds also run across the short side of the frame on the old series cameras, and across the long side on the newer models.)</p>

[ondebanks]

<p>Basically as far as accessory compatibility goes (focusing screens etc.), there are 3 separate and largely incompatible families:<br>

1) M645, M645J, M645 1000s<br>

2) Super, Pro, ProTL<br>

3) AF, AFD, AFDII, AFDIII, DF, DF+ [the latter 2 bodies are not film compatible].</p>

<p>The 645E fits closest to family 1) as it was clearly based on the M645 1000s chassis.</p>

<p>While family 2) is an evolution from family 1), the AF family 3) is more of a jump than an evolution from 2).</p>

<blockquote>

<p>Practically the only things that can be swapped between the early and later cameras are the film inserts and lenses.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Those are the main things. Several accessories attaching to the prism eyepiece (angle finder, for example), to the tripod-mount with its anti-rotation pin sockets (quick release plates, for example), and to the strap lugs, are also swappable between families 1) and 2). With family 3), that reduces to just the tripod mount accessories. What matters though is that the AF cameras can mount all older lenses, extension tubes, macro bellows and so on.</p>

 

[emmanuel_b1]

<p>Great answer, thank you.</p>

[rodeo_joe1]

<p>The eyepiece fitting isn't the same size Ray. The FE401 AE finder for the ProTL has a slightly wider slot than that on my old 1000s AE finders. There's only about 1 mm in it, but it's enough that a universal angle finder that fitted perfectly on my old metal-bodied M645s no longer fits on the Super or ProTL. Neither does a genuine old Mamiya circular rubber eyecup fit on the FE401 - not that it's needed, because the newer finder comes supplied with it's own rectangular rubber eye cushion. It may be that newer eyepiece accessories are a sloppy fit and can be used on the older finders, but not the other way round.</p>

[ondebanks]

<p>Ah, thanks for the correction RJ. I didn't realize there was that 1mm change in rectangular eyepiece fitting. One wonders why they did that!</p>