fine lines and residue on negs

[david_love2]

<p>Looking for some help with my developing...the files attached show two fairly regular problems i am having with my developing..one is very fine straight lines on the negs...the other is what looks like unwashed stuff on the negs, but it is also in a straight line. I am using strictly ilford film/chemicals. My worklflow is as follows...loaded in a changing bag, cemicals mixed as per ilford instruction, I use distilled water to mix the dev, no pre-soak before the dev is added, I use patterson plastic reels, agitated with the swirl stick, ten swirls every minute, drain, stop with water, fix using distilled water with the fix, fix for 15 minutes, swirling every minute, wash for 15 minutes, changing the water at least three times during wash...it seems like it is something touching the film during developing, because these problems are in a straight line...I have attached (I hope, as I am fairly tech challenged) a full frame showing the residue problem, with a close-up, along with a section from another neg, showing the lines...look forward to your replies...</p><div></div>

[david_love2]

<p>close-up of the same neg</p><div></div>

[david_love2]

<p>file with fine lines</p><div></div>

[JDMvW]

<p>I have a fairly decent large monitor now, but I really can't see what you are talking about in the pictures.</p>

<p>However, the most common cause of lines that show up on the surfaces of the negatives is scratching of the film in wiping it. Residue is usually from insufficient washing - are you using a drop of "<a href="http://www.kodak.com/global/en/professional/products/chemistry/bwFilmProcessing/photoFloSolution.jhtml?pq-path=14039">Photo-flo</a>" wetting agent? It usually helps.<br /> If the lines are in the pictures rather than on the surface of the negative, then you could be agitating the developer. etc. too little and using too little developer so that the developer 'stands' on the film in the tank.</p>

[john_shriver]

<p>Most folks have a hard time getting uniform agitation with any swizzle-stick method. Inversion is the "gold standard".</p>

 

[peterbcarter]

<p>The "strait line" is probably the result of film hanging to dry. Traces of water (or fix) gong from top-to-bottom. When in doubt wash more and flick your negs to get excess water off before you hang to dry.</p>

<p>A bottle of photo-flo is cheap and lasts forever.</p>

[Mike Howard]

<p>I see the line of residue in the first photo, this looks to be caused by drying. I would rewash as above. The line in the third (attachment) looks like a scratch. Neither of these are caused by agitation, as the lines are horizontal across the portrait. If they were from agitation, I would expect them to be vertical in these pictures. This is assuming they are 35mm of course.</p>

[russ_kerlin]

<p>David,<br>

Are these lines perpendicular to the roll and do they occur at the same place in every negative? It's hard to give you a definitive answer without knowing the orientation and regularity of these lines, though I agree that the third example looks like scratches. The first two look like it might be something happening during development or fixing, but it's hard to tell.</p>

[thirteenthumbs]

<p>If you are having trouble seeing the flaws David is asking about save the full frame image to your computer, adjust the levels in PS and they become visible. <br>

The "residue" is in a straight line about 1/3 the distance from the model's right elbow to her wrist. It looks a lot like a scanner line rather than a processing line.<br>

What camera and film format?<br>

Which Ilford film?<br>

What scanner was used to digitalized the negative?</p>

<p>The fine lines look like transport roller or dust in light trap scratches but they seem to run across the width of the image, not the length. <br>

Use a good loupe and verify that the defects are on the negatives. <br>

Which side of the negative are the defects on if they are on the negative?</p>

[daniel_fortier]

<p>+1 for Peter answer,<br>

To much Photo-flo or wetting agent only use a very small amount.<br>

Also I presume you use tap water for wash & maybe final rinse, fine if the water is not to hard (mineral content) otherwise you need to treat it or use distilled water for the last two changes of wash water & for the wetting agent it favors minerals depositing on film surface as a white powder, a white non define cloud is mostly to much wetting agent & can be re-wash but take your time emulsion need to swell evenly not to add problems.<br>

Darkroom owners in rural area with wells knows.</p>

[david_love2]

<p>thanks for all the replies...neither issues occur in the same spot on the negs...the only signifigance to them is that they are in a straight line...I will try less photoflo..I think i am using too much...I will also use distilled water for the final two rises..I'm afraid that the really straight lines are scratches, but they do not happen in the same place...I will check with a loupe to see if they are on the neg...</p>

[david_love2]

<p>the scanner is an epson v700...the film is 645 MF...the "residue" lines are running parrallel with the long side of the film, and the "scratch" line is running at right angles to the long side of the film...as mentioned, they never seem to happen in the same spot...</p>

[thirteenthumbs]

<p>What is the "long side of the film" ? The direction of travel through the camera or the long side of the image frame? Your terms are confusing me.</p>

<p>Scratches, however fine, parallel to film travel through the camera are from dirty or worn guides or rollers in the camera or roll film holder. Using a squeegee can cause them also as can storage selves. Scratches running top to bottom of the film width, perpendicular to the travel through the camera, are caused by cleaning or wiping the film with or against something.</p>

<p>Epson scanners usually do not gas out and display streaks in the scans in the first 4 to 6 years of age. It's doubtful the scanner is causing a problem.</p>

<p>I use 1 to 2 ml photoflo per 1500ml water. I add the photoflo to the tank full of water with the film in the tank and the lid off. I pour it into the center of the tank then turn the film reel a few turns to mix. I do not create enough bubbles to make a single row around 1/3 the edge of the tank. I wait for the bubbles to dissipate before removing the film reel. Nothing touches the film except my fingers at the very end as I pull it off the reel and attach it to the drying rack clip. I then unroll the film and attach the weights to the end of the film. If I must touch the film it is by the edges only.</p>

[helinophoto]

<p>I agree with JDM von Weinberg and peter carter, I would think that this might be related to processing and agitation/fix/washing procedures.<br>

I have also seen something similar to this on a few of my negative lately after I changed to Rodinal and Tetenal devs. I also changed to a hardening fixer (I shoot a lot of Efke and Fomapan)<br>

Also, I agitate less and I agitate much more gently now (trying to avoid too much grain).<br>

Also, I've tried the "ilford method" in washing for the last few films and I have a few negatives with marks and lines that I've never seen before, like black spots and line-formed areas of the negatives showing different density (I don't have any photo-flo).<br>

When it comes to drying, I've found that holding the paterson tank in one hand, swinging it hard in a pendulum motion, will get rid of most of the water. (make sure you got the room for it).<br>

Swing - spool out - empty - spool back in / * 3<br>

I even put the spool in the salad tosser some times, works really well to throw off that runny water, only small dots of water remain.<br>

Also, I dry my negs in the shower with a small electric oven on the floor inside, dries much faster and dust spots are now almost history, as the negatives doesn't need 2 hours to dry naturally.</p>

[chris_waller]

<p>The fine lines are, I suspect, scratches. Do you squeegee? If so then I suggest you do not. I never squeegee, I just use wetting agent and allow the film to drain. I use either Paterson Acuwet or Tetenal Mirosol wetting agent at the rate of 2 drops per 100 ml water for the final rinse. When doing the final rinse, agitate slowly to avoid frothing. I hang the film in the dryer and allow it to simply hang there for at least an hour, preferably longer, before turning on the dryer.</p>

[zensphoto]

<p>The swizzle stick will help you when you develop C-41 Color or Black and White C-41 films. Regular old Black and White is best developed by inverting the tank with what ever your development times are. When I first started to develop 70mm or 120/220 medium format black and white film I read people used the swizzle stick method which never really worked very well for me, leaving the same kind of lines you have in your negative. Inverting the tank always works for me.</p>