B&W for scanning

[terry_evans3]

<p>Hello,<br>

I have recently purchased an RB67, 90mm, 210 APO, Epson V750, Betterscanning glass film holder, and Epson 3880 printer. My purpose is to shoot portraits with B&W film, and make prints. I want to process the film myself.<br>

So, I need your advice on everything else I need. Such as: best film, best chemicals and processing method, best tank, and any other items I will need. I don't have a budget for this, and want the best of everything I need. I really appreciate your help, and the more details the better.<br>

Regards,<br>

Terry</p>

[larrydressler]

<p>Books, lots of books on developing....</p>

[terry_evans3]

<p>Larry, your website is beautiful! What film and scanner do you use. </p>

[john_shriver]

<p>There are no bad 120 size films from Kodak, Fuji, or Ilford -- they're all excellent products. It's a very demanding market of professionals, any iffy films just don't sell well enough to be economically feasible.<br>

You haven't said enough about your requirements. Studio lighting (strobe or hot)? Or available light? Former would probably recommend a 100 speed or slower film, latter would indicate 400 speed film.<br>

The choices are:</p>

<ul>

<li>Kodak Tri-X 400: classic S-curve film, with deliberate highlight and shadow compression to give more mid-tone contrast.</li>

<li>Kodak Plus-X Pan Professional 125: last of the upswept curve portrait films in 120 size, designed to compress the shadows and expand the highlights, for high-key portraiture.</li>

<li>Kodak T-MAX 100: very fine grain, very sharp, with a very straight line curve. Accurate exposure important, accurate repeatable processing essential.</li>

<li>Kodak T-MAX 400: almost as fine grain as T-MAX 100, the finest-grain 400 speed B&W film. Same straight line curve as T-MAX 100. Less fussy about exposure than it's predecessor, accurate processing essential.</li>

<li>Ilford Pan F Plus: classic S-curve film, fine grain, like all slow speed films easy to get too much contrast in processing.</li>

<li>Ilford FP4 Plus: 125 speed, classic S-curve film.</li>

<li>Ilford HP5 Plus: 400 speed, classic S-curve film.</li>

<li>Ilford Delta 100: a tabular grain film (like the T-MAX films), but with more of an S-curve than T-MAX 100.</li>

</ul>

<ul>

<li>Ilford Delta 400: a tabular grain film (like the T-MAX films), but with more of an S-curve than T-MAX 400. Not as fine grain as T-MAX 400.</li>

<li>Ilford Delta 3200: speed, but coarse, and not especially pretty, grain.</li>

<li>Fuji Neopan Acros 100: last Fuji B&W film available in US (they're bailing out), nice tabular grain film like T-MAX 100 and Delta 100.</li>

<li>Efke R25: a very old-fashioned film, a 1950's formula. Classic S-curve. This film is orthopanchromatic, meaning it's less sensitive to red than normal B&W films, so red features on skin may render darker. Could give portraits of men more character, could be bad on acne.</li>

<li>Efke R50: a very old-fashioned film, a 1950's formula. Classic S-curve. This film is orthopanchromatic, meaning it's less sensitive to red than normal B&W films, so red features on skin may render darker. Could give portraits of men more character, could be bad on acne.</li>

<li>Efke R100: a very old-fashioned film, a 1950's formula. Classic S-curve. Normal spectral sensitivity.</li>

</ul>

<p>I will skip Fomapan, since I've encountered quality control issues with it.<br>

You need to learn about and understand H-D curves. The old Kodak handbooks explained this well, as do many other texts.<br>

The issue with processing T-MAX films is that they were designed to be easy to push and pull for Zone System work. The side-effect of this is that small changes in developing time or temperature have a big change in the H-D curve of the film. If you can't process very repeatably, the results will be all over the place.<br>

For scanning, you may well want to "pull" the film, using a lower exposure index, and shorter development times, to reduce the maximum density of the film. This will avoid challenging the V750 with dense areas of the negative that are beyond it's real Dmax ability. (It will get noisy in excessively dense negative areas -- the highlights of the image.)<br>

A copy of The Film Developing Cookbook would be just one of the books you should get.</p>

[larrydressler]

<p>I use an Epson V700 and as for B&W film I use about every film that is on the market as I just love to use B&W film and try and find the best in it even Chinese films that others dis. Lately I have been using Rollei Retro 80s and Rollei Superpan 200S.<br>

Rodinal,HC-110 And Diafine are my most used developers.</p>

[terry_evans3]

<p>John, thank you so much. I will definately order the book. Is there a good starting point for me where you can recommend a film, along with it's chemistry for processing? I guess I'll avoid T-Max, for now. Thanks</p>

[thirteenthumbs]

<p>JS's comments for TMax film are correct for optimal performance of the film, ballpark exposure within 1 stop and processing that maintains temperature within 1 degree and time within 1% from session to session gives very good results. </p>

<p>When processing some developers will work as fast as 5 minutes or less but a few seconds is a large percentage of the total development time where developing for 10 minutes the same few seconds is a lesser percentage of the total time. Developing changes of 5% to 10% from published starting times are common. 5% of 5 minutes is 15 seconds; 5% of 10 minutes is 30 seconds. Normal pour in/pour out times for daylight tanks is 15 to 30 seconds depending on the tank and amount of chemicals used. Maintaining a 5 to 10 second consistency is very easy to do.<br>

B&W processing may tolerate 5 degree variance from developer to final wash but 1 degree or less between chemicals and final wash is not hard to do and gives the best results.<br>

I strongly recommend Jobo tanks for processing. The 1500 series are for 35mm to 120mm, the 2500 series 120mm to 4x5 sheet film. Each series take different reels.<br>

<a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/25556-REG/Jobo_J1520.html#features">http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/25556-REG/Jobo_J1520.html#features</a><br>

<a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/25520-REG/Jobo_J1501_Adjustable_Reel_for_35mm.html">http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/25520-REG/Jobo_J1501_Adjustable_Reel_for_35mm.html</a><br>

for inversion processing or add<br>

<a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/25524-REG/Jobo_J1509_Roller_Base_for_Combo.html">http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/25524-REG/Jobo_J1509_Roller_Base_for_Combo.html</a><br>

for manual rotary processing. The roller base will adapt to any Jobo tank. You may have to search around to find one. When doing manual rotary processing turning the tank an equal number of times each direction is essential for even processing. It makes no difference if you switch direction of rotation every 15 seconds, 30 seconds, or 1 minute so long as you turn at the same rate for the same amount of time each direction.</p>

<p>For developers I love Xtol and HC110 is a very close second and is what I currently use for convince of infrequent processing.</p>

[leicaglow]

<p>Terry, May I give you my recommendations? I would start with TMax 400, and develop it with XTol. This would be a good starting point. Get to know TMax, then maybe try Diafine, HC-110, and a Pyro formula.</p>

<p>Once you get a lay of the land, see what you think of other films, like Ilford HP5, HP4, Kodak Plus X, and TMax 100. That would be a good starting point.</p>

<p>Buy a stainless steel tank (you might want at least a double tank for 120, so you can process 2 rolls at a time - that's 4 rolls of 35mm), and waste a roll of 120 film practicing how to load the developing reel.</p>

<p>For TMax 400 in XTol (mixed 1 part stock to 1 part water), try 9.5 minutes, agitate for the first 30 seconds, inverting the tank every few seconds, then 10 seconds before your time is up (or 20 seconds if you are developing 2 rolls), pour out the developer - usually you don't reuse XTol.</p>

<p>Have the right amount of stop bath ready to go (usually I put it in a graduate, measuring out the right amount for my tank), and pour it into the tank. Agitate, as above, for the first 30 seconds, and dump it out after the full minute is up. Just about any brand of stop bath will work. I like Ilford Stop because it has a relatively low amount of odor. Dump it back into your storage container (stop can be reused so long as it still has the yellow or orange color).</p>

<p>Have the right amount of fixer ready, and pour it into your tank. I like to mix fixer from liquid (usually 1:9 for Ilford - also low in bad smell). Powder fixer triggers my asthma like crazy. Usually I fix for 5 minutes, then pour it back into its container for reuse. I also note how many times I've used the fixer, and quit using it after 10 uses for a given volume.</p>

<p>I wash for 1 to 2 minutes. Then I use Zonal Pro Hypo clear for 2 minutes (there are other hypo clearing solutions on the market, or you can skip this step, but then you have to use a lot more running water). Then I dump it (not reusable).</p>

<p>Then I wash for another 5 minutes, and dump the water. Then I pour in PhotoFlo for 1 minute to eliminate crud on the negs, then hang them to dry in a closet that is extremely clean and free from dust. After 24 hours, you can handle the negatives safely. 12 hours would work so long as you are very careful.</p>

<p>And finally, get a book<g>. Kodak darkroom guides are very good if you can still find them. So is Ansel Adams' "The Negative" if you skip past all the Zone System stuff (for now).</p>

<p>Get some good graduates (including some that will easily measure down to a 1/4 ounce, accurately. You'll also need a thermometer to read 68 degrees F accurately (20 C). You should also have three containers - 1 each for developer, stop, and fixer. And a good stirring rod and funnel. Have fun.</p>

[mauro_franic]

<p>I would start with TMAX 400 developed in Xtol 1:1. One of the best combinations available.<br>

It has significantly larger grain than TMAX 100 but it almost equally as resolving and sharp. (not sure how people think the grain is the same - may be it is a typo).<br>

It is definitely not as linear as TMAX 100 either with a larger portion of its density dedicated to the midtones. It has 3 stops less DR than TMAX 100 with the highlights are about 2 stops narrower and the shadows 1 stop narrower when developed in XTOL.</p>

<p>Tonality is fantastic - to my preference.</p>

[mauro_franic]

<p>I guess Michael and I posted the same advice at the same time.... funny.</p>

[nicholas_rapak]

<p>My vote is for Plus-X in D-76 1:1. Nice grain, nice contrast, an all around great film.</p>

[robert lee]

<blockquote>

<p>My purpose is to shoot portraits with B&W film, and make prints. I want to process the film myself.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>The trick here is to stick with one film, one developer, one development regime, and one set of equipment (use the same thermometer in particular.) Shoot enough exposures, both in terms of volume and mindfulness, so that you know how the workflow captures and renders the light.</p>

<p>Sure, use Kodak 400 TMAX. It's my favorite B&W film too; it's the best available on lots of technical parameters. However, I'd use Kodak HC-110 dilution H as the developer. It doesn't quite perform as well as Xtol, but HC110 is a highly concentrated syrup so is logistically simpler to deal with. It helps to keep things simple for the first few hundred rolls or so :-)</p>

[terry_evans3]

<p>Everyone has been so helpful, and I really appreciate it. Ordering my film, tank, and book today! <br>

Regards,<br>

Terry</p>

[terry_evans3]

<p>Shucks, I can't find the Jobo roller base anywhere. I you happen to know how has them, please let me know. Thanks</p>

[thirteenthumbs]

<p><a href="http://www.calumetphoto.com/">http://www.calumetphoto.com/</a> has a large selection of Jobo equipment including a stainless steel 120 reel for the 1500 series tank.</p>

[terry_evans3]

<p>Thanks Charles. Doesn't look like it's in stock, though.</p>

[thirteenthumbs]

<p>You can get a piece of plywood or 1 by lumber, cut it to size and attach 4 small plate casters so that the tank sits on the wheels and turns freely. It won't be plastic and adjustable but will work as well. Inversion processing works well also. Stainless steel tanks with stainless steel lids are very good for inversion processing also. All stainless steel tanks I've seen new recently have plastic lids.</p>

[terry_evans3]

<p>Thanks Charles. I will do just that, until I find the roller base. Aslo, what is the process when using a roller base, is it constant?</p>

[thirteenthumbs]

<p>The tank or pamphlet that comes with it will tell you the minimum amount of chemical (volume) that you must use. The developer you use will have a minimum amount you must use to fully develop a given amount of film. The developer data sheet has that information. Xtol requires 100ml developer per 80 square inches of film, HC110 6ml concentrate per 80 square inches of film. 80 square inches of film = 1 8x10 sheet; 4 4x5 sheets; 1 roll 120mm; 1 roll 36 exposure 35mm film.</p>

<p>Jobo 1520 tank requires 240ml chemical for rotation processing. Using Xtol 1:1 you would need to mix 120ml Xtol + 120ml water ; HC110 dilution B (1:31) 7.5ml concentrate + 232.5ml water. A ink cartridge refill syringe or child dosing syringe works well for measuring HC110 concentrate. You can mix 250ml to 300ml for rotary processing without any adverse affects but 230ml will have adverse affects.</p>

<p>Rotary processing requires constant rotation. Pre wash is required/recommended with Jobo tanks even if the film manufacture says not to.<br>

1. Fill the tank with film full of water the same temperature as the developer and let sit while preparing the developer or 3 to 5 minutes.<br>

2. Agitate then pour out the pre wash.<br>

3. Pour in the developer, put the cap on the tank, lay on the roller base, start the timer, continually rotate the tank changing directions every 30 seconds or minute so that the tank rotates the same amount of time in each direction (small differences will not affect outcome). Start with the tip of a forefinger of one hand on the center of the tank and push forward until the rear of the palm is at the center then switch to the other hand. Speed is not important. To reverse rotation either turn the tank 180⁰ or place your palm on the center of the tank and pull toward you then switch hands when your finger tips are on the tank center. It is very easy to set a pace and keep constant or near constant rotation. A pause of 1 to 3 seconds will not have adverse affects.<br>

4. At the end of the developing time pour out the developer and fill the tank with water the same temperature as the developer, agitate then pour out, repeat or pour in 240ml of stop bath and rotate for 1 minute, reversal of direction is not necessary.<br>

5. Pour in 240ml of fixer and rotate for the required fix time or fill the tank with fixer and invert one or two times every minute for the required fix time. Fix time depends on the fixer and film.<br>

6. Pour out the fixer and fill the tank with water, agitate, pour out.<br>

7. Fill the tank with wash aid and pour out after 1 to 3 minutes. Use the instructions for the wash aid.<br>

8. Remove the lid and wash under running water for 10 minutes at a flow rate that will cause 1 complete change in the volume of water in 10 minutes.<br>

9. Add a few drops (1ml to 2ml) Photo flow or similar to the tank of water/film. Agitate gently, do not cause foaming or just let the tank sit for a minute or two. <br>

10. Lift the film/reel from the tank.<br>

11. Unroll the film from the reel and hang by one end in a dust free place and allow to dry. Wood spring type close pins work well to hang film with. Put 2 to 4 clothes pins on the bottom of the film to weight it down and reduce curling.<br>

12. Mix a sink or pan of warm water with mild amount of dish washing liquid and wash all mixing rods, funnels, graduates, tank and reel then rinse with warm water and allow to dry in a dust free place or dry with a lint free towel.<br>

Kitchen timers (digital) work well for timing processing steps. Pour in/pour out times count toward total development but in rotary the lesser amount of chemical reduces the pour in/out time and using dilutions or developers that require 8 to 12 minute developing times the 20 or so seconds to pour in/cap the tank-uncap/pour out have little affect on the outcome., full strength and inversion processing would.</p>

<p>Stop bath, fixer, wash aid aka hypo clearing agent are reusable and can be poured back into the storage bottle for working strength of that chemical. Be sure to pay attention to the capacity of the working solution provided by the manufacturer.</p>

<p>Mark any mixing containers, funnels, Photo Use Only.</p>

<p> </p>

[terry_evans3]

<p>This has been the most helpful replies from any post I have ever made, and I really appreciate it. Thanks for taking so much time with me, Charles. I am printing everything and will get started next week. <br>

Regards to all,<br>

Terry</p>

[rossb]

<p> I think I will give it a go also. Seems to be the most economical way to shoot black and white 35mm and would allow me to be very independent in my hobby. </p>

[mark_beehre]

<p>John S - I'm interested to hear what quality control issues you've had with Fomapan. I've recently tested 5 rolls of ISO 100 in 120 size and found the results to be pretty satisfactory (processed in ID 11 1+1) apart from one roll that had peculiar vertical lines of variable density right through the whole film including the unexposed margins. I can't readily attribute this to a processing problem (uneven development shouldn't have affected the unexposed margins, the parts that print black) and wonder whether it's a manufacturing issue.</p>