Artistic snobbery

[bill_keane2]

I was at a gallery exhibition and was asked by someone partial to paint what my medium of choice was... When I

said, "photography" I was told how it used to be that photographers had to be experts in the darkroom, whereas now

that's not the case. So I indicated that, in fact, many great image-makers that used slides, never used a darkroom,

and that today, with digital, post-processing to one degree or another is something almost every serious

photographer has to get involved with.

 

I guess this didn't go over well, because the person I was in conversation with then said they might like to get a

camera, but they wouldn't know what to do with all the "beautiful" images they would wind up having to deal with...

("1,000's and 1,000's")

 

I suggested perhaps external harddrives, and vault rental, but that was taken with a bit of sarcasm...

 

But at least I learned that the greatest challenge in using a camera isn't creative insight and expertise, but storage...

[pjmeade]

It just goes to show that no one likes to have their preconceptions ruined by facts.

 

I hope you enjoyed the rest of the exhibition

[CharlesBecker-Toronto]

"I suggested perhaps external harddrives, and vault rental, but that was taken with a bit of sarcasm...

But at least I learned that the greatest challenge in using a camera isn't creative insight and expertise, but storage..."

Bill-great answer! LOL regards, cb :-)

[starvy]

those who have not taken photography seriously or know little about how frustrating the learning process might be should be forgiven for minor misdemeanors as above! they are going to be buying a small automated canon or olympus, perhaps even a nikon, and go out to take snaps of their family. the indoor pictures would be badly lit with a small flash, however, for them it is the moment that matters. those pictures might go to facebook or some other social networking site. outdoor at night they would take pictures of the christmas lights. the flash would come on in the automated mode and ultimately, the fully extended zoom might not capture all that the recipient might intended to have captured. however, their expectation of the 'beautiful picture' is low.

 

you are not going to educate them in ten minutes to half an hour either. so don't bother. act enigmatic. tell them that photography is difficult and relies on a combination of understanding how light behaves on the part of the photographer, as well as knowledge of ones equipment. also tell them that face detection is a gimmick. there is no need to explain anything you say. they are far more likely to think of you as knowledgeable and speak to someone else less daunting.

[chelsea]

In my very limited experiences at these events, I find that it's best to have put on one's thickest of armour, the pretentious idiots are drawn to these things like magnets. Deafen your ears, paste on the fakey smile, reply with something totally off-the-walls, laugh and move on. Or make up some names, tell them "I like the style of Newton, but with the nuance of Carristo, but it's sooo hard to find that these days", leave them wondering what the heck you're talking about. No use bothering them with the facts when their minds are made up.

[William Kahn]

Shortly after we moved from Arizona to Tennessee (talk about culture shock!), I was looking to join a local artists' community similar to the one I had belonged to in Flagstaff. So, at one of the local art fairs, I approached the table where the art association had a display and told the elderly lady running the show that I was interested in joining. Of course, she asked me what my medium is. Of course, I said, "Photography." From the look on her face, you'd think I had broken wind at her dinner party. I half expected her to make the sign of the cross to ward off evil. She managed to choke out that she was sorry, but they had no photgraphers in their little group. So, I thanked her and walked back to my own table. I probably would have been a little angry if the encounter hadn't been funny, so I guess the moral is that a sense of humor is indispensible in this arena.

 

Oh, and I now belong to the Association of Visual Artists in Chattanooga......which is 75 miles away.

[steve_swinehart]

I'd just change the subject and ask them what their opinion was of Eisenhower signing a secret treaty with the space aliens in 1954...

[brucecahn]

Was walking acrocss the street in the Photo District. I heard one young woman say to another "of course I could be a photographer, but ANYONE can do that". People who have not tried high level photography do not know just how difficult it is.

[ellis_vener_photography]

Even the brightest most intelligent people can't know everything.

[unangelino]

Back when Adobe Illustrator first came out, everyone was going to be a graphic designer because the software made is so easy. Of course, learning the software was the easy part of that process. Photography is like any art form. It will present the artist with as many challenges as he cares to face. I am a writer by profession, but I know that I am incapable of writing poetry of any enduring quality. Still, I keep writing verse. I do the same thing with photography, though I possess a limited amount of creativity. Still, I am always trying to <i>create</i> the best photographs I can. If that's not art I don't know what is. Back in my wild youth, I raced motorcycles. There was one devastating thing that was said about riders who always had a comment about other riders, but never could break free of the pack himself: <i>Yeah, that guy <b>talks</b> a good race.</i>

[f_ph1]

I used maintain an attitude similar to the one alluded to by the original poster. Having been involved in painting and drawing

the majority of my life, I found myself annoyed by those pesky photographers who had the unmitigated gall to hang their

work in art galleries. Part of it had (and, admittedly still has) to do with the suggestion that documentary photography is art;

part of it had (and yes, still has) to do with the suggestion that technical expertise is art. I am still opposed to both of these.

To that degree, I am still a snob.

Having been involved with making pictures with cameras for a few years, I now know how difficult it is to manage to create

a "beautiful" image. With black and white film, my primary medium, it is even more difficult. I found that, here in the midwest,

especially, presenting oneself as an artist-photographer is typically met with more than a modicum of derision. I actually

had a guy laugh at me in a gallery in Old Montreal recently, when, after viewing some of the work there, I mentioned that I

was an artist. "Heh... photographer", he remarked with a French accent, gesturing at the Hasselblad slung over my

shoulder. The interesting thing is that I felt the same way about much of the "low brow" work exhibited at the gallery, which

I considered little more than knoc -offs created by the latest crop of Mark Ryden imitators.

The good thing that has arisen from this predicament is that, since my new found craft is still struggling for mainstream

acceptance as such, I figured a while ago that I might as well do it the way I want to do it. Having sold my digital camera as

well as my higher end film scanner, I am now involved in shooting, enlarging and printing the old fashioned way, and am far

more excited about the results from these methods. Trouble is... the average layperson tends not to be able to tell the

difference... or care...

 

 

I

[iliafarniev]

there is only one way about it folks

 

gotta sell it

 

no matter what

[samn]

In Mendocino CA, a few years back, I was in a photographic gallery and remarked "what a great group of

photographic manipulations the featured artist had accomplished". I was rudely told by the gallery owner that

they were absolutely not manipulations. All work on the images had been accomplished in the artists darkroom.

[stevespencer]

Peter Meade wrote: "It just goes to show that no one likes to have their preconceptions ruined by facts."

 

There have never been truer words.

[acarodp]

"Part of it had (and, admittedly still has) to do with the suggestion that documentary photography is art; part of it had (and yes, still has) to do with the suggestion that technical expertise is art. I am still opposed to both of these." <p>

I hope not to come across as rude for what I'm about to say. Most people attach to the word "art" a positive feeling. One (someone at least) feels better to be able to define himself an artist, artists (some of them) feel the right to distinguish themselves, and admit, or refuse "candidates" from being "one of them". Historically, this desire for photography to be recognized, admitted as an art form, and the continuous debate on this speaks of a mindset in which being recognized as an artist is seen as something that makes you better, and lifts what you do (photography) to a superior dignity of sort. "Classical" artists as well seem to feel this way, and the right to be seen as one of their peers is sometimes graciously granted, sometimes not, as in the OP converstion. <p> Frankly speaking, by what I see around and with my limited knowledge of modern art, I don't really feel all this urge to be admitted to the party. Personally, I would feel more honored of being recognized as a peer of people like Cartier Bresson or Don McCullin (not that I think it will happen), than to be put close to a good deal of what I saw some weeks ago at the Tate Modern in London. <p> Myself, I have a very broad definition of art, which has to do with what pushes you to do what you do, more than what tool you use for doing it. I have no special admiration for artists, I have it for great artists, but they are few, and are proven such when their work survives the test of time. This generally happens for very few painters, sculptors, musicians, writers, and photographers. For the rest of us, we should not judge the value of somebody's work by the category it fits in, or we want it to fit in. It is just not going to work... <p> L.

[matt_needham]

Snobbery is important in the business of art. Often it's the only difference between a $2 piece and a $2000 piece.

[alexander_ghaffari]

I want to try out some glass plates, just so when I am asked what my medium of choice is, I could say glass plates because film is cheating. ; )

[newbie1]

I have tried to locate a photography club in our area. I did locate one in the town next to ours. I went on line and found the days of their meetings and went to check it out. I believed that I could learn much from the club and the members there. I also thought maybe they had learning and teaching both at the meetings and as part of their field trips, ( which they had many of). At the beginning of the meeting I was asked by the president of the club to stand and introduce myself and explain what I was wanting out of the meeting; which I did. NO ONE introduced themselves to me. NO ONE even looked at me. they only showed their photos they had taken the weeks before the meeting and commented on who of them shot the best photo. That was it. The club adjourned, The people left and not one person spoke to me. SNOBBERY at its finest. I never went back.

[stamos]

Snobbery is THE PROBLEM in all arts. In photography too.

[f_ph1]

James, I've experienced similar behavior when present among photographers. I have found that photographers tend to be the

most annoying of those involved in the visual arts. My theory is that this is due to the fact that many artists are

photographers, but few photographers are artists. People who have a grasp of the technical aspects of photography, but are

bereft of artistic talent often seem compelled to present their technical acumen in the guise of artistry. They tend to be the

ones who are present at such gatherings just for themselves, if you will. Other visual artists tend to run the gamut in terms of

personality and personability. In essence, I really think it is a feeling of inadequacy on the part of photographic technicians

who want to be artists that fuel the obnoxious behavior you alluded to. Again, this is only a theory, but a theory that I find is

confirmed time and time again. Of course... I am not right about everything all of the time...