Aggitation Technichue, Timing and Effect of result

[jan_de_ridder1]

Hell all,

 

I have searched aggitation with this forum before posting this

question and have come out rather more baffled than helped.

 

I have a number of questions towards aggitation;

 

1. With for example HP5+ and DD-X I have a development time of 9:00

minutes, first 30 second continuous aggitation followed by a 3

aggitation round (if I may call it that) every minute.

 

It takes me roughly 12 seconds to pour in the developer, and 10

seconds to pour out... what do I do with these 22 seconds ? are they

included in the processing/aggitation time, or do I start the

processing time after the developer is in the drum ?

 

The first 30 seconds of continuous aggitation definately begins after

the 12 seconds of filling (would cause quite a mess otherwise).

Aggitating every minute for 3 rounds begins after the first 30 seconds

I presume, and then every minute 3 times ? ....

Is the first 30 second aggitation technique similar to the minutely

technique ?

 

2. How to aggitate ?

 

Some say make three big "rounds" completely turing the drum 3 times in

appr. 15 seconds, other say hold it in one hand and with a quick shake

of the pulse, 5 times, thus 2 extra to make up for the innability to

completely turn the drum.... ?

 

3. What is the effect of aggitation on the negative (to little or too

much)

 

Am I able to fine-tune or steer the results by changing the aggitation

process at all ?

 

I am looking for more or less standard in the technique of aggitation

(if these exsist) I realize that for some the aggitation process is

well kep secret ritual... :-)

 

I would greatly appreciate your replies, and thank you in advance

[michaelging]

Jan, I aggitate for the first 30 sec and then 5 sec every 30 seconds till time is up. I aggitate

a tank by turning it 180 degrees around 3 times during that 5 sec. I also tap the tank

everytime to release any air bubbles that attach to the film during the aggitation.

 

Over aggitation bulds contrast faster than shadow detail ,and under aggitation can cause

streaking on the negs. Under aggitaiton also causes the negs to be flat.

 

I do not use drum aggitation to develop my film . You can use constant aggitaition, but If

you do, you will need to develop for less time. Most instructions that come with the film

will give you the information you need. I hope this helps.

[chris_waller]

Firstly, I pre-soak for 2 minutes at 20 C, but that's optional. When I pour in the water I invert the tank 6 times and then tap it sharply to displodge any air bubbles. After pouring out the water i then pour in the dev and invert the tank 4 times in the first 30 seconds. After that I give one inversion every 30 seconds. Just before each inversion I give the tank a swift half-turn as it stands on the bench to impart some circular motion.

 

The important thing is to be consistent.

[kaiyen]

<p><i>It takes me roughly 12 seconds to pour in the developer, and 10 seconds to pour out... what do I do with these 22 seconds ? are they included in the processing/aggitation time, or do I start the processing time after the developer is in the drum ?</i>

 

<p>it doesn't really matter, as long as you are consistent. I am kinda weird - with my plastic tanks, which pour reallly quickly, I start the timer as I pour. With my SS tanks, which pour really slowly, I start the timer after i finish pouring. But I keep it the same way each time for each type of tank, and I adjust overall development time. Works for me.

 

<p><i> Is the first 30 second aggitation technique similar to the minutely technique ? </I>

 

<p>I presume you mean whether you agitate the same way. I use the exact same agitation pattern for the first 30 seconds as I do for every time thereafter. I invert while giving it a half turn (so it's like a looping pattern), then bang it on the tray when I put it down, then turn it 1/4 turn.

 

<P>Again, the key is to be consistent. My teacher does figure 8's. Others use the little rod in the middle to spin (this is for plastic tanks). Just be consistent.

 

<p>allan

[alan_gage]

As you're finding out everyone has a preferred method. My recommendation would be to pick a method you're comfortable with and use it excusively. Instead of trying to find an agitation method that fits in with your 9 minutes of developement time adjust your development time to fit in with your method of agiation.

 

Alan

[dxphoto]

Ilford website has a document 'processing your first black and white film' in pdf gives you a clear answer on question #1.

[ronald_moravec1]

Start the pour in 12 sec before the start of the total time. Start the pour out 20 sec before the end of total time and start the second step 12 sec before the end of total time.

 

The film on the bottom of the tank will receive developer early, but will come out early too. Be consistent and vary the total time only.

Keep the agitation the same. You total will most likely most likely be different than the mfgr`s time, but that is ok if it works with your equipment.

[frank.schifano]

All the above is pretty good advice. None of the techniques mentioned have any real flaws to them, but there is one glaring omission. Plastic tanks with twirling sticks and 120 roll film are not, in my experience, a very good combination. You are better off agitating by inversion with 120 roll films. My experiences with twirling sticks and 120 roll film almost inevitably lead to uneven development. With 35mm film I've had no problem using this technique.

[rick_jones5]

If your negatives are evenly developed you are doing just fine. How do you know if your negatives are evenly developed? If even toned subjects (example-clear Northern sky) reproduce on your negatives with even densities you have no agitation worries. If the majority of your negatives print with normal contrast to your eye then your timing is just fine. So stop looking to fix something that probably ain't broke.

[jan_de_ridder1]

Thank you all,

 

I have just finished developing an HP5+ in DD-X according to the following specs comporived out of the replies I got here;

 

total dev. time 9:12, started timing when pooring in the developer, at 9:00 aggitated for 30 sec. a total of 18 180 degree aggistations, aggitated 3 x 180 degrees every 30 sec, poored out developer at time-end. I used fresh developer, stop and fix, after watering for 10 minutes added two drop of wetting agent, waited for 2 minutes, and I must say, maybe just suggestion, the negs have come out beatifully. I scanned, what I believe three of the more difficult ones and on screen they look stunning.

Like I mentioned before It might all be suggestion but now I have found a film developing method I can stick too, knowing it works for me.

After all for a relative beginner going through this forum's threads concerning film development techniques things can get a bit unclear, bit by bit I am mastering the technique however, and from that point on I am then also able to progress further.

 

Thank you all, aou were all very helpfull...

 

Thanks again

 

Jan

[alan_gage]

10 minutes is a long time to wash film. You might want to stop in Ilfords website and read up on their method of film washing. It supposed to be archival, is much faster, and uses a lot less water. I've used it without problems (as do many others on the forum).

 

Basically it's fill the tank with and do 5 inversions. Dump and re-fill and do another 10 inversions. Dump and re-fill again and do 20 inversions. That's it!

 

I do generally take it a few steps farther though. First thing I do after fixing is to remove the top of the tank and rinse it out. Then I pull the reel out and sling some of the fixer off of it. I usually end up doing some extra inversions as well; I generally go 10-20-30.

 

Alan

[raczoliver]

As it has been said before, it really doesn't matter whether you start the timer when you start pouring in, or afte you've finished pouring. Measure your correct development time and always do it like that. Just because in the instructions it says that 9 minutes is the suggested development time, it doesn't mean you have to adjust everything else so that you should get 9 minutes as your time. Just do everything with your own techniques, and your development time will probably be somewhere close to 9 minutes, but if not, just make some adjustments in the time. Also for the agitation, it doesn't matter which kind of hocus pocus you choose, you probably wouldn't see any difference anyway. Just make sure you agitate enough but not too much, and once you have a hocus pocus that works for you, always do it the same way.