The risks of buying a "never used", decades old camera

vince_nl · January 29, 2017

I've been looking for a Nikon FM2 in a good condition for a while now and recently came across one on ebay that ticks all the boxes and more. It's in mint, boxed condition and the seller says it's never been used - the shutter guard is still in place and it never had a film in it.

I'd love to buy the camera as the price is somewhat decent, but I'm wondering if there are any risks with buying an old camera that's never been used. It looks great in the photos but I'm a little reluctant – I guess I'd feel more comfortable with buying something that's been proven to work. Is there anything I should be aware of or ask the seller?

Many thanks.

User_4754088 · January 29, 2017

I'm not familiar with all the FM2's intricate lubrication points, but one of the reasons many avoid "never used" cameras is that exercising the mechanism in a camera keeps the lubricants moving around and keeps everything lubricated and in good condition. This was especially true of the wet cameras from the 1940's, 50's and 60's. Again, not sure about the FM2, it might be a dry camera, meaning the bearing surfaces could be materials like teflon and delrin, which do not need wet lubricants, and in that case, "never used" would not be an issue.

Rick Helmke · January 29, 2017

If the seller will allow you to fire the shutter at different speeds to see if that is working properly and see if the film transport is working and probably but batteries in it and see if the meter works, and if all of this checks out, not much else you can do with an unused camera. I understand it is in mint condition now but it would be prudent to check a few operational items. If the seller wants to keep it in utterly mint condition and allow none of this, that is understandable and honestly I would probably buy it anyway if the price is right. If not then I'd call KEH and pick up one that has a guarantee.

Rick H.

SCL · January 29, 2017

I think Rick hit the nail on the head. Unless you only plan to display it, you really need to check it out for any deterioration and that itcludes operability..

bebu_lamar · January 29, 2017

I think the never used could be a lie. My camera still have the shutter guard on it but it has been used a lot. My camera does look like new. Besides the FM2 is a simple camera. If I were the owner and in an hour or so I can tell how well it work including checking the light meter for accuracy and the shutter thru all speeds for accuracy. So the seller think his camera is more valuable as never used rather than slightly used but all function is in spec?

steve_bingham · January 29, 2017

To shoot - or display? If the price is right buying seems prudent unless you expect to use it. Then test it.

Two23 · January 30, 2017

To see if a camera has been used, I first look at the tripod socket, then where a neck strap attaches, and finally the film rewind. If this thing has truly never been used and it still has the box etc., I would not buy it. You are paying a premium for a mint display camera. I try to buy camera gear that is near mint--obviously used a little but very few marks etc. Since I do indeed take the things out and shoot with them, I don't want to decrease the value of a truly mint camera. Those are for very anal people who want something perfect and will park it on a shelf.

Kent in SD

rodeo_joe1 · January 30, 2017

The foam rubber light seals around the back and

the viewing screen will still deteriorate, whether the

camera is used or not. If stored in the original box

there may be some interaction between

packaging materials and any plastic/rubber parts.

"Unused" doesn't mean it's any less old than a camera that's been well-used.

If you just want a "user", then why not buy a used camera and leave the mint ones for someone to stick in a glass case? It's not as if there's any shortage of old 35mm film cameras.

When film was in common use I'd have said "snap it up and use it!", but my opinion now is that all 35mm film cameras belong in a museum.

jose_angel · January 30, 2017

You have a risk with whatever the second hand camera or gear you`ll be buying. There is no manufacturer`s warranty and you really don`t know anything about it... just that it looks nice. There are thousands of articles sold in internet as "never used", or "new"; the words are just adjectives used by someone you don`t know. And in fact, it is a cultural deviation in certain countries... I don`t want to specify where, but I know two or three european countries where "new" means "not clearly broken" (but it doesn`t assure you it is actually working!). The main problem I see on a real "never used" old FM2 is that lubricants could get sticky. If so, the mechanical tolerances (already high on a mechanical camera) could be off; my "extremely used" and exercised F3 have the lubricants in bad condition, while my less used FM2 is still fine, so who knows. Another problem could be fungus, or internal corrosion, less likely. If you want to be sure it works at 100%, you`d need to send it for a CLA service (and to trust them... ). I can imagine it will be certainly expensive, so the seller will be interested on selling it... ask the seller for a (written) returning period. You just need a couple hours to check if all is fine. If not, ask for a refund. Anyway, my own statistics and experience say that articles in true mint condition use to be in good working condition.

(Well, I have just bought a pair of brand new skis from an online retailer; one came with the manufacturer`s stickers, the other don`t, and with a very slightly bit corrosion on the metal edge and with very slightly marks on the binding... so I assume they are pairing "demo" skis with a "new" skis to sold both as "new"... actually not an issue but I`m not trusting on them anymore... :)

john_tran14 · January 30, 2017

To me, the worst thing about buying a "never used" camera of decades old is that very very likely it has been used. In my experience (of buying old thing), these "never used" cameras though have not been used much but they have been in the hands of people who may not have time to use them because they don't really love to use them and don't take good care of them. Usually, I found these cameras have some serious issues even sometimes you don't see these issues right away.

Secondly (and this is even more important to me) I love to have and use a very well-used tool in good condition, not an unused tool that may also have problems. I consider it higher value if after having been used a lot, the tool is still in great condition.

vince_nl · January 30, 2017

Hi everyone, many thanks for the useful comments, I'm always impressed by how helpful everyone is around here and the useful insights I've gotten. To answer a common question – I do indeed plan to fully use the camera and it's definitely not for display. In that sense, I'm not just after mint-condition ones, but I've been looking for a (good condition) black version of the FM2 for a while now (mind you, I live in Europe and I'm only looking at European sellers so that I don't have to deal with import and duty fees, it would cost me a lot otherwise) and this one was a particularly good deal.

I'll be asking the seller whether he can test the shutter speeds, film transport, and meter, as mentioned above, and see what he says. But I do get the feeling I'd be better off waiting a bit longer for a slightly used camera in a good condition. Thanks again for your help.

steve m smith · January 30, 2017

Had to tell without seeing it.

I recently acquired a never been used before, stored in a loft since 1979, Mamiya Universal Press. The shutter in the 127mm lens works perfectly - something I was not expecting.

dan_brown4 · January 30, 2017

Pretty sure most every FM2 that's up for sale has been sitting unused for a very long time. I wouldn't worry about a BNIB any more than any other FM2.

rossb · January 30, 2017

It's kind of a question for a technician really. I do not know the answer myself. I did buy a FM2n last year ($60.00) and the guy said it had not been used for years. . I figured it's an old camera so I sent it in for a CLA before putting it to use and the camera is great. I shoot it almost every day.

I guess the return policy will make a lot of difference in the risk. Camera's are getting old and I do not see the Titans for sale much anymore. Titans being defined as Nikon FM2n or Leica M6.

JDMvW · January 30, 2017

Interestingly (or not), I've always had some suspicion that "like new" Soviet vintage cameras may have been ones that never worked and were not practical for "finishing up the assembly" by a repairman. The old "beaters" usually seem to work pretty well unless they are literally worn down to a stub.

I don't think this is probably the case with middle-period Nikon SLRs ;)

Nor do I think it likely that a "minty" FM2 is likely to be quite the collector shelf-queen candidate as an early F or some such, but then I am not a Nikon collector, exactly.

Like some sultan, I have actually used every shootable old camera that I have, but I do confess some members of the harem see more use than others. :|

The fun of this for me is to "re-enact" the camera shooting I would love to have done when I was a boy-child, but couldn't afford to do then.

This is the latest addition (F90~N90) to my testing of early AF cameras in general:

DWScott · January 30, 2017

Unless the price is unreasonable, I saw go for it. Truly new, or simply lightly used, it's still older. It might need a CLA. But at least you will be CLA'ing a like-new camera :-)

I purchased a new-in-box, new-old-stock Wollensak 135mm in a Graflex Raptar shutter. No argument about it -- totally brand new and un-used. I assumed it would be sticky and slow from having sat around in it's original box, surrounded by that stringy "easter basket grass" packing material. Nope! Worked like a charm! Spotless and runs as though it was made yesterday. So perhaps your Nikon will fare just as well.

vrankin · January 31, 2017

Coming in late on this, but agree with any who suggested that you check (with a certified repair person?) for gunky lubricants, out-of-calibration shutter, gummed-up mirror damper and door light seals.

Wouter Willemse · January 31, 2017

Vince, I also tend to shop for EU goods only, and have mostly good experience with Ebay shops (there are various large ones, no doubt you cross them as you search); they tend to have quite a lot of choice and decent conditions on the sale, and good descriptions with real photos of the actual product (serial number clearly shown so you can verify). Prices may not always be the most lowest out there, but my experiences with those shops have consistently been better than they have been with individuals. A decent FM2 shouldn't be hard to find.

glen_h · February 4, 2017

My FM that I bought new not so long after it came out, and didn't use for some years after I got a DSLR, usually works, but not quite as well as it should. It sat around for about seven years without use.

I got a used FE2 last year for a low price, and so far seems to work fine. Unlike the FM2, the FE2 has an electronically timed (except for one speed) shutter.

I think these days, even a well used camera might have been sitting around too long.

You could have just as much problems with old lubrication.

Mostly I have had good luck with older cameras. For the prices I pay, I can't afford CLA on them.

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