Nikon D800e focus issues

<p>I have been shooting Nikon since I first bought a DSLR 35 years ago.</p>

<p>I bought the 800e about a year after it came out - hoping that Nikon would have worked out the bugs by then.</p>

<p>At first I was wowed by the resolution, depth and image quality. I shoot a lot in low-light and the high ISO performance was great.</p>

<p>As time went on I started to notice that there were a rather large percentage of photos that were just slightly out of focus. Because I was often shooting wide open and with low shutter speeds I initially thought it was user error. As time went on and I tested the camera in bright light and with high shutter speeds - I realized I was the proud owner of one of the dreaded cameras with focus issues. I can't even begin to tell you how many theater, dance and concert performance shoots have been compromised over the years by the use of this camera.</p>

<p>As I read more about the issue it became clear that 1. Nikon was not acknowledging the problem and 2. Nikon did not have a fix for it.</p>

<p>This past summer I was in Europe for one of the largest music festivals there and they happened to have a Nikon service desk at the festival that I checked my camera. They were unambiguous - yes your camera has focus issues that you will see at wide open apertures. You should contact Nikon in your country (USA).</p>

<p>After I heard about the unofficial recall that they had for some lucky Nikon D800 owners, I finally sent the camera in to for repair. I figured they had found a fix for the problem. Before sending it in I called Nikon and asked the person on the phone if I could be part of their recall - they said no, that it was a complicated way in which they figured out who would qualify and since I did not receive the message I did not meet these mysterious criteria. On top of this the person refused to acknowledge the problem and kept repeating that if I have an issue I should send it in and it will be up to factory specs when they send it out.</p>

<p>I had to laugh a little at that - there was a problem with Nikon's factory specs which is why I was in this situation to begin with.</p>

<p>Anyway - I send it in and get an estimate for $250!! I call and remind them this is known problem in the community even though Nikon wont acknowledge it - now that they have determined my camera has this problem don't they have an ethical responsibility to fix it free of charge. No deal - they insist that they will not do the repair without payment.</p>

<p>So I pay up and get the camera back. I have to say they were prompt with the turnaround time, and I got it back in a week. Unfortunately it appears nothing was done to it. The focus issue is still there. I have now tested it for about a month and the focus is still off! The D7000 and D750 that I own have better focus than this expensive camera!</p>

<p>Really disappointed in Nikon's quality, service and their treatment of loyal customers.</p>

<p>Has anyone successfully had this issue resolved?</p>

<p>My D800E was fixed under warranty...but I tested it, and discovered the left-side AF accuracy issue, within days of acquiring the camera.<br>

It is sleazy of Nikon not to fix the issue now, if in fact the issue was there as a factory defect.<br>

Did you buy with a credit card that can extend the warranty an additional year, or is it too late?<br>

Return it to them, with example photos on CD/USB drive, or actual prints that demonstrate the problem. It really helps prevent them from retuning it unfixed. I used the L.A. office, and walked it in.</p>

Did you fine tune the focus for each lens that you use? It is normal that this needs to be done if you plan on shooting at

f/1.4 or f/2 a lot. In low light the AF results have more variation than on bright daylight. Unfortunately I noticed that my

D800 focus error depended not only on lens but also the distance to the subject and colour of the light. Nikon did cover

the adjustment of the AF for free for me but it didn't fundamentally solve the problem. The D810 solved most of it but I still

need to fine tune most fast lenses. But the distance and colour dependent effects are mostly gone in my D810 - in fact I'm

very happy with the improvements they have done. The D750's AF system is still newer and I would expect it to give even

better AF in low light than the D810. But the latter is quieter and that makes it a better choice for some concerts and other

events where a loud sound could disturb the listening experience.

 

I know it is a huge issue as there were so many of these cameras sold. I would just cut my losses and use what works

instead of trying to get Nikon to improve the D800E at this point. If the D750 works well for you, use that instead. The D5

should be coming in 2016 and probably with a new AF system that will likely propagate to the successor of the D810.

<p>Mukul, at what aperture(s) do you notice the focus error? If it's at apertures away from maximum then it could be due to lens focus-shift on stopping down. This phenomenon affects many wide-aperture lenses and can be readily seen with the 85mm f/1.4 G Nikkor in the Photozone.de test here: http://www.photozone.de/nikon_ff/606-nikkorafs8514ff?start=1</p>

<p>If you scroll down to the "Bokeh Fringing" section and mouseover the various apertures, you can clearly see that the plane of best focus creeps backwards as the lens is stopped down.</p>

<p>There's also the issue of residual spherical aberration that most wide-aperture lenses suffer from. This can prevent AF being accurately set by the camera. It also prevents good visual focus being seen by the eye, because effectively there isn't just one plane of best focus but a spread of focus.</p>

<p>That's not to say that your D800E doesn't have a focus issue; just that there may be lens issues to take into consideration. If the camera is performing fine with, say an f/2.8 prime wide open, then perhaps re-assessing your wide-aperture lenses might be in order. It might be worth running some comparison tests between viewfinder AF and Live View focussing. There may also be a slight displacement between the AF area shown in the viewfinder and the actual subject area read by the AF sensor.</p>

<p>FWIW, my experience has been that Nikon's AF is variable in accuracy between shots anyway. It can certainly vary between the ends of a zoom range, and that some subjects are more difficult for AF to latch onto than others. I also know that most of my (MF) f/1.4 lenses give their best focus when the camera says they're slightly front-focused according the electronic rangefinder. Now that I know this I can simply set the focus to where the ER just starts to flicker from a closer focus.</p>

<p>Ilkka Nissilla wrote: "Nikon did cover the adjustment of the AF for free for me but it didn't fundamentally solve the problem. The D810 solved most of it but I still need to fine tune most fast lenses. But the distance and colour dependent effects are mostly gone in my D810 - in fact I'm very happy with the <a id="itxthook6" href="/nikon-camera-forum/00ddrh" rel="nofollow">improvements<img id="itxthook6icon" src="http://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/icon1.png" alt="" /></a> they have done."<br>

This is pretty sad. I can understand that you may be very "happy" with the improvements "they have done" despite the fact that it is not as it should have been to begin with. However, most will not be and should not be contented with Nikon's shoddy attitude to about this. For most, even professionals, pocket change does not buy this camera. To say that "the D810 solved most of it" is also unacceptable for most. At this price point, there should not be any technical issues at all. A sad after-taste to the continuing Nikon-Canon saga...and many know where this seems to be going.<br>

</p>

<p><a href="/photodb/user?user_id=2786838">Keith B:</a> Thanks for your comments and sorry you had to go through this. It's too late now for either the Nikon or Credit Card warranty to apply. I'm on the east coast and mailed it into the NY/NJ office.</p>

<p><a href="/photodb/user?user_id=2403817">Rodeo Joe:</a> I've tried multiple lenses and conversely tried the lenses on other bodies - the problem is not with the lens it's the 800e.The lenses, including the Nikon 2.8 series are tack sharp on the other bodies. <br>

As I said in my question - it's most apparent wide open when the focal plane is narrow and focusing is critical.</p>

<p>in other words Mukul, this is as they say, quite unacceptable. i do hope somebody from Nikon is reading and taking note of this discussion and will do the right thing.</p>

<p><a href="/photodb/user?user_id=19054">Ilkka Nissila:</a> Yes there are fixes - such as trying to fine tune each lens - I've tried this, just so you know, and it does not fix the problem - you can also not shoot wide open, but this is a shoddy product and as <a href="/photodb/user?user_id=1616050">zlight B </a>says Nikon's attitude towards this has been unprofessional. Do they have a fix for the problem or not? If not - why charge me $250 for doing nothing? If they have a better focusing system in the 810 have they finally figured it what the problem was - why can they not fix it in the 800?</p>

<p>Other die hard Nikon enthusiasts have been making this Point, for example "Nikon Quality Assurance Gone Bad" by Photographylife, Thom Hogan Declares D800 "Not Recommended" etc. Nikon needs to wake up and take responsibility by fixing the camera that many of us spent huge amounts of money on. For many whose lively hood depends on this - reliability is critical and Nikon used to be known for it. </p>

 

I have a Nikon d800e and a d810. All of my lenses are top of the line nikons. I had "focus" issues with both bodies on

most lenses. I finally used lens align to do AF fine tuning. Once done correctly, the majority of the focus issues went away.

With any large high res sensor, you must do AF fine tuning to get good even results and you must rethink every step in

your shooting techniques and change anything that could contribute to non sharp images.

 

Joe

<p>Joseph. I recently bought a D7200 and kit 18-140mm lens. Straight out of the box the focus was unacceptable at the short end of the zoom and needed a large "Fine Tune" adjustment. This threw the long end of the zoom out, and I had to set a compromise tuning that didn't give exact focus at all. Then the D7200 body developed a shutter fault and was eventually replaced.</p>

<p>The replacement body showed hardly any need for AF fine-tuning <em>with the same lens</em>. The conclusion I draw from this is that Nikon need to revise their AF module factory adjustment procedures - as well as generally pull their socks up on QC. AF should <em>not</em> need fiddling with on an individual lens basis by the customer. It should just darn-well work! It's a simple servo system, not rocket science, and if the AF sensor is placed in the same virtual plane as the image-sensor there should be absolutely no issue.</p>

<p>As I mentioned on a separate thread, Nikon did fix my D800's focus issue.</p>

<p>Along with this complaint, they also cleaned the sensor and replaced some components with new parts. All free. I would recommend discussing the problem with Nikon again.</p>

<p>By the way, I have never meddled with Nikon's factory setting on any camera or lens (e.g., "fine-tuning" this and that) - worried I would mess it up - from nothing to something. I have used Nikon since the film days, through a succession of cameras and lenses. May be I am just lucky, my Nikon equipment have worked well. If there was a problem (e.g. the recent 200-500 focus problem), it was always fixed to satisfaction.</p>

<p><a href="/photodb/user?user_id=2403817">Rodeo Joe:</a> Thanks for sharing that - Couldn't agree more. Nikon needs to understand that most people are not interested in applying band-aid solutions to shoddy products after shelling out lots of money.</p>

<p><a href="/photodb/user?user_id=291498">Mary Doo: </a>That's encouraging to hear - I will speak with them again. Good to know the problem can be fixed. Surprised they did it for free. Was your camera under warranty?</p>

<blockquote>

<p>That's encouraging to hear - I will speak with them again. Good to know the problem can be fixed. Surprised they did it for free. Was your camera under warranty?</p>

</blockquote>

<p>It must have been under warranty - though I don't recall attaching a purchase receipt. That was in May of this year. Then in July, I received a "Free Maintenance Service Initiative" identifying my D800 as being eligible. Good luck with yours. Hope you get free service as well. Feel free to cite my example if they say no.</p>

<blockquote>

<p>AF should <em>not</em> need fiddling with on an individual lens basis by the customer. It should just darn-well work! It's a simple servo system, not rocket science, and if the AF sensor is placed in the same virtual plane as the image-sensor there should be absolutely no issue.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>It seems quite a number of you folks mess with Nikon's factory setting. I never had - never saw the need to, would rather not. May be I am just lucky.</p>

<p>Thanks <a href="/photodb/user?user_id=291498">Mary Doo</a>. That "Free Maintenance Service Initiative" was the unofficial recall according to many. I asked about that before I sent it in and was told it was already sent out to those who should have it and that if I did not - then I was not eligible for it. Sort of a circular argument.</p>

 

 

<blockquote>

<p>That "Free Maintenance Service Initiative" was the unofficial recall according to many. I asked about that before I sent it in and was told it was already sent out to those who should have it and that if I did not - then I was not eligible for it. Sort of a circular argument.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Sorry about that. However, my D800 was fixed (for free) before I received the "Free Maintenance Service Initiative". Was your camera under warranty? As I mentioned before, I did not attach the warranty. </p>

 

 

<p>Autofocus fine tune is a user setting, not a "factory" setting (when service adjust the AF they turn AF fine tune off and adjust it using settings not visible to the user). My experience is that generally FT is commonly needed with fast lenses (f/1.4, f/2) but with lenses with smaller maximum apertures it becomes progressively less critical to do it. Most lenses f/4 and slower seem to focus fine without focus fine tuning (I guess the optical paths to the main sensor and the AF sensor are more similar). With the 200/2 II I would be happy if they provided 0.5 increments for fine tuning. With recent camera bodies and lenses the optimal fine tune setting has been close to zero for many lenses, but with cameras and lenses made in different periods there can be greater need to make adjustments, and I've had to use basically the whole range at one time or another. My first 200/2 needed -17 on my D3 and basically the focus error was in meters, not centimeters when photographing figure skating... so it was very obvious. The newer 200/2 Mk II is +1 on my D810 but if I use the TC-14E III on that lens I need a fine tune setting of +8. After applying the fine tuning the lens focuses very accurately with the TC. With that kind of shallow depth of field the results would be unusable without focus fine tuning. When photographing approaching subjects with a very large aperture lens I even adjust the fine tune setting separately for the approach scenario (it can require 1 or 2 points more negative value of fine tune) to optimize it for the situation, and then return it to the value that I use for subjects that are relatively static. However, that's just me, I don't necessarily recommend this as it can be easy to forget to reset the value.</p>

<p>The reason I'm fine with replacing the D800 with the D810 is because it has a lot of improvements which go beyond the AF fixes, such as quietness, electronic first curtain shutter, better viewfinder clarity etc. I had expected problems in the D800 simply because I didn't think the D3 and D700 focused sufficiently accurately for 12MP images, so achieving 36 MP with high per pixel level sharpness at wide apertures would likely be beyond Nikon's reach in such a short period of development. However in the 2012 D810 things are better and I'm fairly happy with wide aperture focus performance, though it requires sometimes a helping hand of an understanding user. :-) If it hadn't been for the earthquake, tsunami and flooding in 2011, I suspect there would have been fewer problems in cameras such as the D600 and D800(E) made during this period (2011-2) but those natural disasters did happen and the QC issues are not what surprised me, but rather that Nikon survived at all. However, there is no excuse for giving bad customer service on another continent far away from any natural disasters. I guess I've been very lucky with regards to that.</p>

<p>I have D800e and I found its AF performance inaccurate. My keeper rate is down. I sent it to Nikon Service to take a look at it. They were kind enough to lend me D800 for vacation. So I used D800 during vacation I was very HAPPY with it. AF performance was fine as expected. It seldom hunt. It performed well under low light condition.</p>

<p>So I came back from vacation and get my camera back. The technician said "We checked everything. Nothing wrong with it. It is just the way it is"</p>

<p>So I had it for almost 3 years. Since then, The focus were 50-50. Under low light condition, my success rate is down to 30-70. On moving subject, I dont expect anything anymore.</p>

<p>I use this camera for one thing and one thing only: commercial. On tripod, and with LIVE VIEW Focusing.</p>

<p>Else (wedding, children, casual, family, vacation, journalistic, event, etc.), i use my reliable Canon 5Dmk3.</p>

<p>I have purchased numerous Nikon AF SLR bodies since the N8008 in 1989 and also tested a bunch of different DSLR test samples from Nikon USA. I have never experienced AF problems on any one of them out of the box, including an early D800 test sample. Back in 2012, Nikon started shipping the D800E about a month after the D800. By the time I determined that the D800E had no significant issues with moire, I ordered one in mid April 2012. By that time various <strong>D800 left AF issues</strong> had already surfaced on the internet. Due to extreme shortage, I had two wait a full two months to received my D800E. During those two months, there was lots and lots of discussion on the left AF issue such that when I got my D800E in mid June, I immediately tested its AF to no end, and I found no problems whatsoever.</p>

<p>Back in 2012, based on estimates from Bjron Rorslett and Thom Hogan, around 20% of the D800/D800E had this left AF issue. In other words, 4 out of 5 were fine, so it is not all that surprising that the one D800 and one D800E I have used have no problems. Incidentally, the wide-spread (~20%) problem is related to the left AF points, not a general AF problem.</p>

<p>Out of the 20+ new Nikon SLR I have used over the years, only two of them had problems right out of the box. Interestingly, both happened in 2014. The first D810 test sample I got from Nikon had electronic problems and generated a lot of corrupted image files, but the replacement D810 was totally fine. My own D750 had a defective GPS connection that I only discovered a few months later. Nikon fixed that under warranty. Both of them seem to be isolated issues.</p>

<p>AF fine tune is now a necessary feature due to the dense pixels. Camera bodies and lenses don't stay perfect over time. My D800E accidentally fell from a chair onto a hardwood floor last year. Initially I thought that was not a big deal, but now the D800E requires -20 AF fine tune; I am going to send that to Nikon for adjustment. My 200-400mm/f4 AF-S VR was fine for several years, but after many trips, its AF is now a bit off and needs some fine tune to get the best results.</p>

<p>With 36MP and higher FX and 24MP DX, AF precision is now very critical. I am sure there are some defective Nikon DSLRs out there, in addition to the well reported D800 left AF problems. For your own sake, when you buy a new camera or a new lens, test it thoroughly and if there are indeed issues, <strong>exchange</strong> it for a good sample. It only takes an hour or two to check a lot of things out, and plenty of stores give you 2 weeks to a month for exchange. If you instead send it to Nikon for repair, you take the risk of getting into a debate on whether it is "within specs" and there are a lot of gray areas for AF accuracy, including user errors.</p>

<p>In the OP's case, after Nikon USA fixed a problem for a fee, they provide a 6-month warranty on that fix. If you are not happy with the repair, definitely get back to them. However, it is best to deal with any manufacturing defects ASAP and get the item replaced. Once the exchange period is over, you will be in a disadvantage position if you own a defective product.</p>

It's a shame that nikon has a history of releasing new camera's with issues like the d200/d800/d800e/d750 just to name a few. I recently

upgraded and bought a used d800 with low shutter count for a great price. I knew about the left focus issue and test the best I knew how

and lucky it doesn't appear to be effected. I was looking at a d750 but after that recall I said no. Especially the cost when you buy them

new. I'd keep bugging them

<p>My plan to replace my aging D700 has been put on hold. Thanks to everyone for the warning.</p>

<p><a href="/photodb/user?user_id=412357">John Stockdale: </a>I'd wait it out a little. Photographylife has exchanged the Nikon D800 for a Panasonic GH4. Check out their article "Goodbye D800, Hello GH4!" Supposedly Panasonic is going to release an upgrade for the camera in Spring of 2016.</p>

<p><a href="/photodb/user?user_id=820716">Manuel Garcia:</a> Good luck - the D800 is a good camera - it's just disappointing that Nikon is handling it in this unprofessional way. Thanks for the encouragement.</p>