Moving towards Creative Cloud ??

 

 

From the Adobe website:

 

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<a href="http://www.adobe.com/products/creativecloud/faq.html"><br />Will the cost of my membership ever increase?</a>

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<p>When you purchase directly from Adobe, the cost of an annual membership will not go up during the first 12 months of your membership. It is possible that the cost of the month-to-month membership will increase, but if it does, you will be notified and given the opportunity to cancel.</p>

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There is nothing there about any exceptions.

<p>To put "<strong>lipstick on a pig</strong>" is a rhetorical expression, used to convey the message that making superficial or cosmetic changes is a futile attempt to disguise the true nature of a product. Wikipedia</p>

<p>"lipstick on a pig" - I believe there's a plug-in for that.</p>

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<p>...I think what bothers me about CC is that the sole motivation behind it is to benefit Adobe's cash flow and not to make a better product.</p>

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<p>Seems the new model requires the product get better or why continue to subscribe. And so far, there have been 2 updates and some new features (Adobe Generator) in a relatively short time. Further, what company doesn't want to have better cash flow? You will see some new features coming that are more photo centric in the near future. </p>

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<p>Seems the new model requires the product get better or why continue to subscribe. </p>

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<p> <br>

That's a pretty simple question.<br>

<br />Because I can only go back to CS4 if I stop subscribing.</p>

<p>The web paqe for the special $9.99 is copied below. Ived copied the link. So it seems they can raise it when they renew your contract after the first year. It also says you have 30 days notice to cancel. Since they will be billing your credit card automaticallyu, they will just increase it and charge your account without giving notice if that's what they decide to do. If you don't notice the charge until the second month and want to cancel, you have to pay 50% of the balance of the contract or half of eleven months (5 1/2 ) months. I assume they won't allow you to use their Cloud for the 5 1/2 months even though you paid 5 1/2 months. I don't know what the comment "removal of seats" mean other than this was extracted from another product where they are selling to classes or business that reduce the quasntity of contraqcts for their people. Of course that wouldn't apply since this product for the special is only for individuals. So even this YTerms and COnditions doesn't make sense. </p>

<p><a href="http://www.adobe.com/store/en_us/popup/offer/ccm_photoshop_app_offer.html">http://www.adobe.com/store/en_us/popup/offer/ccm_photoshop_app_offer.html</a></p>

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<h1>Terms and conditions</h1>

<p>VOID WHERE PROHIBITED OR RESTRICTED BY LAW. Eligible customers may purchase an Adobe Creative Cloud membership to Photoshop CC™ and Adobe® Photoshop Lightroom 5 bundled together for a reduced price. Offer valid for purchases of an annual plan, which requires a 12-month contract. This offer is only available to customers who purchase directly from the Adobe Store or by calling a regional Adobe Call Center. Residents of embargoed countries are not eligible. This offer is limited to one (1) purchase per customer. Offer is subject to U.S. export control laws and laws where the recipient resides. Offer may not be assigned, exchanged, sold, transferred, or combined with any other discount or offer, or redeemed for cash or other goods and services. Offer is valid until December 31, 2013, and can be changed without notice.<br>

<strong>Renewal</strong> After the first 12 months, we will automatically renew your contract based on the current price of the offering.<br>

<strong>Cancellation</strong> We'd hate to see you go, but if you cancel within the first 30 days starting from your contract date, we'll give you a full refund. Otherwise, you'll be billed 50% of your remaining contract obligation for the cancellation or removal of seats. If you ever need to cancel, just call <a href="http://www.adobe.com/go/CCMTeamSupport">Customer Support</a>.</p>

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<p>I chatted on-line with Adobe regarding the $9.99 special. Below is the transcript. It seems they can raise the rate but you will be notified of the new rate before the second and subsequent years contracts become effective. It also appears that they won't raise it during any one contract year only at the beginning. There's a phone number l;isted on their site where you can verify this info for yourself.</p>

<p>Transcript:<br>

One moment please while we route your chat to a representative.</p>

<p>Thank you for contacting Adobe Sales. My name is Gavin. How may I help you today?</p>

<p>Gavin: Hi, may I have your first name please?</p>

<p>you: Hi; If I buy the special $9.99 per month product, which programs can I use?</p>

<p>you: My name is Alan</p>

<p>Gavin: Hello Alan</p>

<p>Gavin: I'm happy to help you with that information.</p>

<p>Gavin: When subscribed to Photoshop Photography Program you can use Photoshop CC and Lightroom 5 our current latest versions.</p>

<p>you: What happens after the firwst year? Can you raise the monthly rate to above $9.99?</p>

<p>Gavin: Alan, we don't have plans to change the price, but just like all of our other prices for our services and products, however the prices may go up or remain the same.</p>

<p>Gavin: We'll update the info on site</p>

<p>Gavin: Well, how soon are you planning to use the software?</p>

<p>you: If your price goes up after the first year, can I cancel?</p>

<p>Gavin: Yes, you can renew the plan after the year to continue using or can unsubscribe.</p>

<p>you: I understand that there is a 50% penalty if I cancel after 30 days after renewal. Is that true?</p>

<p>Gavin: Yes.</p>

<p>Gavin: We'd hate to see you go, If you decide to end a one-year membership before the 12-month period is over, you will be charged 50% of the remaining amount left on your contract. Memberships canceled within the first 30 days will be refunded in full.</p>

<p>you: What about the second year renewal? If the rates go up, when will you notify me and how? Can I cancel the second year's contract as well? When?</p>

<p>Gavin: Yes and even the second year plan will be on one year commitment and will be notification through e-mail</p>

<p>you: How many days will Adobe gove me with the notioficatiojn to raise the rates? Will I have time to cancel before the thiorty days runs out?</p>

<p>Gavin: The notification will be before your subscription renewal date.</p>

<p>you: OK. Can there be any increaased during the second or third or subsequent years or will the first nmonth's charge be firm for all 12 months?</p>

<p>Gavin: Yes, it will renew from the the 12th month</p>

<p>you: OK Thank you very much for the info. Good bye.</p>

<p>Gavin: Let me help you with the direct link to place the order, Okay</p>

<p>you: I'm getting this info for other people who are interested. Thnaks again.</p>

 

<p>I am a resistor for now, and I am also a photographer and heavily use CS6 and Lightroom4 in addition to the Nik pugins. I find them quite adequate. Perhaps I'll change my view later. Technology bites us all for a hefty chunk of cash each year. I'm not ready to surrender to Adobe yet. Larry </p>

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<p>I hope you're right. Where did they say this? Do you have a link?</p>

 

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<p>Yes I do, as a matter of fact: <a href="http://blogs.adobe.com/jnack/2013/09/photographers-a-great-new-deal-on-photoshop-cc-lightroom.html">here</a>:</p>

 

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<p>To be clear, $9.99 is not an introductory price. It is the price for those of you who sign up by December 31, 2013.</p>

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<p>To reiterate: the intention is not to get you in at $9.99/mo. then crank up the price after a year. $9.99 is the expected ongoing price.</p>

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<p>Because I can only go back to CS4 if I stop subscribing.</p>

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<p>Right. In my case CS6. We subscribers need a fall back plan. That's either go back to an older version of Photoshop or move to another product. I did test 3rd party options for about 10 minutes (Corel), going back to the last perpetual version of Photoshop makes far more sense to me.</p>

<p>At some point, thinking about an CC exit strategy IF necessary, the question becomes what do you need to do with your legacy files with proprietary Adobe edits. If you are really done editing, then no worries, with a TIFF you could keep the layers or just flatten and you are done. If you feel you need to revisit editing that data, CS6 in my case should allow me to access most of the proprietary edits if necessary. I suspect that would happen +/-1% of the time, I do revisit raw processing sometimes but rarely go back to rendered images years past and re-edit. <br /> One thing we need to do is keep the installers around and easily accessible. I have copies of Photoshop installers dating back to version 2.5 (on floppies). Must have tossed 1.0./2.0, bummer. Yesterday I wanted to install CS5 on my newest machine (MacBook Pro Retina, which has no DVD drive). I initially didn't see the CS5 installer on my archive drive so I tried to download it from my Adobe account. <strong>No go! </strong>Couldn't find it there. Eventually I did find a DVD I burned and got the installer over to the MPB. <br /> We also need to consider having old hardware to run the old software! I've got two older generation Powerbooks, one that can run 10.5 and Rosetta apps, one a PowerPC (I got on Ebay recently for $150) that can in theory even boot OS9. The problem as we move foward is that we could have our old files archived and even the Photoshop installers but in the case of the newer Macbook I use, I believe CS4 couldn't be installed on it. The machine is too new!</p>

<p>Lots to consider and in a way, the subscription model and some of the concerns of unsubscribing has forced us to think about how we archive our image files, the versions of software and hardware we may need even a mere 5 years in the future. A sliver lining? 2 years ago, I really didn’t consider not upgrading Photoshop as it and the hardware matures. But today I do have a plan which includes hardware, installers and the editing state of my legacy images.</p>

<p>Keith: I suggest you read the transcript above of the conversation I had yesterday with the Adobe salesman regarding price increases for the $9.99 special. Then call Adobe to verify if the salesman is right or if the non-Adobe article you read in September is correct. Then read Andrew's post about having a backup plan. </p>

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<p>$9.99 is the expected ongoing price.</p>

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"Expected" has no legal meaning. If you took the time to look at the terms when you signed up, which I did, you would see this: <br>

</p>

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<p><strong>Renewal</strong><br />After the first 12 months, we will automatically renew your contract based on the current price of the offering.</p>

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<p><br />That's in the actual legal terms for subscribing, not someone's blog post.</p>

<p>English not being my first language, I understand the word current to mean at the time the contract is signed... but could it also mean at the time of the renewal? Not sure what the legal definition is...</p>

<p>I believe "current" means the full retail price at the date of renewal. It the known as Drug Dealer Business Model. Start the customer out with free product, get them hooked, then raise the price. Maybe occasionally sprinkle in a little free or discounted product or paraphernalia to keep the customer satisfied.</p>

<p>If you read my discussion I had in an on line chat, the Adobe salesman stated they could raise their contract amount. So their interpretation is that each subsequent year is a new contract. If that wasn't the interpretation, then the Terms of the agreement would have been written something like <em>"the discount rate of $9.99 remains in perpetuity." </em> </p>

<p>You are not signing up for a month at a time either. You purchase an entire year. For example, if you are in the third year, and you decide to cancel after the first thirty days when you get all your money back, you will pay a penalty of 50% of the remainder of the charges for that year. So if you were in the second month and cancelled, and the fee was let's say $20 a month for that year, you would have to pay a penalty of ten months at $20 times 50% or $100 penalty. </p>

<p>Nothing's forever except death and taxes.</p>

<p>John Regarding the Drug Dealer Business Model, you didn't mentioned withdrawing from Photoshop. Photographers may have to go to rehabs. </p>

>>> If you decide to end a one-year membership before the 12-month period is over, you will be charged

50% of the remaining amount left on your contract.

 

Interesting... Just like financial institution "early withdrawal penalties" and wireless telecom company

"early termination fees."

 

At least with wireless telecoms, when a cellphone is purchased with a service plan, the ETF has a real

purpose, to recover that subsidy prepaid by the company.

 

I wonder if Adobe is becoming more bank-like and telecom-like in the eyes of customers, now that users first need to ponder and strategize "exit strategies" and procedures in order to feel comfortable going forward?

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<p>It the known as Drug Dealer Business Model. Start the customer out with free product, get them hooked, then raise the price.</p>

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<p>Just like '<em>grazing</em>' at Whole Foods! Gets me every time. ;-)<br>

I suspect we'd be considered naive to think that the price of subscription will never go up. Then there is the US minimum wage, maybe there is hope! </p>

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<p>I don't need CC for my processing as I use Lightroom and can edit from there into Photoshop and back when necessary (which today is pretty rare). But if I did, I would need some kind of assurance from Adobe that they have significantly stepped up their security practices. Until then, no credit card number for you...</p>

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Same here, Brad. Don't trust them and disappointed in their lackadaisical response. So instead, I bought LR 5 from Amazon on Black Monday. And impressive, it was purchased Monday night and the dvd was in my mailbox on Wed morning.</p>

<p>Brad: The 50% penalty is to "hook" people into not cancelling. It's part of John's Drug Dealer Business Model.</p>

>>> Brad: The 50% penalty is to "hook" people into not cancelling.

 

I totally agree. That appears to be the only business purpose.

<p>Part of the hook is to give them your credit charge card so they can take out monthly fees and automatically renew the second and each subsequent year with no positive action on your part. </p>

<p>If you wanted to be more secure as far as your credit card is concerned as well as more informed, they should allowm you to pay an entire year up-front. Then renew it if I choose before the year runs out. That's how Norton works on my virus protection software. That's a more busines and "honest" approach. Adobe on the other hand doesn't show me anything of good will on their part. Their change in business model is serious and they intend to maximize their profits and how they get it and leave you few options. Does not look cheap as time marches on.</p>

<p>Photoshop withdrawal symptoms. (feel free to add your own) 1. Shakiness during hand held camera shots. 2. Difficulty or Inability to compose a shot due to mental fuzziness. 3. Night sweats and anxiety attacks worrying about missed deadlines (because you haven't learned the new software yet). 4. Feeling alienated from regular people because they just don't understand what you are going through. 5. Looking wistfully at that spare bathroom thinking what a great darkroom it would make when you go back to film.</p>

<p>6. Dreaming of the days when you'd drop your film off at 1 Hour Photo and be going home with the prints an hour later to show to your wife.</p>

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<p>"Expected" has no legal meaning. If you took the time to look at the terms when you signed up, which I did, you would see this: <br>

Renewal<br />After the first 12 months, we will automatically renew your contract based on the current price of the offering.</p>

 

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<p>Jeff, if you're going to contradict, you really need to keep up - we're already way past discussing that phrase: my reference to the blog post is explicitly in response to questions about its meaning and the implications of the "After the first 12 months..." part.</p>

<p>I'll say it again: the blog post (which itself links to an official Adobe website page, where the second of the two phrases I quote comes from) <em>is a direct response by Adobe to questions about what is actually meant to early (£9.99) subscribers by "...based on the current price of the offering".</em><br>

<em><br /></em>Or do you actually think this is the first time any of this has been discussed on the internet?</p>

<p>I couldn't care less whether or not people their hard-earned on CC, but I'm sick of the wilful, ignorant "<em>I know better than Adobe...</em>" denial being shown by some on this thread.</p>

<p>So you go ahead and put whatever interpretation on CC's pricing that you like - I'll continue to accept the advice of Vince Hendrickson, Adobe's Photoshop VP; and John Nack, Adobe's Principal Product Manager, either of whom are going to know a damn' sight more about Adobe's pricing plans than the naysayers here know... </p>