Fiodor

Thank you. Yes, air bells. It makes sense. So probably it has nothing to do with the fact of my D76 being too old… I agitate the first 30 seconds of the first minute and then 5 every 30 seconds. I think this is the most standard (though some people do it 10 seconds every minute). Anyway, I always rap after the agitations, two times. What I have never done is to agitate immediately after pouring, but I pour, I agitate 30 seconds, and then rap. I could rap also in between the pouring and the first agitation. I know the first minute is crucial. Do you think that the lack of rapping after the pouring could cause these bubbles to appear and create these marks? Or maybe am I not rapping hard enough? I also need to watch more attentively if there are bubbles before pouring, as Glen_h said. I think not, but who knows, I am only worried about the temperature. But the developer is always quiet for several minutes (at least 30 minutes but usually more) because it is submerged in cold water waiting to reach the 20ºC.

I can see them on the negative, and it is not dirt stuck to the film. It seems to be something about the process. It never happened to me in the first rolls I processed. I came back to processing with the same batch of D-76, after a year and a half hiatus. So I saw these circles on the image I am posting, but then I saw again a roll I processed some days ago (also after the hiatus), and I can see some circles on certain images, but because they are more subtle I didn't notice them before. The image I am posting is the one where there are more circles and they are more noticeable. So, in this thread How to know if mixed D-76 has expired? , when I concluded that the processing was successful, now I could say that yes, the images are well developed, but there are these circles which shouldn’t be there and which weren’t present on the negatives processed with more fresh chemicals. What are they? Is the problem the developer or the fixer? Or the stop bath or something else? Also, in the roll of the image I’m posting, there are some marks in the borders of the film. Look at one of them in the third image. I think I saw them on a previous roll, processed with fresh chemicals. But they are more numerous in this roll. Probably they have nothing to do with the circles… but what are they?

Okay. How much time before processing or manipulating the film should you take the roll out of the freezer?

Do you mean exposing the 36 shots of a roll with the same image? I mean, shooting 36 times the same still subject? And then developing a piece of it (difficult to cut exactly a frame) every time you develop a new roll?

How much time could you leave an exposed film in the refrigerator? I read somewhere that color film is less resistant than B&W in this sense. And also, that if you underexpose a film with the intention of overdeveloping (pushing), the images are more prone to be altered. So keeping an underexposed color film would be especially risky. At least this is what I read somewhere, in a forum, article or something. I have had an underexposed color film in my refrigerator for two months, is this too much?

Following Biil C's instructions, I rebleached and refixed a half-frame. I don’t notice any difference. I used the same chemicals (the liter of bleach never aerated and the old solution of fixer). I applied 6:30 minutes each of them. So the film is apparently well bleached and fixed. Also, I realized that the orange veil that I see in the scans is eliminated more simply not adjusting individual color levels, but merely increasing the general (RGB) black input level on the Epson Scan. In general, just moving this adjustment a few points, I mean 5 o 10 points, doesn’t imply having an orange tint or not, as far as I remember. I don’t know if this is related to the alleged denser “base fog”, which is only subtle. Considering all this, I may say that, apparently, the three images were successfully processed. I still have doubts with the “base fog” and the sharpness of the numbers written in the border of the film (I don’t know how they call them in English). And I think I could process a new roll without major fear. I learned a lot, so again thank you for the contribution to the thread. Here is a scan of the rebleached and refixed piece side-by-side with the original piece. And then the same composition but with 10 or so less points of black input, letting the orange veil be visible.

@Bill C I did it. When it dries, I will observe it side-by-side with the other piece. And also I will scan the two pieces together and post the image. When I said I think the image is orangish, I meant the positive, the final image. So in that case the negative would be bluish or something, but I don’t notice that at first sight. I think the Epson Scan software would automatically show white walls as white, so I don’t understand quite well. I think there is something strange, but I may be wrong.

@Bill C , thank you very much. Do you think an orange tint could be caused by a defective process? Can a defective developer provoke such a color alteration? In principle, I have the impression that there is a mild orange tint. Should the negative look cyan or something? Well, I don’t see that. I could do the test you suggested. Should this half frame be immersed in a glass or something with just enough liquid to cover it? O should I process in the tank with 300 ml? Based in your description, I guess I can’t bleach without fixing and then washing and then applying final rinse. I mean, I can’t do any step without doing the following ones, can I?

Thank you for all the replies. I really appreciate the information. I asked this because the fixer I have is “expired” according to Kodak and also the solution I mixed two years ago is way beyond its recommended storage life. Of course, I could prepare and new solution with the “expired” fixer. Or buy new fixer if it is necessary. So… I guess the clearing time test is not possible for color. Or else maybe it would be well-known. I also supposed that the fact that the fixer clears film quickly, 30 or 40 seconds, is a good indicator, but maybe that is not enough. I am giving more details about my experience with this expired fixer in this thread: How do you know if color chemicals are still working properly?

esterday, after reading some of the replies, I processed three images. I used the same solution of fixer and the same non-aerated bleach. As usual, with the help of four syringes (one for water), I prepared 600 ml of developer solution for developing two rolls in my tank. In this case, I used only 300ml and I have the other 300 for other roll. I don’t know. I compared the negative with the first one I developed two years ago, which was the same film (Kodak Colorplus 200). This last roll is a tiny more dense, but I guess this is normal. But also the numbers and words printed are a bit more blurry, not so sharp (is this common?). And the “base fog” is also a bit more dense (is this normal, even in the same model of film?). I don’t have another Colorplus 200 developed by me to compare. Then I scanned the images and from the first preview I saw something strange. One possibility is that the auto-color of the Epson Scan gives a clear tint because there is a strong color of one object in the foreground, and so it compensates. I know this, and usually if this happens, I change the levels, but I am not sure it is only about this. The third images is not very strange, it is a wide shot… I realized that I needed more normal shots, like a park, a green grass and a blue sky (and I feel stupid because I spent like 4 hours to process these three images). My question is : when the chemicals are old, can we expect changes in color, a general tint or some alteration that confuses the scanner software? If this is the case, is it about the developer or… maybe the bleach? Here are the three images as the Epson Scan auto-adjusted, and then a personal adjustment made in the same software and/or Photoshop (I know that the best way to judge a negative would be to see it with one’s own eyes).

Thank you for all the replies. Really great information. I forgot to mention that I ask because I didn’t use the chemicals for a year, and they are all “expired” according to the indications of the bottles. I bought them in 2017, like two years ago. The developer (the three bottles) expired by mid-2018. The fixer expired in November 2017. Bleach in mid-2017 (this was originally bought before the rest of chemicals; I just got a 1 liter bottle from someone). I have the original 2,5 liters can of fixer, and also a 700ml solution I did two years ago mixing it 1:1 with water, as indicated. I used this solution to process 8 rolls, the last one more than a year ago. I think the recommended capacity of a liter of mixer solution 10 rolls. And also Kodak recommends not using a fixer solution for more than eight weeks, but I used the solution in December 2017, long after that limit, and it was okay. Of course, I could mix a new solution of fixer with the original “expired” fixer. I still have a lot! Bleach was never aerated. I mean, only when I opened the bottle to process. So in the last year it has been resting there in a closed bottle. Eight color rolls, that is all I processed. But yesterday…

How do you know if Kodak Flexicolor chemicals are still working properly? (before processing important negatives) For instance: - Developer (not mixed): I recently posted a thread about D-76 and based on the comments of fellow posters I developed a leader in ambient light to see if it got black at the indicated time. Can I do the same test with color developer? Of course, I could also, apart from this test, process a couple of images. But I like the test because it gives you a good indication before processing any images. - Bleach (not mixed): …?? The color? Another indication? - Fixer (mixed with water): Can the clearing time test be used with color fixer? How is the calculation? I just posted another thread about this. - Final Rinse (not mixed): …?? Is it good for ever?

Can the clearing time test be used with color fixer? I use Kodak Flexicolor fixer. If so, how is the calculation? In b&w fixer, you have to double the clearing time. For example, if the film clears in 30 seconds, you have to fix for 1 minute… though the recommended minimum time for my fixer is 2 minutes (I don’t get this quite well) My mix of Flexicolor fixer also clears film very fast, in 30 or 40 seconds. But the recommended time is 6:30. So… how a test would be? If it is clearing film fast like in the beginning, does it mean that the fixer is working properly?

By the way, I developed another roll and it turned out okay.

@glen_h and @kmac , thanks for the recommendations about filters. [uSER=2403817]@rodeo_joe|1[/uSER] , I don’t understand the technicalities of your explanation. Does what you describe happen commonly? I am not sure we are talking about the same problem. My particles are black and scale-like, I mean, they are flat but with irregular shape. They appear every time I develop and I use D-76 one-shot. This particular problem doesn’t seem to be common, or else everybody would be talking about it. Curiously, I also get the particles after developing with Kodak Flexicolor developer, so I don’t discern what is going on. Yes, I could filter this dirt. But that makes me loose time and coffee filters. And, more importantly, sometimes the particles stick to the film. So this is why it would be in interesting to detect the problem and solve it. I will post a different thread about this. Thank you.

@sixtyforty The mark of the first scan is because of too much curbing of the film, I think (it happened to me). It’s great that this anti Newton glass worked fine. Now I have a question for you. I also have an Epson v500, but I only used it with the original plastic holder. Do you see a difference in sharpness in the whole image, in all images, even if they were flat? Do you have some flat (or nearly flat) negative to make a comparison (with and without the glass)? What type/brand is the glass? Is it inserted in the original holder, or how is it?

@sixtyforty Spinning is easier and cleaner, but as you see it depends on personal taste (and some people have reasons that go beyond taste). I use a Paterson tank. Is your tank similar to it? Paterson’s are designed to spin agitation. They are not hermetic so inversion is not possible without doing a mess. I use the included stick to agitate gently. First 30 seconds of the first minute, and then 5 seconds every 30 (with the stick, this means 2 turns in one direction and 2 in the opposite one). Alternatively, if you prefer so or you lost the stick, you can just spin the tank on the table, just on the surface, without even lifting it (in fact, this is what a couple of Photography professors here taught me, but I prefer the stick, and there weren't sticks in their classes!). I have only used Paterson tanks or similar, so my recommendation only applies to this kind of tank. No squeegee. The Law of Gravitation does the work. Safer and easier. I still haven’t had problems in terms of water marks. Kodak recommendation is 1,5ml of Photoflo every 300 ml, but I just used 1 ml (well, that is what the pipette says, I don’t know for sure, a syringe should be more precise), and some people use less. A bit sudsy is normal. One minute bath, first half moving the roll softly. After a good water rinse, of course. And then directly hang the tip when the film is still in the reel, open the reel (if that is possible in yours), and extend the film down to the floor, all this with much care. If you have a cabinet for drying, too much better. I am not an expert, almost as novice as you, but that is what I have been doing. You have to find your technique and stick with it, unless there is a reason to change. Do you have experience seeing negatives? Did you compare the negs processed by you with other negs? Do your processed negatives looks good, not thin? In my opinion (and in other people’s opinion), with Kodak recommendations for TRI-x and D-76 you get very thin negatives. At 68ºF, I develop for 12 minutes.

@kmac What do you mean by “stain”? To filter the developer? I’m sorry, my English is far from perfect. And yes, my current 2 years-old D-76 has some sediments. It has also had some black sediments after the process, since it was mixed. But this is probably another topic about which I am going to write another thread one of these days (with photos or videos to show exactly what I mean), to see if someone helps me to solve the mystery of these bloody sediments, which sometimes stick to the film, and then become part of the stop bath or fixer.

I kept the stock D-76 in the bottles I showed you before, just to the top. The bottles were kept in a box. And the box in a closet, against the floor. Temperatures were far from ideal. Well, in winter I guess it was okay. But in summers, even in the box in the closet, I think it is hot, at least 25ºC or more. But I read somewhere that the most important factors were air and light. And the liquid wasn’t exposed to any of these. I also read somewhere that D-76 turns brown sometimes. Mine looks the same as before, as far as I remember. I mean, I don’t know if it is a tiny bit more yellowish or transparent, but it seems to be the same.

Hi, I did the tests. 1) The leader got gradually darker and at the time recommended for normal processing at 20ºC, it was black. How much black? I don’t know, I took the film and observed it closely, it was dark. Then I immersed it again for 2 minutes, to see if it went on getting darker. I don’t know for sure if that happened, probably not, cause I couldn’t see any difference. 2) Then I developed a strip of film with the same mix I used for the leader. And I think it came out just fine. As a matter of fact, I overdeveloped +1, because I exposed -1, something I usually do, and the roll I am going to process now will be “pushed” too. I compared the negative with others I processed this way and I don’t see any difference in density. Anyway, what I think is important is that the leader turned black at the normal time of developing. I also used my 2 years-old mix of fixer (Ilford Rapid Fixer), which I previously tested watching the clearing time. It was just like before. And I know that it is possible to fix a lot of rolls with a mix. So, in my case, the six months recommended by Ilford for a solution of this fixer were also too cautious. Next weekend, I am going to develop the other roll. If something goes unexpectedly wrong, I let you know. Thanks again.

In my city I can’t get 1l packets of D-76, only the 3,8l ones. I don’t know if Amazon or another seller would send me one of these packets, and how expensive that would be, I will have to find out. I know that there are some people who mix only a part of the packet, with allegedly good results. I read some anecdotes in forums about this subject two years ago. I also know about HC-110, which seems to be a good choice for not so frequent shooters, although I would prefer to stay with the D-76 until I know it better. Anyway, right now, I just want to make these tests and decide what to do with my current mix. Then I’ll see. Thanks for the suggestion. My first 24 D-76 bottles, for 24 1:1 developments, or 12 1:0 ones:

Well, I will do the test with the leader. If it turns out to be positive, maybe then I will develop four or five images I will shoot on another roll, just to be sure. And if I am satisfied with the results, I will proceed to develop a roll I shot last week. Thanks for all the information. I will inform you how things turn out.

Thank you all. Mixing new D-76 surely would be the safest way to go. But for me it is not as cheap as for some of you. Here the one gallon packet costs like 18 dollars, and the dollar rose a lot this year, more than 100%, so basically it is not so cheap to shoot film. Anyway, I am interested in quality, but it would be a pity to throw away developer already mixed if it is as good as before, so that it is why I am interested in the facts. [uSER=2403817]@rodeo_joe|1[/uSER] : if this solid, one-tone white image without details turns black in the negative at a given time, is that enough to conclude the developer works normally? In this test we don’t have different tones, shadows, contrast, sharpness of photographed things… couldn’t they change also? Or an old developer, with the passing of time, only gets weaker in general, something that could be compensated increasing the time? Of course, I could also develop unimportant images like others suggested, but even in this case it would be interesting to know what an old developer could do to the image, to judge better the results.

How do I know if mixed D-76 is still working fine, just looking at it? What are the signs that it has expired? I have some D-76 in 150 ml glass bottles, just to the top. I mixed it like 2 years ago. In theory, it is good only for 6 months, but I know that it could last more if it is kept in good conditions, without air exposure. I opened a bottle and it looks good, the same as before, as far as I remember, which is a bit yellowish. If it looks good, does it work well? Or not necessarily?

[uSER=2403817]@rodeo_joe|1[/uSER] Yeah, the deposit is not white, but it is lighter than the film. Depending on how the light impacts the film, you see it more or less light. But it is definitely a deposit on the film, not transparent holes. I’m sorry for taking so long. But in your previous post you said you thought it wasn’t the sticky-tape... And I agree with that. The film is all stained with this substance, which doesn’t look like any adhesive material. Anyway, do you think that white spirit would do the same job as PEC-12, whatever this deposit is? I can’t get PEC-12 in my city, unless I buy it online, what would cost a lot, if they even send it. What I can buy here is a local film cleaner. Okay, the film rested on a sheet of polythene, that is a good one. Thanks