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That was an interesting era, which I remember well too. The 'space race' to build the most electronic camera, innovations like shutter priority, digital readout viewfinders and silicon metering cells! I never actually had an AE1 or AE1P. I had a 1975 EF and then when the A-series came out, an AT-1 and then the A-1 which was my dream camera. When I got more serious about photography, I bought a 10 year old (at the time) all mechanical original F1.

Okay, an 18-year-old post, but I was sniffing around as I recently bought an ML-2 and ML-3……..Both of which I previously owned. The mount adapter problem can be dealt with very easily - just use an old school Cokin square filter holder mount ring. - they have an oversized flange, which engages very well with the macro light, and then the male screw thread screws into the front of the lens. I always used that as a cheap and cheerful mount.

I was slightly confused by the initial posts. A-series all used PX28s. The 'correct' batteries are still widely available. Battery drain was not an inherent problem. But unexpected drain (like discharging when switched off or after little use) was a fault that the A-series sometimes developed after a couple of decades or more. I had an A1 repaired for that reason once. As I recall, it was due to a faulty capacitor or capacitor contact on the circuit board and a known issue. Obviously, electronics are pretty primitive on these machines, but I think FD / A series service specialists should be able to deal with it.

Indeed! A long time ago....

I remember taking a digital photograph in Bruges in 2006. It was almost dark in January. I had a then state of the art Canon EOS 5D with its full frame 12mp sensor, using the 17-40 f4L. I set the camera to 1600 ISO, hand held at 1/50 at f4.5. The outcome was amazing and it was almost a 'conversion on the road to Damascus'. This photograph would have been impossible with film. The scene was almost dark (not that you'd think so from the image. Original RAW converted to TIF. Downsized to JPEG for this post. Gary

Hi Orsetto, Thanks for an excellent summary. I think I agree that going back to the original query, the Canon New F1 may be best. Couple of quick observations: 1. I agree about the 'mechanical back up' gimmick. For over 50 years, I never recall being 'dead in the water' due to a dead battery (more likely to be an issue on a modern digital camera if you ask me!). It's a bit of a Hollywood fantasy - your battery failing as you are in the deepest Amazon or about to complete your once-in-a-liftetime ascent of the North Face of the Eiger. Hardly a real world concern for 99.99% of people who were likely to use those cameras. I always carried spare batteries for the F and A series Canons. Generally, they would give a lot of warning of their failure anyway. 2. I love Nikons too but also hate the viewfinder of the F3. I much prefer the F4, though it is a far bulkier camera. 3. The issue of the aged camera technicians 'shedding off this mortal coil' or retiring is a concern. So, cameras that might need less servicing are an important consideration. My company in Lisbon is run by two 'youthful' 60-somethings and they can do anything classic Nikon, less so Canon. They recently resurrected a Nikon F FTb meter / finder. Dealt with historical battery leakage (I bought it on spec from Japan), calibrated it and even converted it to run in modern 1.5V silver oxide PX625-type cells. Brilliant work and not many people that can do it these days. 4. In 50 years' time, I doubt if our children or our grandchildren who might be photography enthusiasts will be able to get current DSLRs and mirrorless cameras serviced with all their complex electronics and chips - even now after spare parts are no longer available after 10 years or so, it can be very difficult. Gary

That would make sense and concur with my own observations with my camera two days´ago. Anything I set below 1/125 sounded like 1/60, and all speeds below that (1/30, 1/15, etc) sounded the same, so I can accept it was 1/90. I agree with the quality of the EF metering cells. I have two Nikon F2s - one with a DP11 head (old school CdS and match simple needle metering, slow and not that reliable) and a DP3, which latches with the pre-Ai lenses, but also has the silicon cells and a LED +/- viewfinder, much better and more responsive.

Hi Orsetto, Thanks for that, I didn´t know that about the New F1 shutter. TBH, I had never used it before in that ´mechanical` mode. When I was using the camera heavily in mid-late 80s - early 90s as a pro, doing weddings and portrait commissions and travel / stock photography, etc I only ever used it in normal mode, and always carried two spare batteries, not that I ever needed them I recall. That body was one I bought new in 1983 and sold probably about 1995. My current body was one I bought online about 12 years ago. Having never really explored the issue before, I always thought (as the books say!) that the mechanical speeds worked from 1/2 to 1/2000 + B when you remove the battery. Well, after using Canon cameras for over 50 years, you can still learn new things! Gary

Hi - yes, I have one of the EFs in very good condition. Minor issue is it taking PX625 1.35 volt cells (x2 - one for the hybrid shutter and one for the meter). But I use 1.35 v zinc-air Wein cells to get round that. I am due to put a roll of film through it soon but regular checks seems to indicate that it is al good still. My model is 1975 I recall.

Yes, agree. I love the Nikon F and I have had it serviced recently including the FTN meter head and they converted it to run on modern 1.5V silver oxide PX625 clone batteries rather than the original 1.35V mercuries. But it has foibles and the ´taking the back off to load a film´is a real PITA. But we are talking about a camera launched 64 years´ago ´- the F dates from 1959, and the F1 is more than 10 years younger, and so a much more up to date design. Canon had some time to design a more modern camera. Overall, I prefer my Canon old F1. But I actually usually think of the old F1 as a more direct competitor with the Nikon F2.

Good points, Orsetto. Thanks for some great insights. With all this talk of New F1s recently, I went to check mine. I recently put a roll of E6 through it and it was all good. I checked the mechanical `back up` speeds yesterday and found a problem. With a battery fitted, the shutter functions perfectly across the whole speed range and each speed operating accurate and reliable as expected. With the battery out, the higher mechanical speeds 1/2000 to about 1/60 work as expected, as does B, with a slightly firmer mechanical push. But 1/30 to 1 second all seem to fire at between 1/60 and 1/90 (whereas that should work mechanically at the given speed). I am not sure why this is and I am not an expert on the actual workings of the electro-mechnical shutter. But this needs looking at, but not urgently, as I might use it twice a year and always with a battery. My excellent technician in Lisbon specializes in Nikon and can´t really work on the New F1 (other than to clean it, which I can do). I fear I will struggle to find someone in Portugal. I have one good company in London I can use, but that will have to wait for my next trip to the UK.

Yes, I agree in summary, the best bet for S might be a clean FE2 or FM2. Reliable, compact, versatile, fair prices secondhand and can still be serviced (but with luck, won't need it). They need AI lenses to mount (let alone work) but any non-AI ones you have or might acquire can be easily converted.

Hi Ben, thanks for the useful contribution. Taking your points (briefly) in order: 1. I agree. I always thought (again others would disagree) that the Canon New F1 was superior in many ways to the Nikon F3. In the previous generation, I agree with you that the F2 was a beautiful camera and my Nikon F2 with DP-3 is probably my favourite camera to use at the moment. It was probably the best camera around in the era 1970-80. 2. I have never been tempted by the FM3a, a bit of a boutique camera really. I have a FM2n which is fully mechanical of course. 3. I picked up an FA body from Japan on eBay earlier this year. I took a chance from a good seller with a good rep. Luckily, it turned out to be just perfect in near mint condition for $130. One roll of E6 and one of C41 shot and no problems. I like its compactness more than anything else. 4. I have never owned or used a Nikkormat or an FE or FE2. I have just used and FM and FM2 and just loved their simplicity and mechanical design and a 1/4000 top shutter speed and 1/250 flash sync on the FM2. My first real camera was a 1965 Nikon F, in 1974, when I was ten years old (third hand from my Dad). Nikon was too expensive for me as a teenager and student, so I had second hand Canon and Contax and built up a big collection of Canon. I did buy a brand new New F1 in 1982 as I was doing wedding and portrait work then to earn extra money when I was studying. I made enough money to buy a second hand F2 and F3 so I could use some of my Nikon lenses too. Happy Christmas Gary

Yes, I agree. Mine are not too bad and still work very well with the viewfinder illumination display option. When I was working part time in a camera shop in London in the pre-internet era in 1989-90, we were selling F4s new. They were highly desirable and very well regarded and many of us believed that it was the best mainstream 35mm SLR ever made (I was using Canon F1s and T-90s at the time for my pro work at the time) but the autofocus was so slow and erratic compared to the (then new) EOS system, particularly with USM lenses, that many press and sports pros were buying the EOS1's in droves and leaving Nikon. I have two EOS1's now and both still work very well - they had excellent and strong shutters - but both have dodgy LED (sic) displays now - one shows the flash charge light permanently on and the other has the * exposure lock symbol permanently on! But it doesn't seem to affect operation at all. Repairs are complex and usually not possible. Often it is the 8 bit electronic circuitry driving the display rather than the LEDs themselves that are at fault. My philosophy (see other posts) is not to store the vintage 'electronic' cameras in foam padded cases (except when transporting them). The foam degrades over time and creates acrid gases that attack the circuitry. I always 'air' my cameras and store them in cases with rigid dividers but plenty of air space. Not sure this would save LCD or LED displays though. And of course, dry conditions.

Thanks for that. Yes, I agree, I am not mad on the display of the F3. I tend to use my FM2 or F2 more, TBH. The F4 viewfinder is superb and in fact, I am taking an F4 and a couple of lenses and some C41 film this week for a family trip to Porto in northern Portugal. Both my F4s have good but not perfect LCD displays now, being 30 years old. Best GW

I just checked - the next camera after that was the T-50 and I assume T-70 too

Yes, you are right - good memory! Though it still had a slow flash sync but better than most? 1/125 if I recall

Yes - see above. All FD lenses from 1971 onwards could give and be used on cameras giving Av, Tv, M or P - or all - the AT-1 was an electronic camera body that gave metered manual with a match needle system. It was a marketing decision by Canon to not have it on the A1 or AE1. Canon also had the AV-1 which was aperture priority only with no true manual control over shutter speeds (apart from 1/60 flash sync). I bought one second hand when I was working as a pro in the late 80s / early 90s. I hated it and got rid of it quickly. On the AV-1, you set the aperture manually on the lens, showing once again that the lens system and bodies did allow for that.

I think you are lucky, my F3 has an unreadable LCD now. It's manufacture date was February 1981. I recently paid €200 for a full service and CLA as the low speeds weren't working (1/30 set on the dial would give an actual 1/8th, etc!) even in manual. I am not sure I agree with you about the simpler design. The F1N system was modular, when you added a motordrive for example, the camera switched to shutter priority. All Canon lenses from 1971 onwards could be used for aperture priority, shutter priority, manual or later program. The system was very simple and hence made things easier - every lens from 1971 onwards could be used with all all cameras. It wasn't that the Canon system was complex, it was that the Nikon system was outdated! The Canon AT-1 had metered manual with the option to move the aperture ring and then used a match needle in the viewfinder (just like the F1N). I think the decision to not have metered manual on the A-1 or AE-1, was not due to the lens 'complexity', it was just that Canon, rightly or wrongly, didn't think the target clientele would need it. I generally don't get into the Nikon versus Canon debates (it's a bit futile, like do you prefer Claret or Burgundy, Chess v. Bridge, Blues v. Jazz, etc) but sometimes there is a bit of 'the emperor's new clothes' syndrome with Nikon fans (a bit like Apple products). I admire both companies for their superb design engineering and like and use both systems. Having built up a very large collection of Canon and Nikon manual focus lenses from the 1970s- 1990s (about 35 lenses at the last count), I have now taken an informed overview about the two marques. 1. Nikon lenses were slightly better made. Less likely to yellow, or the aperture iris stop working etc. Or fall apart. 2. Canon lenses were better designed. All from 1971 do what it took Nikon another 10 years to get round to - all index automatically, no faffing around with rabbit ear connectors, or not working on some metering heads, etc. I need two metering heads (DP3 and DP-11/12) on my F2 system, to make full use of my Nikon lenses dating from 1969 onwards. All the oldies have been AI converted now. 3. Canon lenses are better in that they all have proper click half stops on the apertures - crucial if you shoot (shot) slide film. Nikon don't. For me, this is the major shortcoming of Nikon lenses of the era. I know in Av or metered manual mode the aperture ring is infinitely adjustable, but it's too easy for it to get knocked off the setting. 4. Possibly, Nikon lenses are slightly optically superior, lens for lens, though there are so many variables, that is a difficult one to call. 5. The F mount continuity is admirable with Nikon, though of course they paid the price initially in their poor auto focus design. 6. Owning about 15 Nikon and Canon bodies, and still using them all regularly, I'd say probably that the Nikon F4 was the best 35mm film camera ever made (I don't know much about Leicas!). I'd put the Canon T-90 a close second, though they are far less reliable mechanically than the F4. 7. Nikon shutters generally lasted longer than Canon's, though the Canon F1 would be an exception to that statement. G

Thanks for pointing out my error. I realised that I had three Word versions of this review and for some reason posted the earlier version that had that error. I think I am right in saying that the first vertical travel shutter Canon had was on the T-90, which thus enabled 1/250 flash sync, etc.

Yes, thanks, you are right - I'd forgotten that. See my review, where I did remember! I am not sure it is that complex compared to say the Nikon F3. The latter was fully electronic. Now most have failed / failing viewfinder LCDs and usually give problems at lower shutter speeds. But the film advance is beautiful compared to the F1, I would give you that.

In terms of the lenses, I think a lot of this is to do with fads, social media trends and 'bragging rights'. I know for example, Tarantino made the Hateful Eight using 60 year old Panavision lenses as he was shooting on film stock. But for us more humble folk, if I were a pro or an advanced amateur film maker, I'd use EF lenses of C lenses on my Canon system.

I have just added here my review of the New F1 that I wrote some time ago, that people may find useful

F1n review, January 2023 Introduction The New Canon F1 (often referred to as the F1N, but not by Canon: they just called it the F1) was produced from 1981 to about 1992. Aside from possibly the T90 of 1996, it represented the pinnacle of the Canon manual focus system. It replaced the earlier first 1970s F1 model and was a major statement by Canon in encouraging many professionals and serious photographers in moving away from the previously dominant Nikon system. Today, 40 years or more down the line, the camera represents a potentially superb buy for the 35mm analog enthusiast wanting to use Canon, the camera at this point being generally more robust and less problematic than its contemporary A1, AE1s and the like. The F1n was a full system camera, with a range of accessories and interchangeable components that were expected at the time of a ‘professional’ camera. There were various metering viewfinders, multiple focusing screens, a winder and a motor drive, data backs, bulk film backs, external battery packs and an extensive flash system and wireless controllers. Like Nikon at the time, Canon moved away from a fully mechanical camera. The F1n was a manual shutter device from 1/60 to 1/2000 but was electronically controlled at longer speeds. It has a vertical running, metal shutter that is notoriously strong and long lived. Flash sync is a rather slow 1/90. The 32 interchangeable focusing screens that were available (yes, 32!) gave not only a wide choice of focusing screen aids, but also a choice of centre weighted average, 12% partial and spot metering in most iterations. In its basic form, the camera was a traditional design with a simple, very over-engineered construction. With the common AE Finder FN, the camera was an aperture priority device that also allowed metered manual and stop-down metering. The less common Eye Level Finder FN simply gives metered manual, both finders using a swinging needle readout in the excellent near 100% field of view viewfinder. With the AE Finder, attaching a winder or motordrive, the camera acquires shutter priority too and a new shutter speed readout scale appears in the viewfinder. The design and layout of the camera is intentionally very conventional for what is basically a late 1970s product. That is what professionals wanted. The top plate has the film advance lever, rewind crank, ISO setting (ISO 6 to 6400) and shutter speed dial all where you would expect them. The metal shutter release button takes a central screw thread cable release. The commonest viewfinder prisms have a hot shoe connector (no faffing around with adaptors or covering up the rewind crank like Nikons of the time!). With a stated body only weight of 795 grams (c.1.5 lbs), you know that you are carrying it on your shoulder but it is reassuring chunky and stable in use. By the early 80s, Canon’s FD lens system more than matched Nikon’s system. One of the key advantages of using the F1N then - and now - is that you have access to that superb system. Today there are still 100,000s, possibly millions, of these lenses still in use and available to buy. The F1N can use the ‘new’ FD lenses of the late 70s onwards, or the older, slightly bulkier FD lenses with the silver breech lock ring the date from the old F1 era. It can also use the FL lenses from the 1960s but these require stop down metering with no aperture coupling. Very few FL lenses come up for sale these days and invariably there is a better FD era alternative anyway. The F1N in use Using the camera today is a reassuring nostalgia trip in conservative, old-school photography. The camera is a beautiful piece of metal engineering. Anyone who has used a traditional film SLR of that era will find it a natural, intuitive experience. If you are buying one today (see below), you’ll most likely have the AE Finder version, which will give you a camera with a choice of manual or aperture priority. Turn the lens off its ‘A’ setting on the aperture ring, set the camera to A on the shutter speed dial and then the camera selects the appropriate shutter speed for the aperture you have selected. Depth of field preview is available using the slide on the side of the lens mount. Turn the camera speed dial off A and select a shutter speed, and you have metered manual. Add the AE Winder or AE Motordrive, turn the lens to ‘A’ and then select a shutter speed on the shutter speed dial, and you then have a shutter priority automatic camera. In terms of flash, the camera will work automatically with any A, G or T series speedlite (though not the more advanced flash system of the 299T of the T-90). The flash system is non-TTL – very 1970s in design, but it works well enough. Of course, there is a separate flash sync socket for other external flash attachments. The Metz system of that era also works very well with the F1N – e.g. the 45CL. The shutter release is precise but not very ‘soft touch’ and the shutter fires and the mirror lifts with noticeable ‘thwack’. The handling is certainly not T90 in terms of ergonomics but the F1N’s chunky, boxy profile is favored by many users. The F1N is capable of huge amounts of exposures per day, like a fine German motor car on the freeway, it just drives – more than able to survive the relatively light use I am sure most film enthusiasts of the 21st Century are likely to throw at it. Buying and things to look out for Any F1N you buy today will be at least 30 years old and probably older. Some have had heavy use in their early life. Thus, whether you buy online or from a specialist store, buy from someone who knows about the cameras and can give you an honest appraisal: · Many F1N bodies have brassing, this is normal and not necessarily a problem. · Look out for significant dents in the body – could be signs of a hard life or abuse! · Light seals and mirror box damping foam may need replacing. · Pay a lot of attention to the shutter. Are the blinds clean and free of damage? Using a fresh battery, with the camera back open and the lens off, check shutter functioning and mirror return and check all speeds. · Check that the camera stops down the lens reliably in automatic modes · The meters are generally reliable and minor errors can be adjusted via the ISO scale but check for consistent operation and benchmark against an independent meter known to be accurate and reliable · Check prism securing latches and check that the meter prism head detaches easily and look for signs of damage to the glass and / or focusing screen. After 40 years you can’t expect perfection, of course. Some badly stored F1n bodies can have mold on the glass parts: use a bright light and a hand lens to check · Electrical faults are relatively rare but not unknown. Clearly, new spare parts are non-existent but a good technician can usually service a F1N as it is a straightforward, robust design. · I previously bought two cheap, non-functioning / partially working F1N bodies for potential cannibalization for spare parts, though thankfully have not had to use them yet. On the whole, the F1N tends to be a better purchase at this time than the A1, AE1, etc. These are lovely cameras too (and lighter and more compact), but tend to go wrong and suffer from old age more than the F1n, which of course, was built to a much higher standard. In conclusion, we should probably say that the F1N was always the camera that Canon threatened to make and finally did at the end of the 1970s. In all honesty, aside from the Nikon’s early use of TTL flash metering, it was a superior camera to the contemporary Nikon F3 and in old age, generally more likely to work well. If you buy an F1N in good, working condition, a service / CLA from a technician will probably mean that the camera will be good for the next couple of decades. And, of course, store in dry conditions and exercise the shutter regularly.

Yes, there is always confusion over the F1 nomenclature. The original F1 made from ca.1971-1980, was all mechanical with just a PX 625 1.35V battery for the meter, very similar in concept as a pro system camera to the Nikon F2 of the same era. In about 1975, they did some updates and improvements and it was unofficially called (but not ever by Canon) the 'F1n'. But it still was essentially an all mechanical camera. In 1980, Canon launched the electronic 'New F1' or sometimes called F1-N confusingly but again never by Canon - it was always just called the F1 still. This latter camera was made until about 1990 and is the chunky, heavy metal 'tank' that we are referring to.. it had just one mechanical 'emergency' speed and was otherwise electronic and worked off a cylindrical PX28 battery that was also used by the Canon A-series camera. The EF camera which was also around from about 1973 had a very similar appearance to the original F1, but without the interchangeable viewfinders etc and a top shutter speed of 1/1000 rather than 1/2000. This camera had the hybrid mechanical / electronic shutter working off 2 x PX625 batteries. 2secs to 30secs are electronically controlled and 1/1000 to 1/125 plus B or mechanical.