Leroy_Photography Posted November 22, 2017 Posted November 22, 2017 I shoot a lot of sports and a mish-mash of birds, landscapes, macros, some portraits, etc. I've always loved my D300 and D300s, but am ready to upgrade to something with the SAME BODY, but with more bells and whistles such as bluetooth and/or wifi accessibility (and a higher ISO). I only shoot on manual, so the D300 body has a great layout (no fumbling around in Menu to change the shutter, ISO, WB, or to to bracket). What would be a good replacement? (Note: I'm not a pro and a $4,000 camera is way out of my budget.) Any direction would be greatly appreciated.
Wouter Willemse Posted November 22, 2017 Posted November 22, 2017 The D500 is the most natural candidate. 1
ben_hutcherson Posted November 22, 2017 Posted November 22, 2017 Agreed on the D500 if you want to stay DX. If FX would be a consideration, a used D810 is now around the same price as a new D500. The only "control pad" cameras(I use that term to differentiate them from mode dial cameras) Nikon currently makes are the D500, D850, and D5. Going back a bit, the D800/810, D700, and the single digit D cameras are the only ones where you'll find that.
ShunCheung Posted November 22, 2017 Posted November 22, 2017 It looks like the OP was already considering replacing the D300S five years ago: D300/D300s Replacement By now, the D500 seems the obvious choice if the OP would like to stay with DX. In the US, currently there is Black Friday discount and free grip for the D500. 1
Andrew Garrard Posted November 22, 2017 Posted November 22, 2017 I'm certainly not going to dispute the D500 as the most obvious option; I might say that the D7100, D7200 and D7500 are all extremely capable (the control system is a little different, but mostly as fast to use), so I'd check before ruling them out, though. I'm not sure I find Nikon's Wi-Fi options to be significantly more appealing than an Eye-Fi card, although those are certainly (last I checked) not speed demons.
Dieter Schaefer Posted November 22, 2017 Posted November 22, 2017 I might say that the D7100, D7200 and D7500 are all extremely capable But she said "SAME BODY" as the D300 and D300s, so none of these qualify. And as a previous owner of a D7100 and a D7200 I can ascertain that the D7100 is not something I consider capable when it comes to action photography - the small memory buffer sees to that. Without having tried one, I disqualify the D7500 immediately since it doesn't allow for the attachment of an external battery grip (which I found essential when handling larger lenses (like the 80-400 or 200-500 on both the D7100 and D7200). So the only remaining option of the three mentioned would be the D7200 - half the price of the D500 and for that you also get about half the performance.
Leroy_Photography Posted November 22, 2017 Author Posted November 22, 2017 Agreed on the D500 if you want to stay DX. If FX would be a consideration, a used D810 is now around the same price as a new D500. The only "control pad" cameras(I use that term to differentiate them from mode dial cameras) Nikon currently makes are the D500, D850, and D5. Going back a bit, the D800/810, D700, and the single digit D cameras are the only ones where you'll find that. Thanks, Ben. I've looked at the "mode dial" cameras, but they seem too clumsy to make changes while chasing the action (or even the light, for that matter).
Leroy_Photography Posted November 22, 2017 Author Posted November 22, 2017 I'm certainly not going to dispute the D500 as the most obvious option; I might say that the D7100, D7200 and D7500 are all extremely capable (the control system is a little different, but mostly as fast to use), so I'd check before ruling them out, though. I'm not sure I find Nikon's Wi-Fi options to be significantly more appealing than an Eye-Fi card, although those are certainly (last I checked) not speed demons. Thanks, Andrew. The eye-fi cards are great, but I've had some software difficulty with them in the past with my mirrorless camera (but that could happen with any software).
Leroy_Photography Posted November 22, 2017 Author Posted November 22, 2017 Thank you for the input. The D500 looks great--including the price (less than $2,000).: EXPEED 5 Image Processor 3.2" 2,539k-Dot Tilting Touchscreen LCD 4K UHD Video Recording at 30 fps Multi-CAM 20K 153-Point AF System (Wow) Native ISO 51200, Extend to ISO 1640000 (Wow!) 10 fps Shooting for Up to 200 Frames (Wow! Again) Built-In Wi-Fi, Bluetooth and NFC (very nice)
ben_hutcherson Posted November 22, 2017 Posted November 22, 2017 One of the things worth mentioning that you MIGHT or MIGHT NOT care about is that the D500 doesn't have a built-in flash. On both my D300 and D800, I use the pop-up somewhat often as a CLS controller, and a lot less frequently for outdoor fill. Of course, it's also one other thing to break, and from what I've seen the lack of it allows the D500 to have a bigger/brighter prism than the D300. 1
Andrew Garrard Posted November 22, 2017 Posted November 22, 2017 But she said "SAME BODY" as the D300 and D300s, so none of these qualify Absolutely, I was just challenging the assumption based on evolutionary improvements. The D7200 is a lot more capable than a D90, for example. So the only remaining option of the three mentioned would be the D7200 - half the price of the D500 and for that you also get about half the performance. I'd actually managed to ignore the "sports" statement, which does indeed make the D7100 questionable. The lack of a second card slot hurts the D7500 for me, but I don't want to project; the D7200's 6fps is indeed a little behind the D300s (though not the un-gripped D300). The D7500 is at least as fast (8fps) as a D300s (and the same sensor as the D500). No argument that the D500 has the edge, and it's certainly closer in handling to the D300s (though there are plenty of differences if you try them side by side - the +/- swapping annoyed me a lot with the D700/D800e pair). I just thought I'd check the more expensive model was necessary. I've got to say I've never actually used my Eye-Fi for transferring data. But the fact that it'll allegedly do raw transfers is quite tempting to me - though I gather the signal can get a bit muffled by the camera body. Snapbridge seems to get less than glowing reviews, though. I've looked at the "mode dial" cameras, but they seem too clumsy to make changes while chasing the action (or even the light, for that matter). Out of interest, what gets in the way? You can often configure them usefully, although I'm not going to claim they're entirely equivalent. It's a factor in my choosing the D700/D800e/D810/D850 upgrade path rather than even looking at the D750, but familiarity can be expensive... The D500 looks great--including the price (less than $2,000) For all my second-guessing you, having hired a D500, it's a lovely camera (and felt very similar to my D810). The speed is impressive, especially with XQD (meaning I'll probably want the grip for the D810), the touchscreen is nice, the AF fine tuning is nice, and the AF system, while not perfect (for me), is state of the art unless the person next to you has a D5. :-) ISO performance of modern sensors has improved significantly since the D300 - it's not magic, but it's certainly improved. (Separate software can do nice things with noise reduction these days, too.) The one thing I'd say is read some reviews about the wifi in case you get too excited. If you want better wifi than basic transfers to your phone, you may end up looking at the WT-7 - and that's expensive and clumsy enough that it's not the most appealing things unless you're desperate. That said, B&H sell the WT-7 for $750, whereas in the UK, WEx have it listed for £1100 (£1000 at Park). So Brits like me have a little more reason to be wary of the official Nikon solution...
Hector Javkin Posted November 22, 2017 Posted November 22, 2017 Native ISO 51200, Extend to ISO 1640000 (Wow!) Those numbers are precisely designed to make us say, "wow!" but you won't like the resulting photos. But it doesn't matter. The D500 was designed as the D300/D300s replacement, it fits the requirements you described, and its current sale price is lower than I would expect it to be for some time.
ShunCheung Posted November 22, 2017 Posted November 22, 2017 Thank you for the input. The D500 looks great--including the price (less than $2,000).: Again, as of this week, Nikon USA is discounting the D500 to $1800 with a MB-D17 grip included: Nikon D500 | Read Reviews, Tech Specs, Price & More You can get that deal from all authorized Nikon dealers in the US, including Adorama, Amazon, B&H, and many local stores. As far as I know that deal is available in the next few days but may be extended into December.
ben_hutcherson Posted November 22, 2017 Posted November 22, 2017 With regard to noise: Maybe it's just me, but I've noticed that with the pixel densities we're seeing today, the noise itself becomes so small that even at high ISOs its not as obvious as with lower resolution cameras. I think the D500 is on the low end of pixel density in terms of DX cameras, but it's still higher than an FX camera(the D850 is 19.6mp in DX crop mode). I agree that the boosted ISO modes are mostly gimmicks, but even a relatively antiquated camera like my D800 still impresses me at 3200. I won't pretend it's noise free-it certainly is not-but I dare say that the 2012 D800 looks a lot better at 6400 than a c.2004 D2X at 800. Of course, I keep the ISO as low as I can, but I'll still go up to 3200 without too much thought and don't fret if i have to go to 6400.
Gary Naka Posted November 22, 2017 Posted November 22, 2017 I do a bit of sports photog with a D7200, and I find it meets my need, while keeping the weight down (compared to a FX D750). The D7200 can go up to ISO 25600, but the max I've gone up to is 12800, when shooting indoor volleyball and night football. Given the lighting, the results were just fine. But if you have the budget for the D500, I would go that route, rather than the D7200. re D500 Depending on what sport you shoot, the multi-point AF may or may not make a difference.When shooting team sports (football and volleyball) I found that any of the zone focus to be unreliable. It cannot tell YOUR subject apart from the other players when they get mixed up. I now use center point AF only for those types of sport, so I can track the subject. I expect basketball, soccer and similar team sports to be similarly a problem for zone AF. For tennis, with just ONE player, I found that 3D AF would sometimes loose lock on the player and focus on the lines on the court or the background. In football, when a line ref ran past me, the 9 point dynamic would loose focus lock on the player and track the ref instead, leaving the player out of focus. [*]For certain FAST sports, IMHO, even 10 fps is not fast enough. The difference between shots at 6 fps with my D7200, tells me that I would need 20+ fps to shoot a tennis player, and reliably get the racket and ball close together. The racket moves VERY fast. I think one of the the mirrorless Sony will do 20 fps. [*]The tilting LCD is a GREAT feature for low angle shots. You don't need to lay on the ground to look through the viewfinder to aim the camera. [*]I have only used up to ISO 12800 (max 25600 on the D7200), but having a max ISO of 51200 is nice to have, for those really dim venues. I remember the days of pushing Tri-X up to 1200, and getting grainy negatives that one did not want to print large. For those dim venues, you should be shooting with FAST glass. However, for the price of a D500, I would look at a FX D750. But CAREFULLY compare the relevant specs. For sports, the D500 may be the better choice.
Dieter Schaefer Posted November 23, 2017 Posted November 23, 2017 I use the pop-up somewhat often as a CLS controller That's how I killed a D200. Since that happened, I have not used an on-board flash anymore even though, with the exception of the A7/A7II and D500, all my cameras had one. Those numbers are precisely designed to make us say, "wow!" but you won't like the resulting photos. Maybe it's just me, but I've noticed that with the pixel densities we're seeing today, the noise itself becomes so small that even at high ISOs its not as obvious as with lower resolution cameras. Indeed. At least for me, the limit of acceptability is around ISO 6400, certainly not beyond. And anything north of ISO 3200 will certainly have me at least try noise reduction in post.
Andrew Garrard Posted November 23, 2017 Posted November 23, 2017 I hate to point this out, but I don't think frame rate is all that necessary in tennis. The racquet moves fast, but you do know when it's going to hit the ball (if you couldn't, the players wouldn't be able to play); I've had a pretty high hit rate of ball centred in racquet with single shots timed properly. Not that I claim you couldn't spray at 60fps and pick a frame (something I hope future 8k bodies will allow). But I'm an amateur, and I'm prepared to be shouted down on this. I'd be more worried about something like football (either kind) where the players are deliberately moving unpredictably and over smaller distances. 1
heimbrandt Posted November 23, 2017 Posted November 23, 2017 Sorry for going off topic, but it is related to how many value the FPS specs of a camera. I hate to point this out, but I don't think frame rate is all that necessary in tennis. ...I've had a pretty high hit rate of ball centred in racquet with single shots timed properly. ... I could not agree more - timing is everything when shooting sports. Granted, there are some fast and unpredictable sports but most are not - when you know the sport. Show jumping and eventing interest me and I have been asked many times by other (mostly amateur) photographers why I do not shoot more frames per jump since it looks like I have a fast camera. One or two shots per jump get you the photo you want, not ten, not 30. The latter is called video, in my world and removes the challenge in photography. I am not saying every frame is perfect, but it makes photography more of an active hobby and you learn more when you work on your timing. Looking back on my gear, the camera that gave me the most keepers was the Pentax 67 as it really forced med to think before I fired the shutter - and I could shoot action with it. That said, I stil appreciate as high fps as possible but not for the number of shots I can get. I like it for the shorter time between two frames and the shorter blackout time for the AF system. Working on your timing rather than just spraying has another advantage; when you come home and sort your photos. At the enduro event a couple of weeks ago, I stood next to a very nice and friendly photographer who took some fifteen shots of every rider riding past. I wonder if she has had the time to go thru all her photos by now from that event. Moreover, I wonder whether she really got more really good shots than the rest of us that did not fill our memory cards. A running toddler is a different subject, though...
Gary Naka Posted November 23, 2017 Posted November 23, 2017 I hate to point this out, but I don't think frame rate is all that necessary in tennis. The racquet moves fast, but you do know when it's going to hit the ball (if you couldn't, the players wouldn't be able to play); I've had a pretty high hit rate of ball centred in racquet with single shots timed properly. Not that I claim you couldn't spray at 60fps and pick a frame (something I hope future 8k bodies will allow). But I'm an amateur, and I'm prepared to be shouted down on this. I'd be more worried about something like football (either kind) where the players are deliberately moving unpredictably and over smaller distances. Actually, that is my experience also. I get a better hit rate when I shoot a SINGLE shot, rather than burst. But then I grew up in the manual everything days of film, so I had to learn to time the shot. And that requires a lot of practice and thinking about the shot, to get the timing right. This is something that I fear many of the newer generation don't have. As the high school yearbook advisor warned me, "the kids today have an attention span measured in seconds." Few thoughts about burst shooting: I can get the follow up shots that I could never get with a manual film camera. duh, rather obvious. But having been a film shooter for so long, it took me a long time to even try burst/continuous shooting. I shot my first DSLR like it was an auto winder rather than a motor drive, single shot. I do not recall ever shooting continuous on that camera. [*]I have discovered other types of shots that I like, after reviewing the X number of shots in a burst. Examples: The setup/approach for a hit is many times more interesting than the shot of the racket contacting the ball. The face of the opposing water polo goalie after she misses the throw and goal by my player. [*]For new sport photographers, it helps them to get shots, without the learning curve of learning to time the shot. This is for my yearbook students, and most casual photographers.It takes a while to learn that there is a time lag between when they see the shot they want, their finger presses the shutter, and the the shutter firing. And some never learn to anticipate/time the shot. [*]The more shots you take, the longer and more difficult the editing session will be. 1
CvhKaar Posted November 27, 2017 Posted November 27, 2017 Thank you for the input. The D500 looks great--including the price (less than $2,000).: Built-In Wi-Fi, Bluetooth and NFC (very nice) mm on a D500 the Wi-Fi , Bluetooth and NFC cannot be operated separate from each other, You always need to connect thue the Bluetooth connection first with a Phone , running the "SnapBridge". App. ( ATM there are no other App's which communicate with a Nikon 500 without extra hardware). TheSnapbrige App. does not run or run properly on most available phoness, just on newer iPhones an on some Anroid phones. Once started it then can utilize Wi-Fi for large file transfers, which then is a terrible slow process. The NFC chip is only used to make it easier to set up the connection with your Phone the first time, that is all. With the possibility for Bluetooth / Wi-Fi enabled, the camera drains the battery very quickly, even when switched off, to prevent this you need to switch the camera in air-plane mode.. If you want to use proper Wi-Fi with the D500 then you will need to buy a WT-7 unit which costs about half of the price of the camera, this can then be used running nikons Camera Control Pro on a PC. So if Wi-Fi connection is really important for you, then Nikon is not the best brand to look for it i think (personal opinion) 1
Andrew Garrard Posted November 27, 2017 Posted November 27, 2017 All I've heard of about snapbridge makes me agree, cpm. Nikon have been trying this for long enough that you'd think they'd have brought in someone who could do it right by now. For what is worth, apps exist that let you drive a camera from a USB-connected cellphone, which gives you some mobile flexibility. And there's the Eye-Fi if you want a cheaper way to transfer images. I admit that the software engineers I know who work in networking all hate their jobs, but it feels like Nikon have managed to make something relatively simple very hard work.
CvhKaar Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 I admit that the software engineers I know who work in networking all hate their jobs, ??? I do defenetly NOT hate my job ... :confused:o_O:) ( Just hate this laptop because the "d" often does not work.. :mad::mad::mad:)
Andrew Garrard Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 You're the exception, cpm - but sorry for maligning you! In which case, in your professional opinion, how much harder is Nikon making a camera WiFi connection look, compared with how it should? I'm a great believer in how much easier networking is if you just use a cable, and I admit that my car's Bluetooth stack fails to talk to my phone about 20% of the time (two different phones; the car dealers won't update the firmware in case they brick it). And my personal record on a business trip is seven independent reasons I couldn't read my work email (only some of which related to WiFi). And I know Apple use a slightly odd WiFi mode that can break some base stations, and some smart TVs have been known to crash if you walk within range while having a WiFi hotspot on your phone with an emoji in the essid. And, of course, there was a recent big security issue found with secure WiFi negotiation. But I thought, in 2017, the basics were sorted out enough that it should just work. If you can connect a drone to your phone by WiFi and stream live video, you should be able to connect to a nearby static camera and spend an arbitrary amount of time transferring a raw file...
steven_p Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 I was a long time user of a D300. I tried the D7xxx route and it was horrible. For half the cost of a D500, a low mileage D800 is a no brainer. I had to learn the hard way, (avoid "sell me" sites) I am not saying a D500 is a bad camera...it's just that almost everything (The Latest & Greatest) of the past several years were problematic in one way or another. Spend $900, on a low mile D800 from someone that is on the D850 train, & fire sailing the old. JMHO.
ben_hutcherson Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 I was a long time user of a D300. I tried the D7xxx route and it was horrible. For half the cost of a D500, a low mileage D800 is a no brainer. I had to learn the hard way, (avoid "sell me" sites) I am not saying a D500 is a bad camera...it's just that almost everything (The Latest & Greatest) of the past several years were problematic in one way or another. Spend $900, on a low mile D800 from someone that is on the D850 train, & fire sailing the old. JMHO. I absolutely love my D800, and in fact even though I haven't had it that long I paid a bit of a premium since I bought it just before the D850 was announced. With that said, I'm not sure if it's the best camera for someone who wants to shoot sports and birds. The AF is plenty fast for me for most of my photography, but I still find it slower than a D300/MB-D10/EN-EL4. The frame rate is also much lower. The D500 is tremendously better in both of these respects. There's also the crop factor aspect, which of course can be advantageous both for sports and wildlife. A D800 is no slouch when cropped to DX sizes(16mp or so, I think), but the D500 is still higher resolution than any FX camera in DX crop mode(the D850 is hair-splitting close at 19.6). 1
BeBu Lamar Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 I absolutely love my D800, and in fact even though I haven't had it that long I paid a bit of a premium since I bought it just before the D850 was announced. With that said, I'm not sure if it's the best camera for someone who wants to shoot sports and birds. The AF is plenty fast for me for most of my photography, but I still find it slower than a D300/MB-D10/EN-EL4. The frame rate is also much lower. The D500 is tremendously better in both of these respects. There's also the crop factor aspect, which of course can be advantageous both for sports and wildlife. A D800 is no slouch when cropped to DX sizes(16mp or so, I think), but the D500 is still higher resolution than any FX camera in DX crop mode(the D850 is hair-splitting close at 19.6). Really? The price of the D800 has dropped since the announcement of the D850? I thought it has dropped a long time ago and now the price is more condition dependent than because of the introduction of the D850.
CvhKaar Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 You're the exception, cpm - but sorry for maligning you! In which case, in your professional opinion, how much harder is Nikon making a camera WiFi connection look, compared with how it should? ... Nikon makes it much to hard by combining Bleutooth and Wi-Fi without leaving the choice to the user of the camera. I also own a "basic"canon camera which gives me several choices for connecting; it can function as a "hotSpot / accespoint" by itself, but can also be connected to a "home Network" through Wi-Fi. An elegant and easy to use solution. Looking at the Nikon Solution, it looks like Nikon utilises some kind of ESP32 like chip, which combines Wi-Fi and Bluetooth LE on 1 chip ( google it for more info) reprogramming that chip is not hard, but tsince the program for that chip is part of the camera's software infrastructure it is quit a task if one would split the functionalities in a way that makes Wi-Fi available by itself without knowing the restof the software in the camera .. ( hard but probably not impossible if you have the right documentation available..)
ShunCheung Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 I have had a D800E since shortly after it was introduced back in 2012. It is still an excellent camera for landscape, studio, etc. although it has been superseded by the D810 and now D850. However, the D800 maxes out at 4 fps for FX. That wouldn't be my choice for sports and wildlife. And since 2012 (and even before), I have been buying and using some very new models of Nikon DSLRs, and I haven't experienced any issue that people are complaining about on the web, such as the D800's AF issue, D750 shutter .... My D750 had a bad GPS connection that Nikon fixed under warranty. A loaner D810 had some electronic issues that led to corrupted images, but a replacement was just fine. Those are more like isolated problems. I have used two D500 extensively, and the one I own, I have had it for over a year without issues. That would be my choice for sports and wildlife if the OP wants to stay with DX.
Andrew Garrard Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 Nikon makes it much to hard by combining Bleutooth and Wi-Fi without leaving the choice to the user of the camera. I also own a "basic"canon camera which gives me several choices for connecting; it can function as a "hotSpot / accespoint" by itself, but can also be connected to a "home Network" through Wi-Fi. An elegant and easy to use solution. Yes. I believe the top-end EyeFi gives you the same choice. Given the flexibility of most cell phones and all computers these days, it's not clear to me that Nikon's attempt to automate the process (or run a crippled app) is in any way helping. Looking at the Nikon Solution, it looks like Nikon utilises some kind of ESP32 like chip, which combines Wi-Fi and Bluetooth LE on 1 chip ( google it for more info) reprogramming that chip is not hard, but since the program for that chip is part of the camera's software infrastructure it is quite a task if one would split the functionalities in a way that makes Wi-Fi available by itself without knowing the rest of the software in the camera .. ( hard but probably not impossible if you have the right documentation available..) Alas, I wasn't suggesting we/you hack the firmware to fix it. I saw one comment (possibly from Thom?) suggesting that Nikon may have a tiny firmware size limit despite running through many camera designs, and this might limit their ability to add goodies. I really hope that's not true; even if it is, you can (almost) always optimise more. I'd love to be allowed at Nikon's source code for a couple of weeks. But assuming that whoever's programming the thing already has access to the source, it still feels like they've somehow - at least allowing for the number of revisions Snapbridge has gone through - managed to make far more of a meal of developing a usable system than they needed to. I'm generously assuming they didn't deliberately cripple things to try to sell the WT-7, which is ridiculously expensive (£1100 in the UK). You could build something Raspberry Pi-based that plugged into the USB port for a tenth of that, which worked better, and was smaller.
Andrew Garrard Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 Btw, did everyone know about Nikon putting the D850 manual online in HTML form? I'm used to the PDF, but unless I missed them doing it before, this is new. In 2016 I went to a number of scenic places, including Yellowstone, with a D810 and hired D500 (between me and my wife, but also for backup). The megapixels and dynamic range of the D810 got used for landscape, but except for the Yellowstone specific "yet another bison" images where I was very close, the D500's frame rate and reach were much more useful. I only took my D810 on a more recent trip (because of logistics), and every bit of reach would have helped (compared with my 200-500 + TC14 combo). Sometimes you have enough glass and it's nice to have a wider view, but DX is mostly the affordable way for wildlife unless you're good at getting close. I've never bothered with the grip for the D8x0 series (I may do for the D850 because it doesn't kill the resolution to hit frame rate), but I've used the 1.2x crop mode on the D800 and D810 to get an extra fps (5 and 6 respectively). That's handy for wildlife, and it's still about 25MP, with a bigger buffer than a D750.
Mary Doo Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 Btw, did everyone know about Nikon putting the D850 manual online in HTML form? I'm used to the PDF, but unless I missed them doing it before, this is new. 400 pages of D850 pdf here.
ben_hutcherson Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 Really? The price of the D800 has dropped since the announcement of the D850? I thought it has dropped a long time ago and now the price is more condition dependent than because of the introduction of the D850. In the US, a "typical" D800 in less than perfect condition(but still nice) with a shutter count in the 25000-75000 range was around $1300. Since D850 has shipped, I've seen cameras in that general category slide to around $1000. KEH is still holding at $1300, but at least one local shop has marked all of the ones in their used case down to $995 and they're still not moving. They've also had a fair few show up since the D850 shipped, and again these are going in at $995 typically. There's one REALLY nice one that looks brand new and has 5,000 actuations for $1100.
Andrew Garrard Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 400 pages of D850 pdf here. Yes, I know - I have it (and a load of other camera manual PDFs) downloaded, which is how I'm sometimes able to pretend I know things. The HTML version I linked to seems to be new, though. It's potentially useful to those of us here pointing people at documentation - partly because it's chunked into sub-pages, which makes it a little easier to point people at subsections. (E.g. here's the "touch photography" section.) I still absolutely want the PDF, partly for offline viewing and partly because it's much easier to search it, but I thought the HTML version may also be useful. (Btw, does anyone else find the new photo.net way of showing links - almost invisibly - to be unhelpful? I remember the good old days when you could rely on blue text and an underscore to tell you where a link was. If you missed it above, here's the HTML version I was referring to.)
Dieter Schaefer Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 does anyone else find the new photo.net way of showing links - almost invisibly - to be unhelpful? To the extreme! I miss most of them if there isn't an announcement to its existence in the thread - and even then have to look pretty hard (like the one you posted that I totally didn't realize was a link). Should be an easy thing for photo.net to fix. Coulda, shoulda, woulda - but won't.
Mary Doo Posted November 28, 2017 Posted November 28, 2017 (edited) (Btw, does anyone else find the new photo.net way of showing links - almost invisibly - to be unhelpful? Very unhelpful. Don't know why they are not correcting this glaring dysfunction. That's why I always manually bolden and change the link color to blue. Edited November 28, 2017 by Mary Doo
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