Nikon D7500 announced

[rossb]

So nobody wants to shoot macro or telephoto anymore? And they're happy with a semi-fisheye low resolution view of their world? If that's the case I find it very sad.

 

 

People just buy what they buy and that determines what will be for sale.

 

I am just chatting about camera's. I am not anti DSLR or digital but I shoot film for a hobby, I have a Mirrorless camera that I rarely use and I have a cell phone. I have several film camera's. If somebody gave me a Nikon D7500 I would be happy to have it. However I would not purchase one as I could probably buy a Hasselblad 501c for about the same money.

 

Anyway I am hiking the High Peaks at Pinnacles National Park this morning and will do a camera count. Lets see who shoots what on a beautiful day in a beautiful National Park on one of the most popular day hikes in this area. I am a Pinnacles National Park volunteer but today I am hiking for myself because I want to take pictures. When I am working I cannot manage a camera other then my cell due to the weight of my Search and Rescue backpack. There are clouds out there today and it's a photo day. I am trying to hike 2 or 3 times a week until June 8th as I am going to hike Half Dome and I want to be in the best shape I can. I am very excited about having a permit to hike Half Dome. I will carry my Nikon FG with a 28mm lens and a contrast filter set (the lightest set up I own). I will have my cell phone also of course and will log into Strava to record my hike and post that to facebook. I will take video with my cell of the water falls. I am shooting HP5 at 400 on the hike.

[bebu_lamar]

"Maybe the cell phone is the next level for many photographers" - Really?

 

So nobody wants to shoot macro or telephoto anymore? And they're happy with a semi-fisheye low resolution view of their world? If that's the case I find it very sad.

 

What about online commerce? I'm certainly swayed in my choice of product by how well it's represented and photographed. It really puts me off if I see a crappy cellphone picture in an ad. I think "Well, if they can't be bothered with a decent picture; what else can't they be bothered to do?"

 

Not nobody but the number of people using DSLR's and Mirrorless today far exist the number of people who used serious cameras in the film days. So I doubt that number is going to grow anymore.

[Dieter Schaefer]

What they can do is silently develop a mirrorless system and when the time is right, enter the market with a potentially leading line.

Whatever Nikon will come up with in mirrorless, Sony just raised the bar substantially with their release of the Sony A9!

$4500 will get you a 24MP camera, shooting at 20fps with a shutter speed as fast as 1/32000s and up to 241 compressed RAW images , using 693 AF points to track motion at 60 fps while eliminating EVF blackout. If all that works as well in real life as it reads on paper, then this is one freaking good camera. 2 SD card slots and a new battery with 2.2x capacity of the previous one.

[ilkka_nissila]

The A9 has very nice specifications but I doubt the artifacts that bother me in current EVFs (such as the rolling jaggies at high contrast boundaries, flickering etc.) are absent, and the capability of the AF system on fast tele primes in low light remains to be seen (once Sony makes such lenses, i.e. 200/2, 400/2.8 etc.). At least for me the wide aperture gives a distinct look in sports shooting and eliminates much of the distractions in background (advertisements etc.) and I have to wonder why Sony would announce this camera with a 100-400/4.5-5.6 instead of a classical sports tele such as 300/2.8. I would think the impact of the A9 would have been greater if announced with a fast tele. Anyway, time will tell how this plays out but it seems Sony is taking a clear lead at least in the mirrorless market in terms of technology. And yes, for Nikon and Canon it is less easy again to enter the high end mirrorless market in a competitive manner. Sony isn't making too many lenses though and that may be a window for Nikon, but to take advantage of it would require that they can match the Sony's specifications and make a comprehensive lens line or alternatively provide a successful implementation of F mount lens support including AF performance. My guess is that that would mean the camera would actually have to be designed with F mount flange distance in mind.

[rodeo_joe1]

"My guess is that that would mean the camera would actually have to be designed with F mount flange distance in mind."

- By no means. Using a shorter register and larger diameter mount gives all the flexibility needed for backward F mount compatibility.

 

Electrical contact extension would be childishly simple, and with enough space an adapter could even contain an AF motor and "screwdriver" spindle, together with an aperture solenoid.

 

I seriously doubt that Nikon would go that far with backward compatibility, but it would be a confidence builder for existing users to swap to, or augment their Nikon DSLR with, a mirrorless body. It's not a huge engineering challenge.

 

The non-retrofocus wideangles and the like can come later.

[rossb]

Well I am back from the 6 mile hike. I did not see a ton of people out hiking today but the camera count was: DSLR 4 (entry level models), Point and 2, Film 1 (me) and no cell phones taking photos. I am surprised at the count. But it is what it is. All the camera carrying people were over 60. Young hikers had no camera's at all that was apparent. Obviously there were many cell phones in peoples pockets but I did not see one being used for anything. There is cell service with verizon in the High Peaks and I took my phone out and texted my wife as she likes to know I am there. It's the half way point on the 6 mile hike. Edited April 19, 2017 by rossb

[Dieter Schaefer]

Sony isn't making too many lenses though

Aside from superteles and tilt-shift lenses, there doesn't appear too much missing anymore (or expected within a year or even less). Wonder why they don't simply modify their 300/2.8 and 500/4 A-mount lenses to native FE-mount?

 

With the exception of the 200-500 and the 300/4, I could now replace my entire Nikon FX lens collection with native FE-mount equivalents made by Sony and Zeiss if I was so inclined (I am not).

 

I am surprised at the count.

I am not. The last four weekends, we drove to the Carrizo Plain and the vast majority of people we encountered had either a mirrorless or a DSLR.

[rossb]

I am not. The last four weekends, we drove to the Carrizo Plain and the vast majority of people we encountered had either a mirrorless or a DSLR.

 

 

I forgot one camera. This lady was standing on the trail and Condor 36 landed on a rock 20 feet from her and she took a snap with her ipad. Condors just sitting kind of look like a black round ball with a ugly head sticking out. She snapped it! I did not see a photo unless it decided to fly off and stretched out those massive wings but we chatted for a while and the bird seemed happy just sitting there so I moved on down the mountain. I have gotten pretty close to Condor 36 a few times. I heard the Condor folks named it "Tiny".

 

Anyway I hope Nikon does well with their new camera. It seems real nice to me but I do not care about dual cards or any of that. If I had one I would just shoot it like film and that would be maybe 12 pictures on a 6 hr hike. Maybe an entire roll or 36 pics on a digi snapper if my Grandkids are doing something as I want pictures of them. I do not actually care about landscapes or Condor photos. I just take them because I am out there.

[Dieter Schaefer]

Condor 36 landed on a rock 20 feet from her and she took a snap with her ipad.

I wouldn't even bother: 31mm FX FOV-equivalent results in a lot of "environment" around the condor. "Snap" is about the appropriate term.

This was shot at 400mm on an FX camera from about 16ft away (captive bird):

 

And this on DX:

 

Maybe I need to make that drive up to the Pinnacles one of these days. Is it better to enter the Park from the East or the West? It's about the same driving time and distance for me.

[rossb]

Maybe I need to make that drive up to the Pinnacles one of these days. Is it better to enter the Park from the East or the West? It's about the same driving time and distance for me.

 

For viewing Condors in the High Peaks it does not matter which side you park on. The hike up is the same as far as I can tell. I have actually never hiked from the West side but you can see the parking lot from the High Peaks trail at the summit. However the hiking is better from the East side and you can go through the caves and past the reservoir on the way up. If your coming down 101 from the North then it would be no big deal to take Highway 25 to Pinnacles when you get to Gilroy.

 

I think with any digital camera and zoom lens you would get some nice photos. If you want head shots like in your pictures then it may take a big birders lens or many trips to get your shot. Just a regular zoom lens in the High Peaks will allow you to get some nice photos of the birds with rock backgrounds or a rock and sky background. Just depends on what is going on that day. Today the only Condor I saw was the one that the lady took a snap of. Other days I see many Condors out. Before I came upon the lady taking snaps of the bird with her ipad I saw the bird coming in and took a quick shot of it landing with it's wings open and braking for the landing. I had a green filter on the camera as I had been taking photos of wildflowers and it was sudden like so I am not sure until I see the pic if it's going to be bunk or not. There was an obstructing rock right there also and it may have cut off to much but I am not sure. I believe my exposure and focus was good however. Not sure about the green filter and it's not a choice I would have made. The Green filter will lighten blue sky so that is probably not ideal but we shall see.

 

Your Condor shots are awesome.

Edited April 20, 2017 by rossb

[Dieter Schaefer]

If your coming down 101 from the North then it would be no big deal to take Highway 25 to Pinnacles when you get to Gilroy.

Coming from the South. So it's either 146 from Soledad, or 198 and 25 from San Lucas.

However the hiking is better from the East side and you can go through the caves and past the reservoir on the way up.

Your Condor shots are awesome.

Thanks on both counts.

[rossb]

Coming from the South. So it's either 146 from Soledad, or 198 and 25 from San Lucas

 

 

It would be easier to park on the West side as it's easy entrance from Hwy 101.

[rossb]

Here is the Condor grab shot I took with the Green filter. I think it could have been an awesome shot if I was prepared for it but like I said it was a sudden event and I just snapped it. Nikon FM2n with 50mm lens and the Green filter that I was using for wildflower photos. .

 

 

[marcantel]

Well I hope the camera does well for Nikon.

My D7100 works just fine

[rossb]

My D7100 works just fine

 

I hope it continues to provide you with good service and results for many years.

[rodeo_joe1]

Nice shot Ross. Personally I'd crop it to a horizontal rectangle with the tree as its left limit and the rock face peeping in on the right. Placing the condor on the lefthand third about halfway up the frame. That's if the film will stand that tight a crop.

[Guest PapaTango]

My D7100 works just fine

 

I wish I could say the same about mine. It will not cut the grass or vacuum the carpet. It likes to sit there alluringly, whispering "Buy me something nice..." :p

[rossb]

Nice shot Ross. Personally I'd crop it to a horizontal rectangle with the tree as its left limit and the rock face peeping in on the right. Placing the condor on the lefthand third about halfway up the frame. That's if the film will stand that tight a crop.

 

 

I think your right. I tried it this way. The file size will still allow for an 8x12 print.

 

[rodeo_joe1]

That's almost exactly what I had in mind Ross. Neat!

[ilkka_nissila]

Aside from superteles and tilt-shift lenses, there doesn't appear too much missing anymore (or expected within a year or even less). Wonder why they don't simply modify their 300/2.8 and 500/4 A-mount lenses to native FE-mount?

 

Typically to perform well, mirrorless cameras require a different lens AF motor solution than DSLRs. Phase-detection is more limited and in low light most mirrorless cameras switch to contrast detect AF which doesn't work well with ultrasonic motors; there is a lot of extra jitter as these motors do not make small adjustments quickly and reproducibly. Contrast-detect AF works well when the motor is able to execute small adjustments very quickly and reproducibly. This can be seen very clearly if you try live view AF on a Nikon DSLR using an AF-P (stepper motor) lens and compare with AF-S lenses. The AF using the AF-P is silent, nearly instantaneous, and there is no hunting. Nikon DSLR LVAF uses only CDAF and for years its AF performance has been the subject of ridicule when using AF-S lenses. The difference is in the motor. AF-S lenses are superb when there is a need to move the focus quickly over a long distance range but their stopping and starting behaviour is not as quick and well controlled as those of stepper motors. With the best DSLR AF modules they work nicely but the reproducibility is not perfect.

 

The new Sony 70-200/2.8 FE has two focusing motors; an USM and a linear motor. I assume the latter can do precise small adjustments quickly, making it possible to have functional autofocus with this lens on a mirrorless camera which doesn't have a dedicated PDAF module like DSLRs do. The second motor (USM) is likely needed to move the focus quickly when larger adjustments are needed. I would guess Sony will need to implement something similar in their fast superteles if they want them to focus well with mirrorless cameras. This may require a rethinking of the whole lens. Time will tell how it will work, if they decide to pursue this type of lens for the E mount.

[Dieter Schaefer]

This may require a rethinking of the whole lens.

Thanks Ilkka. I hadn't realized that a change in the focus mechanism might well entail the need to redesign the entire lens.

[scott_murphy5]

It looks like a step backward in several respects. Only M for non-CPU lenses, no aperture sensing ring around the mount for AI/AIS lenses. Is Nikon finally pulling a Canon and forgetting about their very long time loyal users who still have older and still very fine lenses?

 

PASS

[BeBu Lamar]

It looks like a step backward in several respects. Only M for non-CPU lenses, no aperture sensing ring around the mount for AI/AIS lenses. Is Nikon finally pulling a Canon and forgetting about their very long time loyal users who still have older and still very fine lenses?

 

PASS

It's a step forward not backward. Better off forgetting about those old MF lenses besides without the AI tab I think it's possible to use even pre AI lenses on it. No meter but so what?

[Andrew in Austin]

It looks like a step backward in several respects. Only M for non-CPU lenses, no aperture sensing ring around the mount for AI/AIS lenses. Is Nikon finally pulling a Canon and forgetting about their very long time loyal users who still have older and still very fine lenses?

 

PASS

 

Been there, done that. Rather than waiting for a D7500 - a refurbished D500 body is about $1700 @ B&H photovideo. Moving up to the D500, will provide a functioning meter with an AI/AIS lens, once the lens data has been entered into the CSM.

[rossb]

I think as Nikon goes along in the going out of business thing they will drop old features that make little difference to most people. The thought would be to sell products that generate a profit margin. The film thing is like that and they drop products that were loved by some and did not produce income so they just dump them. I guess right now they say film is stable at it's 1% of what it used to be. I am surprised that Nikon still makes the AIS lenses and figuring the future will finally move to the newest lens they have. I do not follow digital actually but I think it's the G lens that is the current model. However anytime a company drops a product there are those that get tweaked about it but that same person finally accepts the situation and moves on.

 

I just bought a Mamiya 645e and the lens that I have for it is great. Just over a hundred bucks is all. At least for a while I will shoot that and my cell phone camera. I took the batteries out of my 35mm camera's, my mirrorless camera and have them all packed away until I decide to use them again or give them away. The MF is going to cost a bit to shoot and I figure the money that I spend to feed the beast is all I can afford towards photography so that's the life for me at the current time.

 

However in a year if I am still happy with the set up I will buy a Hasselblad such as the 501c or cm. Those camera's can be repaired and serviced so all I would need to worry about into the future is 120 film availability.

 

I am going to lug "Ruby" (I named my camera, My Granddaughter said it looks like my Rubix Cube so I named it Ruby) around the Santa Cruz Beach Boardwalk this evening. I have a flash for it also.

Edited April 29, 2017 by rossb