I can't pick a lens!

[mattie_powell]

<p>I've always taken pictures but just started doing it "professionally." So far all my clients have been happy with my work but I haven't had any large groups yet. I have an appointment for a group of 21 people coming up and I don't think my lens will be good enough. I have been researching for days and i'm so lost on what to get. I currently have a Canon Rebel XS and I use a EF-S 18-55MM. I think I need a wide angle lens but I don't want to break the bank since i'm just starting out. I would like to stay in the $200 range if possible. What do y'all recommend?</p>

[MichaelChang]

<p>You can rent a prime wide angle lens for a day which cost around $20-$40 around my area in Canada, but you'll have to leave a deposit which might be a few hundred dollars.</p>

<p>As for a specific lens choice, you might try Google Images for a lens of interest to see some sample photos, or look for online reviews. <br>

</p>

[Ken Katz]

Everyone seems to like the Canon 10-18MM IS. And while it cost more than $200 new, it is likely the least

expensive option unless you find a used lens for less.

 

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1051476-USA/canon_9519b002_ef_s_10_18mm_f_4_5_5_6_is.html

[mattie_powell]

<p>Ok thank y'all both. Ill check them out.</p>

[brett_w.]

<p>yes, refurbished Canon 10-18 - $199 - which includes one year warranty</p>

[James G. Dainis]

This is to be a shot of 21 people in a group? You had better think about how you are going to arrange that. Three rows of seven people? Four rows of five people with one row having six people? Will you shoot down from a ladder or a raised height to get everyone in? How far back can you shoot? With a wide angle lens up close the heads of the people three feet back may only be one half the size of the people's heads in the front.

[Andrew Garrard]

<p>A quick word of warning - if you're using an ultra-wide lens to fit in a wide group of people, bear in mind the ones at the edge will look stretched (assuming the image is viewed from a "normal" perspective - they will actually look fine if you put your eye very close to the image). You can make things look a bit more natural in post-processing (several packages have a way to "remove wide-angle distortion"), but it has the effect of bending straight lines in the image, which may also not be desirable. Have a look at the images taken with very wide lenses on-line, and make sure that's the effect you want. If you just want to fit a crowd into the shot, you might do better just standing further back - the wide end of your 18-55 is already plenty wide enough to start making the people at the edges of the frame look a bit funny.<br />

<br />

Just thought I should point that out before you spend too much money! Good luck.</p>

[William Michael]

<p>Unless you have a specific conceptual notion which requires a sweeping wide angle, you need no wider than the lens that you have already.<br>

<br>

Apropos the quality of the lens that you have: prints to 20x24 inches of quality can be produced provided: the exposure is correct; the ISO is suitably noise free and the Lens is used at around F/8 to F/11. Arguably F/8 to F/11 would be chosen anyway to provide the adequate DoF required for a group of 21 people.<br>

<br>

In any case - and as a general caution, using wide angle lenses for Portrait Photography is not an easy assignment as one may have to consider distortions common to W/A Lenses, such as Barrel Distortion. There are other considerations which are commonly (and IMO incorrectly) termed "Perspective Distortions" - these are affectations such as Foreshortening; Elongation; Keyhole and Inverted Keyhole Effects. <br>

<br>

What can happen (and often does) is a W/A lens is chosen for Group Portraiture as a simple fix to 'squeeze' a group of people into the Frame: the result often is "fat arms and hips at the edges" and "some funny shaped heads", because of the PERSPECTIVE created by having the Camera close to the Subjects.<br>

<br>

Good group arrangement and an understanding of lighting for Group Portraiture will aid you more than buying a wide angle lens, I suggest an arrangement something like four rows of five or three rows of seven and the lens set at around FL = 30mm. A slight house-shoe arrangement is always neat. This was made with a 50mm Lens on a 5D series Camera - that's like using a 31mm lens on your camera: <a href="/photo/17894497">http://www.photo.net/photo/17894497</a><br>

<br>

WW</p>

<p > </p>

[JDMvW]

<p>Here is a 1978 article from <em>Modern Photography</em> with some examples of the things already mentioned, and some not mentioned:</p>

[Gary Naka]

<p>M<br>

Where are you shooting; studio or on location?<br>

As with others, I would try backing up to get more distance to get a wider horizontal distance. <br />Using a WIDE lens for people would be my option of last resort, because of various distortions. <br>

Think REALLY HARD about the arrangement. Because I did a similar shot a while back and the faces in the back rows ended up in shadow from the flashes. I used 2 flashes, to the right and left of the camera. I should have put the flashes closer to the camera, or widened the spacing of the people in the first standing row.<br>

Multiple rows will need something STURDY for the back rows to stand on.<br />On a location shot, a wide staircase will do fine.</p>

 

[craig_shearman1]

<p>The lens you have is perfectly fine. Absolutely no need for another lens.<br /><br />At the 18mm end, your lens is the equivalent of about 27mm on your crop sensor camera. During my newspaper days the widest lens I had was a 28 and I never had a problem shooting groups. 21 people is nothing.<br /><br />Your bigger problem is posing and lighting. You obviously can't line up 21 people straight across. And even when you break them up into multiple rows, you still don't want just a straight line. Look at some group shots online. You will see that besides rows, you can break people into sort of bunches, groups within the group, etc. Stairs, etc. can help as a posing aid but are not necessarily required. Again, look at as many large group pictures as you can for ideas.<br /><br />Being on a short stepstool of even a chair and shooting slightly down can make it easier to make sure no one's face is hidden.<br /><br />Ideally, I would use a couple of flash units in umbrellas. But you can use your speedlight with a Stofen omnibounce, or one of the Lumiquest modifiers, or the modifier of your choice. Simplest thing is to tilt the head up about 45 degrees with a piece of white cardboard rubber banded to it to kick some light forward. Or point the head straight up and bend the cardboard forward 45 degrees to get a combination of bounce light and a kicker to make sure there is detail in the faces.<br /><br />Most important -- shoot a lot of frames. With 21 people, you have 21 times as many chances for somebody's eyes to be closed as you do with one person.</p>

[JeffBryce]

<p>Tell everyone to close their eyes and when you say "open" have them open them! Seriously. Other than that, you'll be fine with what you have. Positioning of people as mentioned above is critical. I'm predominantly a landscape photographer, and I use ultra wide lenses to exaggerate the size of foreground objects. So getting everyone on the same plane is important. Getting far back at 55mm will help.</p>

 

[kogalleries]

<p>You should also think about this as a professional making money at it. If you wanting to make money at a profession, you don't need the very best tools, but you also shouldn't think the cheapest either. If your going to be doing a lot of these, look at reviews and quality, then go from there onto what you can afford. </p>

[jcuknz]

<p>faced with a similar problem and needing a solution 'NOW" I took two shots and stitched them together. This gave me the panoramic format suitable for the group and almost twice the resolution of a single shot.<br>

Lighting was not a problem as there were windows high up on one side and facing the group in the hall, I didn't have room to moved back and was using my mini tripod sitting on a cardboard box as my 'tripod' .. ten second delay release for each frame to let camera settle down after I pressed trigger and gave me time to include myself in one of the frames :-)<br>

Shooting with a bridge camera an extra lens is not an option.</p>

[Gary Naka]

Get your family or a bunch of friends, and PRACTICE. <br>

Very few things work better, for me, than actually going through the process and testing it out.<br>

Examples:<br>

• You said that you don't think your lens is good enough. You do not really know if it is or is not. So do a practice shot and find out for certain.
  
• I did a group shot of about a hundred people with my D70 (only 6 MegaPixle) and it's kit lens and made a 16x20 print for their office. And you could see everyone's face.
  
• The arrangement of people so that you can see everyone's face is more difficult when you have real people, than when you imagine it in your head. It is for me.
  
• Do a site trip. Go to the venue/site and check it out for posing locations. And maybe go back and do a practice shoot with your family or friends there.