small flash for fm2n and portra 800

[allen_ying]

<p>hi,<br>

i'm looking for a small compact flash for the nikon fm2.<br>

by small i mean around 2" tall, or at least under 3" tall.<br>

also, i typically shoot portra 800, and do not want to stop down to 5.6 or 8.<br>

it seems most of the older auto flashes, require you to stop down to use them.<br>

is there anything out there that will not overexpose, and throw off the flash to ambient ratio?<br>

thanks,</p>

[5711]

<p>metz 24, nikon sb-15, metz 34</p>

<p>does the new nikon sb-300 work?<br>

i dont know.</p>

[jose_angel]

<p>(I`m afraid the SB-300 is just an on-off flash).</p>

<p>I understand you want a fill flash for daylight work. And you want it to use at full apertures... the stop down technique is needed to avoid subject overexposure when there is no other way to control the flash output.</p>

<p>So you want a flash with full manual control, either in Auto or Manual mode (the FM2n is a dumb camera, it doesn`t have flash control). A flash with a LCD screen would be great, but I`m not aware of a small sized version. I tend to look for the biggest sized ones (personally, the biggest the better).</p>

<p>I`m thinking on a SB80/SB800 type flash, where you can control the output from 1:1 (full power) to 1:128. Simply check your ambient metering on the camera, and then trick the flash setting a one, two or three stops wider aperture (to your taste) to have a shorter flash duration. Results are so easy to control (under certain limits, obviously, you cannot reduce the ambient light -sometimes a small circular reflector is a much better solution-).</p>

[Wouter Willemse]

<p>Maybe the (new) Nissin i40 could be interesting: http://www.nissindigital.com/i40.html. It's got manual control, is small and reasonbly powerful (disclaimer: never used it, never seen it, so you might want to search some reviews first). I recently bought a pair of Yongnuo flashes, and I must say I am impressed for what they offer for their price, but they do not seem to have a specifically small model. If a bit larger is OK, they're really cheap, well constructed and offer full manual control.</p>

[rodeo_joe1]

<p>I have a low-profile Metz 40 MZ-1i, but it's not a small unit in overall size and weight. This has manual power selection down to 1/128th, but in AA mode its shortest distance at 800 ISO is just over 3 metres (10ft). At f/2 the shortest distance is 5 metres. So even a flexible flash such as that is limiting if you insist on using 800 ISO film and wide apertures. Manual for MZ-40-1i is here:<br /> <a href="https://www.metz.de/index.php?eID=tx_nawsecuredl&u=0&file=fileadmin/fm-dam/Download/Homepage_Englisch/Photo_Electronic/Bedienungsanleitung_GB/mecablitz_GB/mecablitz_40_bis_45/mecablitz_40_MZ_1i_GB.pdf&t=1427556709&hash=1748cc74a2ba3b9ec3b9e1d5d98bed81fc8ed00c">https://www.metz.de/index.php?eID=tx_nawsecuredl&u=0&file=fileadmin/fm-dam/Download/Homepage_Englisch/Photo_Electronic/Bedienungsanleitung_GB/mecablitz_GB/mecablitz_40_bis_45/mecablitz_40_MZ_1i_GB.pdf&t=1427556709&hash=1748cc74a2ba3b9ec3b9e1d5d98bed81fc8ed00c</a><br /> I suspect much the same is true of the Nissin i40, except that it has no Auto Aperture mode. <br /> Of course you can cut the power down by setting a short head "zoom", or fitting a Tupperware diffuser, or bouncing the flash. My best suggestion, however, is that you use a lower ISO film.</p>

[allen_ying]

<p>hmmm thanks.<br>

would the sb-300 work on an f100?<br>

the metz 24 looks like it doesn't have anything on the back to control or set output.<br>

the metz 40 and the others all still look pretty big.<br>

the nissin i40 looks ok, i guess auto mode wouldn't work for it an fm2n?<br>

i wonder if auto mode would work on an f100...<br>

(i use both fm2 and f100, and am looking for compact flashes for both)</p>

<p>what about this fuji one? it has manual power down to 1/64...<br>

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/849457-REG/Fujifilm_16241307_EF_X20_Shoe_Mount_Flash_for.html<br>

thanks,</p>

[jose_angel]

<p>Any flash with Auto or Manual mode should work. Auto mode means that the flash controls the output using a built in sensor, despite of the camera.<br /> The one from your link seems to have Manual mode, I understand it should work in any camera (no personal experience with it). No Auto mode, so you`ll need to work using the guide number for calculations.<br /> I think it should work: <a href="http://a248.e.akamai.net/pix.crutchfield.com/Manuals/072/072EFX20.PDF">EF-X20 instructions</a>.<br />Two AAA batteries, $179... ouch!<br /> ---<br /> From the <a href="http://download.nikonimglib.com/archive1/4X1uu00SnaAU00khBCA64cgdCI23/SB-300_CH(7C_DL)03.pdf">SB300 instructions</a>, I tend to think that it won`t work on your FM2n nor in the F100:<br /> <em>Manual Flash Control </em><br /> <em>When the SB-300 is mounted on a camera, manual fl ash control can be enabled </em><br /> <em>by selecting Manual as the fl ash control mode for the optional fl ash unit in the </em><br /> <em>camera menus. Manual fl ash control is not available with D3-series, D2-series, </em><br /> <em>D200, D80, D70-series, D50, and F6 cameras. </em></p>

[rodeo_joe1]

<p>The written spec on B&H's web page says 1/64th power for that little Fuji job. However the picture clearly shows that the dial only goes down to 1/32 power. Perhaps B&H are mistakenly counting the +/- 1 stop compensation? However, that only works in TTL mode and on Fuji Cameras. It's all on the same dial, so obviously can't be used in conjunction with manual power selection.</p>

<p>Allen, we might be able to make better suggestions if you told us exactly what you're trying to achieve, and why you need to use 800 ISO film. Because if you use that film in anything approaching daylight, then the X-synch speed of the camera will prevent you using a wide aperture anyway. And in artificial light the flash will have a different colour from ambient. Maybe a feeble LED video light would be a better solution.</p>

[bebu_lamar]

<p>I checked the Nikon SB-15 and in AA mode @ISO800 the aperture choice is f/11 and f/22. It's funny that my way too big Metz 60CT4 in AA mode can do f/2.8 @ISO800</p>

[allen_ying]

<p>ok, if the sb-300 doesn't work on an F6, it probably won't work on f100 or fm2.<br>

i'm watching some of the fuji EF-X20 on ebay for around $75, which is more reasonable than $180 for sure. 1/32 sounds like it would be the kind of output i need, even if it doesn't go to 1/64th...<br>

i use 800 iso film because sometimes i need a fast shutter speed, and sometimes i like to shoot in dim light. sometimes i want to use a flash when it's dark out, but i want to pick up ambient light without dragging the shutter too long so that it blurs. if it's daytime i likely will not use a flash, but if i did i would be willing to stop down then if needed, but at least the fm2n has a 1/250th shutter.<br>

it makes sense to me that a larger flash will have more power down auto options.<br>

so, i guess assuming the fm2n will trigger the fuji flash, that's the best option right now...<br>

i'll try to win one on ebay that has a return policy and report back,<br>

thanks!</p>

[andrew_hall1]

<blockquote>

<p>i typically shoot portra 800, and do not want to stop down to 5.6 or 8.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Then use slower film or an ND filter.</p>

[allen_ying]

<p>that wouldn't do much for getting ambient exposure without dragging the shutter too long.</p>

[jose_angel]

<p>Allen, why not to use a small circular reflector?</p>

<p>It is not as comfortable as using a flash head, but will solve your problems. Specially those related to exposure; when using film you don`t have a screen to check the flash balance, you can check the reflector effect directly on the viewfinder prior to the exposure. No batteries, results are quite moldable.</p>

<p>Sincerely, fill flash has been to me an annoyance before the arrival of dedicated fill flash heads and digital photography. Or too much fill, or too little. These days I only use the TTL BL system on digital cameras. For my film work (currently, I spend more time shooting film than digital), I by far prefer a reflector. The only flash I use came from three studio strobes with softeners. The reflectors I use are Lastolite made, the unit I mention is about 4 feet diameter, one side silver, the other gold. I think these are available in much smaller sizes if needed.</p>

[allen_ying]

<p>reflectors are great, but not when trying to be a fly on the wall, with a 3" flash... thanks.</p>

[bebu_lamar]

<p>If you know the distance before hand you can put stuff like tissues to reduce the flash output.</p>

[fred_c1]

<blockquote>

<p>i typically shoot portra 800, and do not want to stop down to 5.6 or 8.</p>

<p>Use slower film or an ND filter</p>

<p>that wouldn't do much for getting ambient exposure without dragging the shutter too long.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>You do know that "not stopping down" already means higher shutter speeds, at the same ISO without filters?</p>

<p>Or should your original question be phrased like "recommend a weak flash for<strong> indoor use</strong>"?</p>

[allen_ying]

<p>if i have a strong flash at f8 shooting indoors, or outdoors under street light, i will need a long shutter speed to get any ambient exposure, likely making backgrounds blurry, which sometimes i want, but in this situation i don't.<br>

if i have a weak flash at f2.8 shooting indoors, or outdoors under street light, i will not need to be as long of a shutter speed to get any ambient exposure, so that backgrounds and buildings can be seen clearly.<br>

if i use an ND filter at f2.8, i will need a longer shutter speed to get ambient exposure.</p>

[allen_ying]

<p>well, this is what the fuji ef-x20 looks like on a nikon fm2n...<br>

<a href="

<a href="

it powers down to 1/64, and then has a switch for an internal diffuser to slide in, which takes away another stop, to "1/128".<br /><br />at 1/128, at arm's length, at 800 iso, it meters around f4.<br /><br />the only thing is it doesn't lock into place like it does on my nikon d3, or f100, which have a little hole in the hot shoe for the locking pin. i'm considering trying to dremel a little hole in the fm2n's hot shoe, but might not.</p>

 

[allen_ying]

<p>hmmm, that little fuji flash doesn't seem to be working properly anymore, when set at any manual output, it fires at full power, even when hitting the test button.<br>

i'm not sure if being on a manual camera would've affected it, i don't think i dropped it, if i did i'm sure it wasn't a memorably bad drop.<br>

i can still return it to b&h used dept, but only for a replacement, which is funny cause the one they have in used is listed at $130 instead of $150, which i paid. but i can't get store credit since it's passed 30 days.<br>

i don't even want to keep it since i've been using an n80/f80, but do you think it could have actually been the manual fm2 that damaged the flash?</p>