Jumping Into Photography as more than a Hobby!

[morgan_kapinos]

<p>Hi everyone!<br>

I have recently decided to take the plunge and give photography a try...as a full-fledged lifestyle/career! I have always loved photography and have some background in darkroom photography but am looking to make the transition into digital photography. I have never owned a "nice" digital camera - nothing beyond the basic point and shoot so any camera advice would be very much appreciated. Here are some main considerations I would like to take into account when purchasing a camera -<br>

1. Price - I'm a bit flexible on this but would prefer something $500 or less. Ultimately I am willing to spend a bit more if it's going to make a significant different in photo quality but I think right now I am just looking to explore my own artistic style and perspective and would like a solid camera to do that.<br>

2. I've heard that it's more important to invest in a solid camera body - and then invest in different lenses later - would people generally agree with this?<br>

3. I am mostly looking to shoot things outdoors, in the field and envision myself focusing mostly on people/cityscapes/urban enviornments. I see myself something trying to shoot during daylight hours...not sure if that affects things or not!<br>

4. I would like something relatively small/not bulky as I plan on doing some travel next fall to kick things off and would like something that's not too difficult to lug around.<br>

I think that pretty much does it...at least on the surface! Definitely feel free to ask clarifying questions because I am sure there are things I haven't thought of! But I would greatly appreciate any input that anyone has :)<br>

Also I would love to hear how people started pursuing photography in a more serious way - suggestions for blogging, networking, taking classes etc. Any advice is welcome!! Thank you!</p>

[sgust]

<p>I don't want to discourage your hopes of being a professional photographer, but (and this is a pretty big "but") if your asking these questions I can't imagine the scenario in which you will be able to make a living off of it in the near term.<br>

My advice, don't quit you job just yet. Get yourself a dSLR, if your budget is tight maybe get a used one from a reputable dealer like KEH, and get proficient in it's use. Post your images here, asking advice about specific aspects of the image in question that your unsure of. If you have talent for it, you'll be taking great pictures in no time. If you don't, you'll get there a little bit slower like the most of us.</p>

[jim_momary]

<p>Bear in mind the following somewhat discouraging words ...From what I've seen of professional photography, it is a small part of camera clicking and a very large part of running a business, branding, marketing, etc.<br>

It takes more than just skill behind the eyepiece. I think I take some pretty decent photos after some 4+ decades of "practice", but I'm just an old engineer not a photog. It's a great hobby but I'd suck at it as a career.<br>

If I picked up Picasso's brush or Adams' camera, my "art" would still ring of "Jim".</p>

<p>Your eye and skill trump any piece of gear. Some gear just makes it easier to get the tough stuff done.<br>

My 2.445 cents.</p>

<p>$500 isn't a whole lot ... so I too would advise used.</p>

<p>Jim<br>

:o)</p>

[Spearhead]

<blockquote>

<p>I am mostly looking to shoot things outdoors, in the field and envision myself focusing mostly on people/cityscapes/urban enviornments.</p>

</blockquote>

<p> <br>

Have you thought about who is going to buy the photos? How much they will pay for them? How big the market is? Far more important that what you are "looking to shoot."</p>

[JDMvW]

<p>There was an ad for something or other that had two horrified parents sitting on a sofa, with the silhouette of their offspring in the foreground,<br /> the words across the bottom were<br /> "Mom, Dad, I've decided to become a photographer!"</p>

<p>Think about this very carefully. Professional photography is under pressure from at least two directions -</p>

<ul>

<li>nearly everybody who has a cellphone has a camera, and that means nearly everybody has a camera on them, period.</li>

<li>computer-generated images for product work - an area that would have seemed immune to the cell-phone.</li>

</ul>

<p>Of course, so far, one photographic area is to teach photography to others with the same aspirations. But the MOOC (Massive open online course) situation may affect that professional choice as well.<br /> This means that someone who wants to be a professional photographer has to find some way to stand out from the crowd, to exploit some niche.<br /> It's not so different from wanting to be a major-league sports player.</p>

[grh]

<p>1) Don't quite your day job.<br>

2) Get a decent camera body, but a good lens. Your budget is, however, very tight. Almost unrealistically so.<br>

3) Quality depends primarily on you and your skills. The camera is a tool. You need to understand how to use the tool, its limitations, and how to make it do what you want. If you have no experience here, then you would be better off taking the time to learn first. Enthusiasm aside.<br>

4) You're not sure about shooting during daylight hours, which implies that you do not understand light. Photography is all about light. This poses an impediment for reaching your goal.<br>

5) Professional cameras with flexibility mean lugging equipment around. No 2 ways about it. A Canon Rebel or a Nikon D5200/D3200 class body is about as small as you're going to get, and those are considered "prosumer" bodies. Not that you can't do great work with them.<br>

Deciding to take the plunge is a long way from being effective and successful. It takes a lot of work. Good luck.</p>

[johnw63]

<p>Morgan,</p>

<p>If you are already wealthy, I say, " Jump right in ! " </p>

<p>If not, the above advice already given is good. Here is some of it boiled down to the basics. If you have real talent, and you learn to use any camera you can get your hands on really, really, well, you can take some great photos. Not every pro photographer in history had the biggest best camera gear available. They used the right tool for the job. It could be a consumer grade camera or it could be the top of the line. It depends on what feature that shot or type of shots they needed at the time. One big difference is when they were professional they knew what gear was the right tool, they didn't have to ask. You need to get to the point were you KNOW what tools you need to get the shots you want BEFORE you take the step you are talking about. I would check out the used camera "kits" at KEH.com as a starting place, or a good sale on a refurbished camera and lens at places like B&H Photo or Adorama. When you get to the point of using that kit and knowing it is holding you back and what you NEED to get to the next level, you will be in a much better place to start thinking about trying to make money. </p>

<p>Then .... once you have a good selection of photos you think might sell, you have to figure out HOW to do that. How to market yourself. How to stand out of the crowd. So many people think an in focus shot of themselves in the mirror is a "good picture" these days. How do you get them to need to PAY for what you want to do ? </p>

<p> </p>

[AlanKlein]

<p>You have to eat while you learn. So before you quit your regular job, as others have said already, get experience with photography. Then when you think you have some capability, get a job (maybe part-time) with another photographer so you can improve your skills. Like a wedding photographer who would need assistants. This way you can earn money while you learn the trade. You also will be exposed to the business side of photography. Learning to sell yourself and your phototography is at least as important as taking the picture, most probably more important. Good luck.</p>

[hjoseph7]

<p>If you want some good information on getting into "professional " photography I recommend you read this book. <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Photography-Focus-Profit-Tom-Zimberoff/dp/B004JZWOQA">http://www.amazon.com/Photography-Focus-Profit-Tom-Zimberoff/dp/B004JZWOQA</a></p>

[keith reeder]

<p>Morgan, just for a bit of real world context, your post is a little bit like someone who has never played football in his life waking up one day and deciding he wants to be a pro footballer.</p>

<p>There are dues to be paid, experience to be earned and work to be done first. </p>

[Spearhead]

<p>Actually, I was thinking more of someone going out and buying a Stratocaster and saying they wanted to become a professional musician. At least football doesn't give the impression that equipment makes one successful. But some people think that's true in music.</p>

[keith reeder]

<p>Yep, that's a better way to make the point, Jeff - I've been a guitarist for 30-odd years (pretty good too, in my day, in an Allan Holdsworth, Joe Satriani sort of way), and in that time, I've lost count of the number of times I've seen examples of exactly the point you're making.</p>

<p>Same in mountain biking, where we referred to such folks as <strong>AGNI</strong> - "<strong>A</strong>ll the <strong>G</strong>ear and <strong>N</strong>o <strong>I</strong>dea".</p>

<p>(That's not directed at you, Morgan - just a general observation).</p>

<p> </p>

[don_essedi]

I'm not a pro, but over the years here, the following is the common advice about 'which camera' for those considering a career as a professional photographer:

 

A Nikon or Canon dslr. The reasons given are:

 

1 Variety and availability of equipment of interest to pros

 

2 Employer provided cameras are usually Canon or Nikon dslrs

 

3 Nikon and Canon equipment availability for rental

 

Go to a store. See what is in your price range with the kit lens. The one that feels best in your hands is the one to buy...Canon or Nikon at this stage doesn't matter.

 

 

Good luck

[Spearhead]

<p>Which camera doesn't matter. It's probably the least important thing. The OP still hasn't answered who the market for "things outdoors" is, which is important.</p>

[don_essedi]

I don't think that matters, Jeff. The OP wrote nothing about being a professional photographer or the market for photographers. He referred to a career in photography and taking his photography more seriously. "Career" sure sounds like he wants to pay the rent with his photography, but maybe not. His reference to "lifestyle" along with "career" makes me wonder whether we've got his intention 'in clear'. It is an enthusiastic and ambiguous post.

 

Besides asking for advice about a digital camera, he requested "suggestions for blogging, networking, taking classes etc."

 

We've latched onto "career", it seems, when in fact he wanted advice on getting serious about photography.

[keith reeder]

<blockquote>

<p>The OP wrote nothing about being a professional photographer</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Don, he did write:</p>

<blockquote>

<p>I have recently decided to take the plunge and give photography a try...<strong>as a full-fledged lifestyle/career!</strong></p>

</blockquote>

<p>"Full-fledged" sounds to me like a pretty unambiguous statement of intent to go pro - "career" isn't synonymous with "hobby", no matter how seriously we might take the hobby.<strong><br /></strong></p>

[don_essedi]

"Don, he did write:"

 

Yep. I did write: ""Career" sure sounds like he wants to pay the rent with his photography, but maybe not. His reference to "lifestyle" along with "career"...etc

 

This is the Beginner's forum. One assumes the OPs know nothing. One doesn't call them "trolls", nor does one bust their chops over where the hell they expect to find a market...or, in your case, perhaps insist they justify their choice of words.

 

I assume the moderator is having a nice get away this weekend.

[joe_willmore]

<p>Morgan: how do you end up with $100,000 USD as a photographer? Start out with $200,000. It's extremely difficult to be a successful, full-time, self-supporting photographer these days. Entry is easy, everyone's got a sophisticated camera, and you're competing against your client's nephew who took some nifty photos during the family reunion last year and he'll shoot for free!<br>

1. I disagree with your advice about getting a good body and then adding the glass later. Lens trumps body. If you're really, truly, seriously committed to doing this, I'd get a used Nikon D90 (solid camera, built like a rock, does nothing brilliantly but does everything solidly). It's versatile and it shoots forever. And in 1-2 years when you upgrade to a professional body or a high-end prosumer body, it would serve as your backup. B/c a serious pro will have at least 2 bodies. If you're shooting a wedding, you can't yell out "stop the vows, I need to switch batteries." If you're shooting the local HS sports teams and have 500 individual portraits lines up (plus team shots) for 1 hour and your body starts malfunctioning, you've got to have a backup. If you're shooting a sunset, it won't wait for you to fix a jammed shutter or troubleshoot an error message. I know a couple of full-time wedding photographers who have D90's as their backup bodies. But the key points are: serious photographers have backups, and a good body with a kit lens will produce mostly mediocre work that won't earn you money but a mediocre or even obsolete/out of production body with really good glass (if used well) is more likely to produce winning shots.<br>

2. The least important parts of being a successful (ie: making money enough to live off of) photographer are your skill as a photographer and your equipment. The most important parts are: skill at running a business day to day, marketing, a clear niche market, and solid business plan. I know, doesn't sound very glamorous does it. For instance, I know two pros who make a living doing this and all they do are shoot pets. Every weekend each of them is at an agility or conformance or field trial. There are wedding photographers where 95% of what they shoot is weddings. And so on. You said you intend to shoot landscapes--so figure out how you'd sell those prints (and how you'd print them...b/c you aren't going to make much money selling electronic files of landscapes).<br>

3. If you're going to be a professional or at least fulltime, you're going to have a lot of gear. Let's say you focus solely on landscapes and some wildlife photography. You're going to want to carry a tripod with you, a major zoom (300mm or 400mm--it needs to be a zoom b/c the wildlife won't wait or maybe there's a canyon between you and that beautiful shadow) with maybe a teleconverter, a wide angle lens b/c sometimes you're shooting a vista, a plethora of filters (UV filter, definitely a polarizing filter, a series of ND filters and probably a GND for sunsets), a speedlight for foregrounds on sunny days where light is extreme, extra cards and batteries, and b/c you're outdoors cleaning equipment and ways to deal with sand on the beach or blowing dust or rain or the transition from a warm car interior to a cold outdoors. And if you do a lot of outdoors/landscape/wildlife photography that's going to mean showing up to a site before sunrise or after sunset. So you'll need to schlep bug spray, a flashlight, water, emergency first aid kit, hat and sunscreen, maybe pepper spray for bears or other potentially dangerous creatures. The point is: serious photographers carry a lot of crap. Don't pick a camera b/c it's easier to travel with...b/c you'll have gear (different lens) that are bigger than any camera you'll potentially get. Pick a camera b/c it fits your needs or you have smaller hands/weaker muscles so a smaller camera will be steadier when you shoot. Not b/c it fits in to your luggage or pocket. B/c otherwise you're talking a point and shoot camera.</p>

[Spearhead]

<blockquote>

<p> nor does one bust their chops over where the hell they expect to find a market</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Not telling them that they hold unrealistic views because they're a beginner? The idea is to give useful advice, not hold a feel good session.</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>I assume the moderator is having a nice get away this weekend.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Speaking as a long-time moderator on the site, there is nothing here that moderator would clip.</p>

[dan_south]

Some people do make a successful career in photography. If the OP wants to do the same, first they'll need to develop top notch skills,

not only with whatever camera he buys but with lighting, software, post processing, retouching, computers, file organization, archiving,

and backups, and more.

 

Secondly, they'll need to learn a lot about business: contracts, insurance, permits, legal matters, marketing, accounting, taxes, and of

course, promotion.

 

Finally, in order to tie it all together, they should expect to spend some time working for a successful photographer, studio, or agency.

The best way to learn any business is to be in the business. Work as a photographer's assistant or as a temp in a photo editor's office or

as a junior photographer on some staff if that's possible - any position that can get them close to the action. Be patient, be professional,

and deliver the results that are asked for while learning as much as possible from that environment.

 

There are other ways to become a working photographer, but this approach would put them into a position to learn from people who

already succeed at what they want to do. Best of luck to the OP on their journey.

[david_smith110]

<blockquote>

<p>Speaking as a long-time moderator on the site, there is nothing here that moderator would clip.</p>

 

</blockquote>

<p>Except that my post has been removed. But granted, it wasnt helpful at all. :)</p>

[Spearhead]

<p>I guess I didn't see it, so I can't comment on it.</p>

[James G. Dainis]

David Smith,

 

I am the moderator of this forum. I never removed any of your posts. Perhaps you would like to repost what you think has been removed.

[mike dixon]

I removed David's post. It was both rude and unhelpful.

[ted_raper1]

<p>The hardest thing these days has already been mentioned - everyone has a camera now, and that is making it much harder to make any money as a photographer. I have been exhibiting and selling photos in galleries for many years, but since the advent of cellphone cameras it has gotten much tougher. The attitude is "why should I pay for that photograph when I can make one just like it with my cell phone?"</p>

<p>My sales have dropped off a lot in the past few years. You can make money as a photographer, but it is damn tough. And taking the picture is only 10% of the deal. Listen to the good advice you have been given in this forum, and best of luck to you.</p>