D'oh - Fotog shatters ancient statue

[mike_godwin1]

<p>Not sure if this is the forum to post this but here goes anyway..<br>

<a href="http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/art_breaking_imo1lyGL5zNsGJ8CWTgBjN">Clumsy photographer breaks ancient African sculpture - NYPOST.com</a></p>

<p>Let's be careful out there...</p>

<p> </p>

[sarah_fox]

<blockquote>

<p>Arman, whose [late] husband was a legendary sculptor who routinely used smashed and broken items in his works...</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Wow, is that ironic, or what?! Hopefully they got some nice photographs to remember the artifact.</p>

[jim_j2]

<p>Just one "Oh Sh*t" wipes out all the "attaboy's" in this case!</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>"A rep for Guillermain, who's not named in the lawsuit, also did not return a call."</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Not yet anyway!</p>

[peter_e]

<p>The photog has no assets to go after...<br>

If it is indeed a piece of world heritage, how does it end up in a private home? How does anyone legally own such things without violating various export and antiquities laws?</p>

[MichaelChang]

<blockquote>

<p><em>“During the course of photographing the Nok figure, the photographers moved the Nok figure from its location to another location on the opposite side of the room” without Arman’s permission, she says in a Manhattan Supreme Court lawsuit" </em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>I guess that's what happens when you use a highbrow fashion photographer (<a href="https://www.google.ca/search?q=Eric+Guillemain&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=U8qeT__ND-iu6AGBy7yjDw&biw=1236&bih=660&sei=c8qeT67yL8W10QHirOHjDg">Eric Guillemain</a>) for the job.</p>

[Hector Javkin]

<p>It isn't only the Post reporting this, it's on Reuters and other respectable sources. So it really happened!</p>

[JDMvW]

<p>Peter has it exactly spot on. This is a Nigerian and World treasure and should not have been intrusted to such a careless private owner in the first place. There is an extremely good chance that it is an illegal, smuggled item anyhow, although I am also obliged to note that there are some very good forgeries of Nok figures out there (cheers!).</p>

<p>This is not uncommon, by the way. Some photographers are too often like that annoying guy in the Nikon ads (Google™ for that and it will turn up the name). The "hitching post for the sun" at Machu Picchu was damaged by a crew making a beer commercial http://abcnews.go.com/International/story?id=82627&page=1#.T57Nso5V6qQ .</p>

 

[MichaelChang]

<p>The Nok culture where the figure originated was apparently only discovered in the late 1920s in Nigeria which was then a British colony, so it would seem reasonable that artifacts were traded into private collections.</p>

<p>Nigeria gained independence only in 1960 so it might be still too early for the country to demand repatriation of its ancient artifacts. </p>

[scott_ferris]

<p>I was in a museum in Vietnam once, as I walked around admiring the thousand year old Khmer sculptures, a loud local family arrived with several badly behaved children in tow. Two of the children proceeded to sit on a very old lion statue and kick it until the head fell off and rolled across the museum floor!</p>

[MichaelChang]

<p>Scott, museums will routinely place reproductions on display for that very reason. </p>

[James G. Dainis]

It was getting old anyway. It's about time she bought a new one.

[rnt]

<p>Photographers <em>have</em> been getting clumsy... Remember the <a href="http://fstoppers.com/news-photographer-kills-rare-earless-mutant-rabbit">rabbit</a>?</p>

[._kaa]

"<i>This is a Nigerian and World treasure and should not have been intrusted to such a careless private owner in the first place.</i>" <br><br>

 

LOL. Oh, boy. What an attitude! :-D

[MichaelChang]

<p>Looking at the picture of the shattered figure, it's a perfect opportunity to examine it for authenticity and inquiry into how it was made. It can possibly even be reassembled since every piece is there and will still have historical value if proven to be authentic. </p>

[jay_hector]

<p>Speaking of Arman and smashed objects, I wrote a story and photographed one of his better works for Road & Track about 30 years ago. Note that R&T converted the K64 shots to B&W, and then also reversed the frame with Arman's signature (which you can barely read anyway).</p>

<p>http://www.jaypix.com/pix/parking.jpg </p>

[MichaelChang]

<p>That's really interesting, Jay. Thanks for posting it. I wonder if the piece still exists on display somewhere; presumably the cars will corrode from exposure to the elements and weaken the structure.</p>

[JDMvW]

<blockquote>

<p>LOL. Oh, boy. What an attitude! :-D</p>

</blockquote>

<p>I can assure you that international treaties and law back up my "amusing attitude". What's so funny? That a people should try to preserve their historical heritage?<br>

I know something about Nok and Nigerian archaeology, having actually worked there.<br>

It is by no means impossible to go after these malefactors of great wealth.<br>

If the artifact truly came out of Nigeria before 1960, I suspect British law would apply, but it's far more likely to have been smuggled out by pothunter looters at a later date.</p>

[scott_ferris]

<p>I would venture to suggest that archeologists have done far more damage to "irreplaceable ancient works" than all the photographers, or even millionaire collectors, in the history of the world. So lets not try to shout moral high grounds from the history of archeologists, you would be on very shaky ground, if it weren't for them most of these laws would never have been necessary.</p>

<p>Indeed if it weren't for archeological expeditions that brought back these priceless pieces in the first place the multimillionaires would never have been told that they need to spend hundreds of thousands hoarding it. Oh, and also lets not forget the guilt the museums and national governments should take for their totally irresponsible and indefensible "collecting" of a lot of these pieces.</p>

 

[JDMvW]

<p>Scott, obviously your knowledge of what archaeologists, professional ones, anyhow, are is clearly based on having watched Indiana Jones too much.<br>

Archaeologists have been in the forefront in getting antiquities laws passed. We have not been without flaws, we are part of our culture too, after all, but compared to the others we can claim the high ground on this issue.<br>

The pieces we're talking about here were not "brought back" by any professional archaeologists.<br>

As for those treasures in the museums, I think it's a little unjust to blame things like the Elgin Marbles on a profession that was not then in existence.</p>

[MichaelChang]

<p>Respectfully to JDM's profession, there are indeed unscrupulous individuals (and always will be) perpetrating crimes involving archaeological finds which should not taint an entire discipline of professionals and academics whose goal is to preserve found objects and expand knowledge. </p>

<p>On the lawsuit side, I think the woman might be on thin ground going after Art+Auction magazine presumably because they have deeper pockets than the photographer. Without a doubt the photographer can be held liable, but there was no mention of going after the photographer as defendant with the magazine as co-defendant, rather she appears to be suing the magazine only for vicarious liability.</p>

<p>An employer of a contractor can not usually be held liable for the contractor's wrongdoing unless the plaintiff can demonstrate special circumstances or a unique relationship between the photographer and the magazine.</p>

<p>She will also need to prove the figure's worth in her claim which might also be difficult. </p>

<p>I also wonder if she collected insurance, and the amount if so. </p>

[scott_ferris]

<p> It might not have been in existence then, but the shameful refusal to acknowledge their theft and the subsequent return to their rightful home can be held up as a shining example of one of the many things that is bad in the world of antiquities.</p>

<p>I didn't suggest there were no good archeologists, but as a profession, Indiana Jones aside, they have probably done as much harm as good, but even if that is a gross exaggeration, and seeing some of the sites I have I don't believe it is, it is still, even if you are very conservative, to the order of many magnitudes higher than all the photographers, film crews, and high end collectors ever have. Further, many of the practices they excuse by claiming to be searching for knowledge and understanding are little more than distasteful legitimised grave robbing.</p>

[JDMvW]

<p>Scott, you simply don't know what you are talking about. Seriously.<br>

There is plenty wrong in the world of "antiquities," but that is NOT archaeology in any meaningful sense of the term. Archaeologists have been in the forefront of repatriation, even when it hurts. Collectors and art museums are another matter altogether, unfortunately.</p>

[._kaa]

JDM: <i>What's so funny? That a people should try to preserve their historical heritage?</i><br><br>

 

What's funny is your conviction that individuals should not be able to own really valuable things. Because they can't be trusted with them.<br><br>

 

I find that very funny :-)

[sarah_fox]

<p>Kaa, in all fairness, I don't think JDM believes people shouldn't be able to own really valuable things. I doubt he would feel the same way about a brick of gold.</p>

<p>Scott, I live in an archaeological hot-spot, and I see archaeologists in action on an everyday basis. Nothing I've seen leads me to believe they do anything to harm conservation efforts. Quite the opposite.</p>

[noreen]

<p>As someone with degrees in nautical archaeology and Egyptology, I am curious as to what archaeological sites Scott has seen. I hope that "American Digger" and "Diggers" (shame on Nat'l Geographic) are not being taken as representative of the profession.</p>