Kodak Killing slide film?

[tim gray]

<p>S. Usary. I think this was already posted on this thread. Look at the following link for Kodak's reversal films. You'll find E100G and E100VS, as well as a link to the Elite Chrome equivalents. Granted, it's only 2 (or 4 films), but they still are on the website.</p>

<p>http://www.kodak.com:80/global/en/professional/products/films/filmsIndex.jhtml</p>

[fredonian]

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<p>It may be that film and digital really could use each other at end, as it can sometimes be the small appreciable factors of a product which become overlooked with mistargeting for it's marketing appeal to the masses. It wasn't untill recently that it occured to me on how Kodak might had missed on a grand opportunity with improving the sales for reversal and print films with not developing and applying them to be used in making backup copies of digital images. While the technology is now available with specialty services in having a digital image copied in an Ektachrome slide, (not sure about negatives) it is still a specialty service and remains fairly expensive. Perhaps making it more a readily and affordable option for the average and proffessinal consumer at one-hour- photo and mail in labs in having copies of their digital images printed with reversal films or into negatives on print films would draw more sales with films. It would at least offer a more tangeable means for creating archival backups of digital images should somehow the data from the original image become lost or the means for it being read become obsolete.</p><br>

<p>I know how the subject on the ahcivalability of digital usually draws a stir, but it seems to me that digital media still fails in being FULLY trustworthy for it's survivability over the long term. Not the data itself, but by which means the data can be read and seen years from now. How can it matter that a dvd or cd can out weather half a century if it can't be readily seen when found. I wonder how many images on CD or DVD of possible historical significance, will be trashed because at the time who ever was cleaning out the attic couldn't easily and readily review what was on them while he was in a hurry to clean it out.</p><br>

<p>And even if the images were printed on an inkjet. Is anyone really looking forward to the future gerations being left to possibly relying on the resolution of an inkjet of which might become the only surviving copy of some the best images of our time? Not mentioning the likelyhood of some getting heavily soiled and littered with decades of insect and rat droppings.</p>

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[d_f11]

<p>Let's face it folks - the digital interests will not tolerate a world where film exists - like big oil will not tolerate a world where electric powered cars exist. Simple.</p>

[jim_devlin]

I don't know how anyone could argue that slide film isn't hidden on the Kodak website - click on 'Kodak store' and 'Film' and all you find is links to print film products. Sure doesn't seem like they want any new customers to find their E-6 film.

[tim gray]

<p>Jim - the store isn't a good place to find what products are still being sold. They've never carried a full line up there. It's a shame that it's feature so prominently on the Kodak page. The more accurate place to look for Kodak film products is:<br>

www.kodak.com/go/professional</p>

[art_thomas1]

 

<p ><a name="00YHb6"></a>**"<a href="../photodb/user?user_id=2233267">Tim Gray</a> <a href="../member-status-icons"></a>, Feb 24, 2011; 11:06 a.m.</p>

 

<p>Jim - the store isn't a good place to find what products are still being sold. They've never carried a full line up there. It's a shame that it's feature so prominently on the Kodak page. The more accurate place to look for Kodak film products is:<br /><a href="http://www.kodak.com/go/professional">www.kodak.com/go/professional</a><br>

**"</p>

<p>If you only sing to the choir, how are you going to maximize your congregation? You have to know the secret password to find their product line-up? Typical of the management decisions made by the empty suits at the top. Gosh-a-roney...I wonder why Kodak is a big corporate loser??.......................</p>

 

 

[chrisnielsen]

<p>The slide films are on the professional site, not the consumer site. That makes sense to me, as I can't see the granny who takes her camera to the camera store because she can't load film in it herself, going and buying slide film.</p>

<p>Kodak needs us to go buy film from them, not sit around here complaining.</p>

[tim gray]

<p>I agree. It's poor placement. It is what it is though. The link is in the top right, 'all products -> pro photographer'.</p>

[fredonian]

It seems now perhaps something

strange has been going on after all. The police in

Rochester have reportedly unearthed yet another

shallow pit full of unexposed Ektachromes

near the Kodak plant. It's a bit too early to know for

sure, but apparently they had all been burried

while they were still alive! Kodak has so far refused

to make comment. Hhmmnn...very strange.

[ray .]

Ha. Thanks for the laugh Charles!

[jens_g.r._benthien]

<p>I don't know if Kodak is really 'killing' slide film. They have reduced their film emulsions substantially, not because they want to kill that business part, but to focus on the most profitable products. Be honest - any pro around here who ever used a 200 ASA slide film? Either 100 or 400. So, today you still get the E 100 G in different formats, even in 8x10". </p>

<p>Fuji offers many more types to choose from, but their largest format is 4x5". </p>

<p>I just checked my distributor's web site for slide film:<br>

<em>Professional slide films</em></p>

<ul>

<li>FUJI Astia 100F</li>

<li>FUJI Provia 100 F</li>

<li>FUJI T 64</li>

<li>FUJI Velvia 100 "F"</li>

<li>FUJI Velvia 100</li>

<li>FUJI Velvia 50</li>

<li>KODAK E 100G</li>

<li>KODAK E 100VS</li>

</ul>

<p><em>Amateur slide films</em></p>

<ul>

<li>AGFAPHOTO CT precisa 100</li>

<li>FUJI Sensia 100</li>

<li>KODAK Elitechrome 100</li>

<li>KODAK Elitechrome Professional 200</li>

<li>KODAK Elitechrome Extra Color 100</li>

</ul>

<p>Compared to available sensor brands this is a very large range of media for capturing. Not to mention the even larger range for negative film.</p>

<p>IMHO we have to face a reduced offer, but hey, for years I have been shooting Fuji Provia 100F almost exclusively in 35mm, MF and LF, just substituted it with Kodak EliteChrome 100 for 35mm last year.</p>

<p>That means I've limited myself to a certain emulsion to keep the workflows identical, knowing the behavior in different light situations. At least for me there is no reason to complain. I had a choice but never used it.</p>

<p>My hats off to Kodak that they still cut film for the LF shooters!</p>

[neal_weissman]

<p>a few noob questions:<br>

<em>specifically why</em> is kodak ceasing slide film production, but maintaining print film production -- it is my understanding that professionals prefer slides?<br>

the preceding post lists <em>Professional</em> slide films and <em>Amateur</em> slide films -- what is the difference? as an amateur, why would i not want to shoot the professional film?</p>

[jens_g.r._benthien]

<p>Neil, yes, professionals prefer slide film. The whole ad industry used slide film until they switched to digital. Negative or print film had been used by the masses, because the C41 development could be handled in small local shops, for the E6 development you needed a considerably more precise and controllable process.</p>

<p>Amateur slide film used to be cheaper, because the emulsions could be 'mixed', that means Kodak and Fuji could sell emulsions from different 'runs' or 'batches' in the factory. The pros used to buy specific lots with identical emulsion numbers from one single 'run' or 'batch' to avoid color shifts - a critical point before the age of scanning and easy post processing with filters.</p>

<p>You can shoot pro films. However, the world has changed a lot since my last post almost one and a half year ago:<br>

<em>Professional slide films</em></p>

<ul>

<li>FUJI Provia 100 F</li>

<li>FUJI Provia 400 X</li>

<li>FUJI Velvia 100 F</li>

<li>FUJI Velvia 100</li>

<li>FUJI Velvia 50</li>

</ul>

<p><em>Amateur slide films</em></p>

<ul>

<li>AGFAPHOTO CT precisa 100 (which actually is a re-branded FUJI Provia 100 F)</li>

</ul>

<p>You might find some Kodak slide films today in some shops, but Kodak has discontinued slide film production for still imaging. The market was too small, though they still made profit with film. But as you know, the Kodak management decided to focus on weird new topics which never had been their core competence...</p>

<p>BTW, pro slide filme are considerably more expensive. In Europe you have to pay twice as much for a FUJI Provia 100 F as for the AGFAPHOTO CT precisa 100 (the re-branded Provia 100 F).</p>

<p>So today we face a monopoly regarding slide film. FUJI is the big player. As soon as Kodak ceased to produce slide film, FUJI raised the prices for their films.</p>

<p>And the E6 labs continue dying... In Europe are just a few labs left, that means we have to mail in our films for development. Not a big problem, but nobody knows how long these few E6 labs will survive.</p>

<p>It all boils down to one critical point: The labs. Even if you can buy slide film, without a lab they are worthless (**if** you don't want to invest into your own development).</p>

[mike dixon]

"Negative or print film had been used by the masses, because the C41 development could be handled in small local shops, for the E6 development you needed a considerably more precise and controllable process."

 

E6 doesn't require a more precise or controllable process than C41; E6 processing used to be widely available in local pro shops. Negative film was used more by "the masses" because most people preferred to have prints to show their friends and put in albums.

[James G. Dainis]

I fell for that "Use slide film; that is what the pros use" when I first became interested in photography. After my wife bewailed the fact that she had a hard time seeing them with a slide viewer and had nothing to put in albums, I bought a Vivitar slide printer using Polaroid film. Then it dawned on me - since I wanted prints why not eliminate the middle man of slides and just use print film? So, I did. Back in those days, editors and pre-press were set up for slides so that is why pros had to use it. Now editors want digital files and are set up for that. Should we tell people to use digital because that is what the pros use? I don't think so.

[jens_g.r._benthien]

<p>Just received from Fujifilm Europe the information that they will raise their prices for film by 20%.</p>

<p>A short moment later I received from my distributor the information that Kodak will raise the prices for film by 10%.</p>

<p>Time for a smart competitor to jump in and offer an alternative to fill the niche with the demand.</p>