How Art Directors or other clients react to images.

[doug_williams4]

<p>This question is for professional or art photographers that work with others that judge their work. My question is, how does your option of what is a good or best image compare to what other non-photographers think? Is there often agreement or are you surprised with what they like?</p>

[Charles_Webster]

<p>I'm often suprised by the photos my cliemts like, vs. my choices. But the client is always right so...</p>

<p><Chas></p>

[kevin_delson]

<p>I'll agree w/ Charles.</p>

<p>I've had assignments where the image I would have chosen for the final pub is not what the AD or PE chose.</p>

<p>Most shooters who take assignments have either worked for other pubs (tear sheets) or simply have outstanding work that speaks for itself. We also attempt to become intimately familiar with the style and flavor of the pub (i.e) what the readers expect (research) in order to continue selling the pub.</p>

<p>Still, with all that, any pub shooter, spec shooter or assignment shooter will tell you it is amazing at what we consider (crapola) is given priority by some PE or AD..which raises the question concerning do we really want that work "out there?" LOL There are some tear sheets I would not show to my friends, (Non-Photographers)..so ya' give 'em what they want, it pays the bills.</p>

[Spearhead]

<p>Art directors, editors, etc. are often looking for something that a photographer really doesn't know about. An article may take a different tack than the photographer would take, the photos may be done in advance of the article, the AD or editor may have a bias that makes them want to portray something in a very specific way that has nothing to do with the quality of the photograph. I have one publication in a good magazine (Modern Drummer) that I won't show because it's truly terrible.<br>

<br /> However, digital has made things a lot different. In the old days, I would send out a contact sheet. You couldn't really edit the contact sheet and so they would see things you might not particularly think were good. Now, with digital, you can edit down and rename and they don't care.</p>

[tomwatt]

<p>Way back when I was an art director and contracted my photo shoots, I would always go to the shoot with the props/product and a storyboard layout of what the shot should look like. Negotiation then occured as to whether or not my layout could be duplicated vs what adjustments we could tolerate (remember, my client was in the end the real purchaser). In a few instances, this even involved bringing 4x5 sized vellum layout drawings to place on the ground glass in order to get the composition on target.<br>

Once all that was set, the photographer took over again, shot the shots, ran the film sent the prints over for final approval. Reshoots were not free in this circumstance, since I directed the shots.<br>

So the short answer is... the art director drove the process, the photographer provided photography to specification.</p>

[Spearhead]

<blockquote>

<p>Way back when I was an art director and contracted my photo shoots...</p>

</blockquote>

<p>That works for a studio shoot. That's only type of shoot, so it's not the general case.</p>

<p>For magazine assignments, which is what I generally done, the art director tells you what they want, but there's no way to see what it will look like until it's done. Lighting is usually not under the control of the photographer or the art director. There's no way to show someone shots half-way through a live performance or a location portrait shoot across the country.</p>

<p> </p>

[rashedahmed]

<p>All Art Directors have one thing in mind - 'How to reach the target clients ?' All clients have one thing in mind - ' My choise is no less than an Art Director'.</p>

[kevin_delson]

<blockquote>

<p>the art director tells you what they want, but there's no way to see what it will look like until it's done</p>

<p> </p>

</blockquote>

<p>Quite true Jeff; and this is also the reason it is getting more difficult to get the juicy assignment shots as the AD or PE can and often does go right to stock as a viable alternative...money and time are often saved this way.</p>

<p>I still recreate many assignment shots in my studo when practical...</p>

<p>Big Joe farmer feeding the pigs as the sun quietly slips beneath the now golden horizon with the animal rights activists holding signs in the background?; well ya, that can't be done in the studio..at least not mine...not yet. :)</p>

[tomwatt]

<blockquote>

<p>Big Joe farmer feeding the pigs as the sun quietly slips beneath the now golden horizon with the animal rights activists holding signs in the background?; well ya, that can't be done in the studio..at least not mine...not yet. :)</p>

</blockquote>

<p>I bet we're not too far away from doing all of that on the computer, possibly even skipping the photographer. Remember the tv ad where the guy calls in complaining that his girlfriend thinks the video game is a movie? I don't think we're very far away from having movies that react within the plot and set to our choices and whims. Couple interactive tools like a Wii with the scenario, and you could actually take on one of the actor's roles.<br>

Sorry, that was a sidetrack thought. Yes, it's true that magazine type shoots get outside the AD's control. And is one of the areas that offers a commercial photographer some of his/her greatest latitude in "answering the mail".</p>

[iliafarniev]

<p>Those i know are but perverted buggers who seems only to think of how to impress their own clients with ridiculous hairstyling and fancy clothes they wear. As for their photo choices it is usually so primitive that i just have to pay no attention to them. Which was never a business problem because they seldom stay in position for longer then 10 months in a raw. There are so many of them that employers learned to rotate them real fast. Better keep em on a short leash.</p>

[Spearhead]

<p>Sounds a little bitter and angry....</p>

[iliafarniev]

<p>Ahaha. Tell me they don't deserve it.</p>

[tomwatt]

<p>Ilia, one of the reasons I jumped out of that section of 'the business' was almost all my colleagues were working on their second heart bypass surgery, never saw the light of day, and drank to excess. It seemed like an unhealthy life, and one I didn't care to stay with.<br>

But you do sound as if you've got a grudge going on there... go outside and play a little. Don't let life get you down!</p>

[iliafarniev]

<p>Many thanks for sympathy and consolation. There is some MU element here, I was suggesting creative photographer shouldn't hear more then he realy needs from just about anybody but develope his own powers to judge. Thing is simple actually, if you work with few ADs on more then one project simultaniously and let youself hear all they may say and stuff you never going to accomplish any.</p>

<p>Communication is important but you have to control your enviroment.</p>

<p>The practical thing i have learned is there are two kinds of "judges". 1 offers opinions on everything all the time even noboby ask, these opinions usually of no value. 2 offers opinion only being asked specifically and may or may not be of a value.</p>

<p>Another thing is you cannot achieve success in the creative field by doing that somebody says is right.</p>

[doug_williams4]

<p>Thanks for all your input. It has been interesting to see how choices differ between the photographer and the AD. Thanks, Doug</p>