An Open Letter to Hoya...

[deaner66]

<p>Dear Pentax(Hoya):<br /> <br /> <br /> When you read this forum, you will certainly find more experienced photographers than me. But I'm also very similar to most people here. That is, I'm a loyal Pentaxian. I learned how to take pictures with my K1000. Only last year did I make the switch to a DSLR.<br>

The K10D is the best camera I've ever had.</p>

<p>Sure, the Canikon world will always have a run of the numbers, both in units sold and the fastest and <br /> biggest stats. But something like 10 frames per second will never determine how good a camera is. Lucky for us, Pentax still gets most of it right. <br /> <br /> There is no better value in the DSLR world than Pentax. <br /> <br /> All that said, there is definitely room for improvement without crashing the R & D budget, particularly in these economic times. And I know the K20D improved on some things from the K10D, but judging from what I've read here, those changes were merely evolutionary. Some things still stand out, others aren't so obvious.<br /> <br /> First, I think the best possible way to keep R & D costs trim is by forgetting the full frame idea. Many will howl about this, but from my eyes, the image difference--in the real world--between FF and APS isn't that big. Every single week, in the POW thread, I see images that are as good--probably better--than anything in the Canikon world. And it is truly shocking--SHOCKING--that not one was taken with a full frame sensor.<br /> <br /> <br /> Pentax has a very nice selection of lens dedicated to the APS format. Switching back to full frame necessitates a brand new line of SDM, weather sealed lens, does it not? That would cost a lot of money to a company of Pentax's size. IMO, it isn't even necessary. Not yet anyway. <br /> <br /> <br /> I think you should concentrate on ironing out the noise issues with long exposures and higher ISO's with the sensor. Making the noise reduction system on the K20D without an OFF option is unacceptable and is a reason I haven't upgraded from the K10D. Surely money saved from going FF could be used to refine the sensor Pentax now uses with Samsung. <br /> <br /> <br /> I think you should keep the 14 MP size, too. It's plenty big enough for me. I realize hard drives are cheap now, but enough is enough. When does the numbers race ever stop? It kind of reminds me of my teenage years when we would shop stereos and recievers by their watts per channel stat. <br /> <br /> Sooner or later, they all sound the same and you get equally as deaf from any of them. <br /> <br /> <br /> I think you should put a little more concentration on the flash system, both in and out of the camera. I know I'm not the only one that is disappointed with the 1/180th flash sync speed. And I wish I was allowed to make the hot shoe fire over the sync speed. Even if I have a black strip in the shot from going over 1/180, I might be able to crop out the strip and take advantage of the extra stop over ambient. But I've never been able to fire the flash above 1/180th. Maybe I'm doing it wrong, but I don't think so. I should be able to make the decision, not the camera.<br /> <br /> <br /> I love all the new lenses you are coming out with. If there is one thing Pentax has always been known for, it's been the glass. It says volumes that many people still attach Takumars on the latest Pentax, and even in Canikon cameras. I believe this is the most important business decision you can make. Keep pushing out the weather sealed, SDM sparkling glass. And maybe iron out the teething issues before lenses get released. The DA*16-50 2.8 has, right or wrong, a horrible reputation on these forums with QC issues. If at all possible, these kind of things need to be avoided. <br /> <br /> <br /> On this forum a few days back, I saw a thread about having, basically, a manual hardline in the camera to give the user options outside the main menu. I agree with the people here. It would be nice to be able to fine tune things or download a new program or fix. Make it "buyer beware" if you want. <br /> <br /> <br /> And finally, you don't need 10 FPS, but 5 would be nice. <br /> <br /> <br /> I'm not against advancement or think there is anything wrong with pushing the tech envelope. Unfortunately, Pentax doesn't have the budget to reach as far as Canikon. It is what it is. There's no reason to cry about it. Why not make the best and smartest products that your budget will allow? <br /> <br /> So what if that budget isn't in the same league as Canikon? Big deal. You've done pretty damn good as it is now. But it could be to your advantage to hear out some of us with Pentax in our blood. Many in this forum, like Justin, Mis, Javier and so many others probably have better ideas than me. <br /> <br /> I can only speak for myself, but I'm very anxious and curious to see what the next K?D will be.<br /> <br /> <br /> Regards,<br /> Steve Dean<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /></p>

[trw]

<p>I second the motion to allow the flash to fire over 1/180th.</p>

<p>It should be easy to make this change as a firmware update for the K110D, K100D, supers, K10D, K200D, and K20D.</p>

[justin_whitton]

<p>With certain flash units you can fire at greater than 1/180th second. (Although, you do lose some flash power.)<br>

See http://pttl.mattdm.org/feature:high-speed-sync for more details.</p>

[steven_moseley1]

...I am going to keep saying this until someone listens..

 

Make the new K?D with a larger & better viewfinder, more like a film SLR...make it as near to 100% coverage as possible, but more importantly make it with 1.0 or 1.1X magnification......Olympus managed a terrific viewfinder in this manner with the E-3.......

[johnmarsden]

 

<p >Let me stir the pot</p>

<p > </p>

<p >I want a 6 meg camera (Yes 6)</p>

<p >with low noise iso 256k and slight grainy iso 500,000 – 1,000,000</p>

<p >8fps – 10 fps</p>

<p >Do that and you will blow away everything that is currently out there.</p>

<p >The iso thing is do-able at 6 meg</p>

<p >the fps is me in fairy land – but wow just imagine.</p>

<p > </p>

<p >If you cannot do that – can you bump up the 20fps 'movie mode to 3 meg or more perhaps with active focussing whilst shooting.</p>

<p > </p>

<p >BTW I think the movie mode on the Nikon is it the 700 (I dunno their numbers) is less than a megabyte per image although slightly higher frame rate. I have printed nice 6x9's from the Pentax 20fps move mode. But I couldn't see what I was taking at the time!!</p>

<p > </p>

<p >John ;-)</p>

[shots worth sharing]

<p>"larger & better viewfinder" <em><strong> yes!</strong> </em></p>

 

[trw]

<blockquote>With certain flash units you can fire at greater than 1/180th second. (Although, you do lose some flash power.)</blockquote>

<p>Given that the whole reason for wanting to flash sync faster than 1/180th is to overpower daylight or balance with it at very wide aperture, a multi-flash mode that robs flash power is of little use. Also, those models do not include monolights or pack-and-head systems, so if you want high shutter speed and enough power to use modifiers like large softboxes, or to cover a large area, you're out of luck.</p>

[miserere_mei]

<p>Thanks for the shout-out, Steve. A letter written from the heart, and which I'd be happy to sign.</p>

[andrewg_ny]

<p>I suppose a custom setting to allow violating the x-sync speed wouldn't be tragic but this really shouldn't be the default. For me this is cluttering up the menu with something I would never want to use--in this case I like that the camera is smart enough to prevent me from doing something dumb (for me) though I recognize in some rare cases some people might be willing to sacrifice part of the frame to raise the shutter speed. Perhaps it should be a real feature, where there is a 'crop' mode with a higher-rated X-sync...not sure how much sensor real-estate that would cost. How much faster do you want it--nobody has X-sync over 1/250 (well, sounds like Nikon D300 has a special lower-power 1/320 mode)? I would think you'd need at least a whole stop of shutter speed to make a real difference--will 1/250 instead of 1/180 do it for you?</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>with low noise iso 256k and slight grainy iso 500,000 – 1,000,000<br>

The iso thing is do-able at 6 meg</p>

 

</blockquote>

<p>John, why do you believe that level of high-ISO is possible simply by returning to a 6mp sensor? That is a few orders of magnitude better than any other D-SLR. Let's say that the current state of the art for high ISO is the D3 at ISO 6400. 256K is between 5 and 6 stops better than that! Maybe you meant 25,400 but even still, expecting a lot, I'm thinking.</p>

[michael_kuhne]

<p>Low noise at very high ISO, so far, always comes at a significant cost to image sharpness and detail. 6mp aps size design has larger size pixels covering the same area, and able to go into higher ISO with less noise generated, and less need for detail-robbing noise suppression. Nikon full frame 12mp models have the same advantage, with twice as many pixels covering twice as much area, with the same pixels per square mm as a 6mp aps camera. Then they still add higher noise suppression circuitry on top of that.</p>

<p>Pentax' recent designs have been for low in-camera noise suppression to preserve better detail and sharpness. The current models both have user noise suppression control. Otherwise, noise can be dealt with in post process software. I highly approve of this approach. I am surprised at the good noise performance of my K200D, along with excellent sharpness. Same goes for the K20D. They produce some of the sharpest out-of-camera results, visible in direct image comparison.</p>

<p>The wish list for some higher FPS, standard flash sync, perhaps faster AF (and accurate), is joined by myself. The Nikon adjustable D-lighting, described in the dpreview testing of the D80, and D90, is of real benefit for on-location DR control. I would like to see that adopted. Nikon also has a "brightness" adjustment. Likewise a feature very worth having for better exposure control without forfieting lens speed by using the exposure comp. With film, there is an industry-wide standard for formula sensitivity of any given ISO for film produced. But a DSLR setting of ISO 100, 200, 400, etc. obviously produces a different level of brightness exposure with a Nikon model VS Pentax or other makes, using the same shutter speed and aperture settings. But with some Nikon models, the user has control over this.</p>

<p>I have read Nikon also has developed in-camera auto-detection and elimination of hot pixels. A definite benefit worthy of having. Finally, I read of their auto-detection and elimination of CA's and color fringing! Since many pentax lenses have been coming up too high in this abnormality, such a feature would be great for us Pentax shooters.</p>

<p>Combining the best Pentax design aspects with updates of other technologies now out there could produce a truly super product design- and this is just utilizing that which has already been developed!</p>

[tom_cheshire]

<p>Dear Pentax: I, too, am a loyal Pentax user so it bothers me to say that your cameras don't stand up well to the test of time. </p>

<p>I started in the Spotmatic era and had even earlier model Pentaxes. The Spotmatics are the best of your products even though the meters fail. I believed all the hype as to why the screw mount was superior to bayonet mounts only to be astonished and left feeling betrayed when you suddenly went K mount. I fell away for a time. </p>

<p>As a former owner of over a dozen K1000s I have to say they are junk. The meters fail. They are flimsily constructed. And couldn't you have put an on/off switch in it? Next are all the push button cameras like the ME Super, et al. The buttons fail, the cameras become useless. Worst of these is the Program Plus, etc. Even my lovely LX had a shutter that gummed up as, I've heard, they all do. </p>

<p>I have to say, surprising even to me, the best Pentax K-mount I've used is the P3t. But firmly believe the KX and K2 are good, if I ever find one. Same for the MX. Can't say about the autofocus models. Never warmed up enough to autofocus. </p>

<p>As insulting as it may seem, my entire K-mount collection of Pentax lenses are used on, dare I say it, Sears cameras (made by either Ricoh or Cosina) and Chinon. Strangely, for supposedly "cheap" or "inferior" cameras they don't fail on me. </p>

<p>The days of Spotmatic are long gone and the K1000 as well. I don't even see Pentax on the shelves anymore. It is all Sony, Sanyo, Casio, Panasonic. Even Kodak and Polaroid, a co. that exists only in name, have more cameras on the shelves than Pentax. So I don't know what that means for the future of Pentax whose cameras, from what I've heard, are all being built by Samsung anyway. Loyal user? Sure, loyal to the past, to the heyday of manual film cameras, to the days of listening to that ball bearing bing-bong up and down at 1/30th when a Pentax shutter is shot. Digital? Talk to my Fuji. Talk to my Panasonic. Those microprocessors in a tin shell trying to pass themselves off as real cameras. Ha. You wish. </p>

[michael_kuhne]

<p>Tom, technology does and will advance. I also started when only manual mode and only MF were available. There were those then saying in-camera meters were amateurish and a degrading of good camera design. Of course, the more moving parts, and the more electronic contacts, the more there is to wear and fail. So, beyond a shutterless box with a hole, it is downhill from there. We just have to take into account that no auto system is perfect, and have a trained eye to monitor what is going on when using them. I have years with MF only, but have since nailed many shots using AF I would otherwise have missed. But I still use MF as well as manual exposure.</p>

<p>If you like shooting film, you should be able to find a mint-condition MZ-S. This is a very well-made camera, with many very useful features, including MLU. It is compact and lightweight, constructed from magnesium alloy. Very high quality. The FA Limited lens series has been recognized as among the finest in the world, with corresponding tests affirming their excellence. </p>

<p>The current Pentax DSLR models have been assessed by test labs to be exceptionally well-built, with top-grade weather sealing. Unheard of in their price range. And the day may come not far off, when there will be no mechanical shutter! But those fine lenses will rock on. </p>

[trw]

<blockquote>How much faster do you want it--nobody has X-sync over 1/250</blockquote>

<p>Actually... any CCD or CMOS camera that uses an electronic shutter can sync to max shutterspeed, if it trips the flash. Most dSLRs don't trip the flash over their advertized max sync, whether it would work or not. Many point and shoots can sync right up there, and the D70 can sync at any speed even though they advertise 1/250.<br>

The fact that the k20D has live view and a pixel-binning high speed mode are strong indicators that it (and probably it's predescessors) actually uses an electronic shutter.</p>

[jgredline]

<blockquote>

<p>Steven Moseley , Feb 20, 2009; 05:41 a.m....I am going to keep saying this until someone listens.. Make the new K?D with a larger & better viewfinder, more like a film SLR...make it as near to 100% coverage as possible, but more importantly make it with 1.0 or 1.1X magnification......Olympus managed a terrific viewfinder in this manner with the E-3.......</p>

</blockquote>

<blockquote>

 

<p>I agree...This is the ''ONLY'' reason I am still considering a D700.</p>

</blockquote>

[orly_andico]

<p>The 5D Mk II's ISO 25600 mode is surprisingly usable.. noisy, but usable. And on a 22MP sensor at that.. so really high ISO on a 6MP sensor should be doable.<br>

But the thing is that nobody is putting any R&D effort into new 6MP sensors anymore.<br>

One thing Pentax should work on though is their AF speed. And this news that the K-m AF's faster than the K20D, <strong>and</strong> on top of that meters more accurately in stop-down mode... feels like a slap to the face. So if Pentax could fix the metering and AF problems, why didn't they do so in their previous flagships K10D and K20D?</p>

[shaloot]

<p>I just want low light capability, ie low noise at high iso. And then nice bright viewfinder with a spilt screen for focusing those good old manual lenses!</p>

[14mm 2.8l]

<p>OH Javier!</p>

<p>Its not your only reason to consider D700. You've got a $1,900 70-200mm 2.8 VR hidding in your closet, right. Which I'll add was a $1439 lense just 45 days ago.</p>

<p>Anyways, D700 is an exceptional camera. I Love mine, and saved almost $1,000 on it and two new lenses and drive and cable release in just last 37 days. Time is ticking.......</p>

<p> Nikon raised msrp from $2999 to $3260 on D700 and UK just got hit with 2nd nikon price increase since November.</p>

<p>And didn't Mr Terminator raise your sales tax to 9.25% ????</p>

<p>Act fast as your dollars are loosing value.</p>

 

[stemked]

<p>I have a ton of old flashguns that are going unused. I wish Pentax's new digital cameras still supported them in their newer cameras. I know, ain't gonna happen.</p>

[jgredline]

<p>Lindy, I tell ya, I am really close and yes that lens is just sitting there.Today was my two month anniversary of not buying anything photo related other than film...So I do have an itch in my pocket.<br>

yep arnold the spasanator did raise our sales tax. What a Joke he is.</p>

[deaner66]

<p>Andrew: I agree, I don't think it should be a default setting, but more advanced users, I think, would appreciate being able to adjust the focus or pull the governor off the sync speed, regardless the results. It's not like it would ruin the camera. And yeah, 1/250th wouldn't be bad, but even then, the user should decide when to fire the flash. I have a friend who shoots with a Canon 40d. When she sets the shutter speed to 1/500th, the flash still fires, but half the frame is black. And BTW, my K10D takes much better pictures than her 40D.</p>

<p>Steven: I hadn't thought about the viewfinder. That was one of the great things about the K1000 and the ME Super. That would be great.</p>

<p>And to everyone who mentioned AF accuracy and speed, I agree. It's a weak spot of our cameras.</p>

<p>And finally, to Lindy Stone: I thought your pet was the 5D. It was always Canon this and Canon that. You always missed the point. If money is no object, sure, go Canikon. Then your expensive habit will look no better than a cheaper Pentax or Olympus. Now it's the D700, which is an obviously fine camera, but it isn't in the same class as a Pentax. Your talking about a $5000 combination. The same conversion for Pentax would cost less than two grand and your IQ would be on par with the Canikons. But what do I care, I thought this was a Pentax forum.</p>

<p> </p>

[14mm 2.8l]

<p>Canon, Nikon , Pentax. They all have their good points. Owning all three brands insulates me from dwelling on their downsides. When I only owned pentax I spent way too much time wishing for lenses Pentax once made or might make again. You know, like writing a open letter to Hoya wanting things that do not exist in pentax system. I like the K20D and K Mount glass I assembled over the last few years. Adding Canon Eos Digital to my bag of tools just 1 year ago was brilliant. Adding D700 6 weeks ago was equally brilliant for me and my needs concerning equiptment I could buy that exists for sale instead of dreaming and wishin about.</p>

<p>Other than maybe adding a G1 Panasonic to my multibrand kit to see what all The Buzz is about, I'm quite happy with Pentax, Canon and Nikon equiptment I own. </p>

<p>Anyways, I see no reason for Javier to pass on Nikon D700 as its still buyable at $2,449 via B&H with free delivery. D700 is really not much biggier without its grip than my K20D or my 5D. And with a 70-200mm 2.8 VR inhand its just one item for him to purchase and SEE whats up with full frame dslr viewfinder and 5 frames per second and VR built in his pro lens instead of incamera body. If he added the grip then hes got 8 frames per second capture.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/570162-REG/Nikon_25444_D700_SLR_Digital_Camera.html">http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/570162-REG/Nikon_25444_D700_SLR_Digital_Camera.html</a></p>

<p>I used to think I had to leave one brand for another. When I decided to keep pentax after I added canon made it so much easier to then add nikon too. I could easily pass on G1, but its just a curiousity I have with handling a non pentaprism dslr with a articulated viewscreen that is capable of adapting most any lens made. </p>

<p>I suppose I could wait for pentax micro 4/3 system since samsung is supposed to launch theirs in 2010. But in pentax time that could be 2 or 3 years down the road if ever. And samsung hasn't said whether micro 4/3 would even be a co-branded with pentax product. So that gets me back to adding something that exists for sale today: Panasonic G1, or wishing Pentax had something like G1.</p>

<p> </p>

[deaner66]

<p>That's great Lindy, IF you can afford it. Unfortunately, I can't. I can't just go by a new $2500 body and a lens that is close to two grand, evene if I wanted. I'm guessing, in this economy, most others here can't either.</p>

[michael_kuhne]

<p>I have often been tempted to pick up a left-over D80 kit, it it such a nicely designed camera with some very useful features. But I guess it makes more sense to stick with Pentax and see where it goes. I already have so many cameras and lenses, it is like having a library with me in it deciding which book to read!</p>

[wtlwdwgn]

<p>Great post and I concur with a few of the suggestions. A bigger brighter viewfinder, faster AF, and at least 5fps shooting (higher would be even better). Oh, and I'd like a DA* 250-500mm f/2.8 zoom.</p>