5D MkIII Is it what you wanted?

[scott_ferris]

<p>William,</p>

<p>People buy cameras for different reasons, I get mine for business reasons, if it makes sense for me from a business point of view to get a different brand I will, I have no brand loyalty.</p>

<p>Others get cameras for pleasure reasons, others still for enthusiast reasons and a few, to actually take pictures with. But what you are saying only makes sense in your angry mind. If you feel gouged then don't buy that brand, if other companies make a feature you want then get it, nobody cares. Canon, Nikon and all live and die by their sales, if enough people buy a different product then they will change, people shouting angry rubbish from a forum doesn't help anybody, I doubt your rant could even be translated to Japanese, and, if it could, it would lose all meaning.</p>

<p>Inflated prices in the UK and Europe have already been covered, the Euro is in the shit and has devalued against pretty much every other currency, blame Greece, Italy, Spain etc for that if you like, but it is the EU. The UK is so closely affiliated to the Euro it is difficult for the Pound to not be affected, blame deregulation and bankers greed for that if you like. So if something used to cost £100 to buy a Japanese item of ¥1,000, now it costs you £150, the Japanese don't make any more money, they still get their ¥1,000, you are paying for that bailout, and that is how you do it. The Japanese have done everything they can to lower costs, moving factories at vast expense to Thailand where labour is cheaper, but they still only get their ¥1,000. The Pound and Euro have both dropped against the US Dollar too. The UK importers are desperately trying to cover their butts with regards currency fluctuations, they probably make as much money on currency futures and trades as they do on camera sales, I wouldn't want their job of guessing, to the 1,000th of a penny, what the rates are going to do for the next twelve months. Thank your government for that instability.</p>

<p>Now another thing, duty, USA prices are advertised without VAT, unless you are a business in Europe you cannot avoid paying VAT, currently 17.5% (?), so all prices include that user tax price hike. In the USA different States have different user tax rates so prices are advertised before tax, go into B&H and pay for a camera and they charge you 8.25% New York sales tax, but if you buy it online and they ship out of State you are expected to pay your State sales tax locally.</p>

<p>Open your eyes and look at the world, don't fixate on the 5D MkIII being offered for x£ more than a D800, when you can't actually buy either today, see what happens at Christmas when the reviews are out, users have them in their hands and the prices have stabilized.</p>

[william_bray1]

<p>As I have said, it is not the 5Dmk3, you seem to fixating on the 5D3 it is everything new coming from Canon. UK importers haven't bumped up the D800, Nikon 24-70, olympus cameras, sony cameras, fuji cameras, Canon have put their own prices up don't say it's governments.<br /> We're in March, and you're talking about waiting until Christmas! 9 months away for Canon to bring their prices down to a level where other products prices are at today. What do you think is going to happen to the prices from Nikon by Christmas. Are you serious? I really would like to know if you are, because if so, man you are loyal to Canon.<br /> Thanks for your comment but again you still haven't explained why Canon are putting up their prices compared to others, when they're not offering anything special. Because you can't, that would mean excepting the truth, and what ever your reasons are your not prepared to do that, you'd rather live in denial. I truly don't understand that it's not in me to feel patriotic to a billion dollar company, but it makes you happy to do so.<br /> We're going to have to agree to disagree.</p>

[scott_ferris]

Because they feel it is their best way to maximize profits, they need no excuse, and I am not defending them. You are

either prepared to buy their products or you are not, and you not doing so is the only control you have over future pricing.

 

Ranting about the unfairness of it, or demanding some justification, is pathetic in an adult.

[pierrearnaud]

Hello Scott,

 

What you say about the effect of currency fluctuation on prices and the profit margin of businesses is essentially true

except for 3 details. 1. The euro has lost some value, but is still holding surprisingly well, at $1.31 today. Significantly less

than its ridiculously high record, but much, much higher than its low shortly after its introduction, when it plunged in the

$0.70 range. 2. Even though Britain is economically integrated with the rest of Europe, the Pound can actually fluctuate

independently from the Euro. The pound can move in opposite direction from the Euro, and actually has on several

instances. 3. Since 1973, currency fluctuation has been a fact of life for manufacturers. They are affected by it not ju st

when they sell their final products, but throughout their production process as generally their supply chain is international.

They use hedging techniques to protect themselves against these fluctuations, which is why often the price of a given

product will not fluctuate in full proportion with a given currency fluctuation. On the other hand, hedging techniques, which

essentially rely on the use of financial derivatives, have a cost, which of course is included in the price that we, the final

consumers, are paying for these goods.

 

Just my small off topic contribution to this debate :-)

[william_bray1]

<p>Thank you Scott<br>

"Because they feel it is their best way to maximize profits, they need no excuse"<br>

So stop with all the rubbish about high megapixel sensors not being needed, and Canon investing in other areas of their development.<br>

And it's infuriating when you have to drag the truth out of someone who claims to be an adult, because of some misplaced loyalty they have to a brand. <br>

Yes Scott you do have brand loyalty.</p>

[scott_ferris]

<blockquote>

<p>"Yes Scott you do have brand loyalty."</p>

</blockquote>

<p>And<a href="../nikon-camera-forum/00ZsDl"> what brand would that be</a> then william?</p>

[davebell]

<p>After playing with a 5D Mkiii today, I am thinking that I would definitely like one! I took shots at ISO 3200, 6400, 12800 & 25600 and judging by the zoomed view on the rear of the LCD I am very impressed. The focus system makes that of the 5D Mkii seem like it came from the Ark. Two memory card slots as well... thanks very much!</p>

[william_bray1]

Brand Ferris

[scott_ferris]

Yep, Canon and Nikon owe me nothing, but I owe them nothing in return.

 

Take care and have fun, we are the lucky ones, we are alive with enough free time to shoot the breeze on here :-)

[william_bray1]

What?

[dan_south]

I placed my order today. I'll be sure to let everyone know how horrible the thing is when it arrives. :-)

[Landrum Kelly]

<p>William, if the price is too high, the market will not support it, and it will fall. Most new products do fall pretty quickly. Looking back over the last few years, what is surprising to me is that both the D700 and the 5D II did not drop at all until fairly recently. The original 5D dropped quickly enough (and by almost a thousand dollars) to let me get one by 2006. It is sometimes hard to predict these things. Competition with the D800 might make the 5D III fall in price, but, given how different the two cameras are, the effect might not be very great. I crop a lot, and I love the medium format effect, and so I will be hoping that Canon comes out with something similar to the D800 soon, but I am not holding my breath. The Nikon has come in low and might even go up in price during its lifetime. This is particularly likely if the general world economy starts feeling more inflationary pressures--as could happen if the sluggish global recovery becomes more robust.</p>

<p>I, too, am not happy with the high prices, but I don't think that it helps to demonize anyone. Which one of us would turn down a high offer on a car or a house that we were selling? Since I don't change bodies very often, it is lens prices that are discouraging to me, especially if one wants the newer versions of the EF 24-70 f/2.8, the EF 70-200 f/2.8, and the EF 24 f/1.4. Being discouraged and feeling a bit frustrated at the personal level are natural enough, but one needs to let it go. Neither your nor my purchasing decisions will have any measurable impact. All that we can do is pick and choose among what is out there.</p>

<p>In my case, what it all means is that I will be staying with my existing cameras and lenses at least a bit longer. There are worse possible scenarios. I could become ill and have to sell them off. I sincerely hope that that does not happen. My D90 and Sony NEX-3 are my "fall back" cameras in the event of personal financial reverses. (But let me not forget the Olympus E-20, my first digital camera--and I still have it.) In the meantime, I will keep shooting my 5D II for as long as I am able, or until I can move up to the next level--of whatever brand or model is burning a hole in my pocket at the time. I'm pretty fickle. Look at Mike Palermiti, who says that he has never sold anything. He keeps it all! I can't do that, but I probably would if I could. Then again, once in a while I really would just like to clear some things out, but I hate selling on eBay, and I am not about to give them away. I guess that camera equipment has brought out a greedy side in me that I never knew that I had. At one point I had the 5D, the 1Ds II, and the 5D II. By my standards, that is more than a bit excessive--and I sold two. Right now it would be virtually impossible. (But darn, I wish that I had kept that 1Ds II!)</p>

<p>Just for a change of pace, here's a naked shot of my favorite old girlfriend:</p>

<p>http://www.photo.net/photo/10786770</p>

<p>Here's to better economic times. . . .</p>

<p>--Lannie</p>

<p> </p>

[g dan mitchell]

<p>Yakim Peled beat me to it by writing: <em>"I must confess I do not get all these moaning. The Canon and Nikon systems are similar but still different. Each has a particular strengths and "weaknesses" that stem from different strategies. The grass is <strong>not</strong> greener on the other side. It only has a different shade of green."</em><br /> <em></em><br /> <em><br /></em>Different shades is a great analogy for this. The angst over this whole business is alternately sad and amusing.</p>

<p>To answer the literal question - is the 5D3 what I wanted? - no, it isn't. I was, and am, more interested in higher MP. But that's just me. The 5D3 really looks like quite a fine camera and in many real ways a good improvement on the 5D2. It probably is not "better enough" to convince me to expend the funds it would take to upgrade, and I'm very happy with the results from my 5D2. But if I were in the market for such a camera, the 5D3 has an awful lot to offer.</p>

<p>I'm not a brand-switcher, but if I already was a Canon shooter I'd be generally pleased with the D800, which also looks like a very compelling camera.</p>

<p>Dan</p>

[mark_pierlot]

<blockquote>

<p>I'm not a brand-switcher, but if I already was a Canon shooter I'd be generally pleased with the D800, which also looks like a very compelling camera.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Don't you mean, Dan, that if you were already a <em>Nikon </em>shooter, you'd be generally please with the D800?</p>

<p>By the way, I'm not a brand-switcher, either, and I'll be holding onto my 5DII, but I, too, find the D800 to be a compelling camera.<br>

<em></em> <br>

<em></em> </p>

[dotun famakinwa]

<p>The specs are somewhat underwhelming when compared to the existing 5DMk II. The price is just plain outlandish IMHO. The 5DMK II is looking attractive at this point :) Happy shooting folks.</p>

[dogbert]

<p>I don't think there is anything wrong with expressing one's frustrations with Canon. I am an enthusiast and have a reasonable budget for gear, if I felt Canon were offering value for money.<br>

The fact is that every product Canon has announced over the last few years, that I might have otherwise been interested in, has struck me as expensive for what it is. This includes the EF 70-300L, the 24 and 28 f2.8 IS primes, the EF-S 15-84 and now the 5D MkIII.<br>

That is why the only thing I have bought in 3 years is the Tamron 70-300 VC and a second hand 5D mark I.<br>

I think if one were judging Canon versus Nikon today, Canon's main attractions relate to its legacy products (old decisions), such as the 70-200 f4L. I think Nikon has basically trumped Canon with most of its new releases both in lenses and bodies.<br>

I think the frustrations expressed here are also showing up in sales. Five or six years ago Canon was dominant in DSLR sales and was the go to brand for new entrants. Now I think that position has reversed.</p>

[Landrum Kelly]

<p>Brand switcher? Who, me? Is that sort of like an adulterer? Divorcé? Perhaps a cross-dresser? How about a turncoat or traitor? It sounds like a very, very bad thing to be.<br /><br /><br />I changed to Canon EOS in 2006 because the 5D dropped to just over $2500, and it sounded like Nikon was not going to enter the full-frame arena. When the D700 came out, I was not fazed. Not even the D3X made me even lust in my heart for a Nikon camera. When the 5D II came out, I felt vindicated for my loyalty. Here was a camera that gave very good low light results as well as a very healthy number of megapixels. It was the best practical compromise out there. We got it on two to three times a week, every week. (Okay, okay. So I fooled around a little with the D90. I needed a little bit of shutter release, but it was only physical. My heart was true to Canon.)<br /><br /><br />Now my marriage to Canon has been shaken to its foundations. It is not that Canon has done anything wrong in particular, simply that that new Nikon is what I had hoped that my next Canon would be. What's a healthy red-blooded guy to do?<br /><br /><br />Keep the 5D II and everything else Canon and buy the D800! Have one's cake and eat it, too! I want medium format in a 35mm package, by dang. The new Canon upgrade is just not sexy enough. Perhaps a little bit of Nikon on the side could save this marriage.<br /><br /><br />Yet, yet, I feel so guilty. A man who does not spend time with his family can never be a real man. I think my brain is going soft from all the games I'm playing in my mind with this young new Nikon sex kitten.<br /><br /><br />Whatever is wrong with me? I have sinned, Reverend Canon. Lord, Lord, what must I do to be saved?!<br /><br /><br />--Lannie</p>

[Landrum Kelly]

<p>Some of the previously non-downloadable samples are now (finally!) downloadable:</p>

<p>http://cweb.canon.jp/camera/eosd/5dmk3/samples/downloads/08.jpg</p>

<p>http://cweb.canon.jp/camera/eosd/5dmk3/samples/downloads/14.jpg</p>

<p>Here is the larger link to the samples which Scott posted previously:</p>

<p>http://cweb.canon.jp/camera/eosd/5dmk3/samples/</p>

<p>I'm feeling better already, in the mood, even:</p>

<p>

<p>--Lannie</p>

[william_bray1]

Thanks to the people who can see where I'm comming from, I was

starting to go mad. I'm not upset that the 5d3 should've been more

and the d800 offered more. The 5d3 offered more than the d700

except af, and this one is ahead one day, another tomorrow, will

continue forever. Unless you've got deep pockets can you have it all,

some professionals can't keep up with it , let alone enthusiasts. Take

NIKON, or Sony out of the picture altogether, It's canon's price rise and

the 5d3 is one small part of it. but its like banging your head against a

brick wall with some people. If we were talking about hovers, washing

machines, etc. This kind of discussion wouldn't exist, cameras are just

another product, another tool to get the job done, but for some

reason we seem to get emotionally attached to certain products , and

cameras are one of them.

[mauro_franic]

<p>Nice writing Lannie!</p>

[g dan mitchell]

<p>Mark quoted me when I, posting without sufficient "post processing" (otherwise known as "editing"), wrote:</p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>I'm not a brand-switcher, but if I already was a Canon shooter I'd be generally pleased with the D800, which also looks like a very compelling camera.</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>And he then asked, quite reasonably:</p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>Don't you mean, Dan, that if you were already a Nikon shooter, you'd be generally please with the D800?</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>Ah, yes. Sorry about that, and thanks for catching my error! :-)</p>

<p>To be clear, I'm a Canon shooter who is happy with his 5D2 and thinks the 5D3 looks like a fine new camera. If I were a Nikon shooter I'd be thrilled with the promise of the D800. Both Canon an Nikon continue to introduce compelling photographic tools.</p>

<p>And, Landrum, it is just a camera. :-)</p>

<p>Dan</p>

[Landrum Kelly]

<blockquote>

<p>And, Landrum, it is just a camera. :-)<br>

Dan</p>

 

</blockquote>

<p>Dan, when you have lived alone for too many decades, you get confused. I thought that cameras, like running (my obsession of the seventies), were surrogate sex. Now you guys are telling me that they are not? Bummer.</p>

<p>--Lannie</p>

[zml]

<p>FWIW: from what I have seen in terms of 5D3 ISO performance, I wouldn't have a problem using any setting up to ISO 3200 for everyday shooting. ISO 3200 is publication ready, ISO 6400 almost as good, with very few artifacts, ISO 12800 is imminently usable after some tweaking and ISO 25600 after some serious processing. DR is surprisingly good up to ISO 6400, then there are compromises (of course...) That alone, the laundry list of new features and improvements notwithstanding, makes the 5D3 a giant leap, not a mere upgrade or "what 5D2 should have been like" camera. (Most of the stuff on 5D3 was impossible to include on a camera in that price range when the 5D2 was released.)</p>

<p>Now, the above is "real world" stuff. YMMV: pixel peepers and Nikon shills please take a pill.</p>

[romuald.janik]

<p>Well for me the 5D Mk III would be exactly what I wanted - still better high ISO behavior, which for me would come in useful in a multitude of situations, better AF, and keeping the MP more or less fixed. I never shoot with a tripod - for me it is much more important to be able to shoot hand held with various lenses in available light. The 18MP of the 7D that I have is perfectly enough for me. Ultimate sharpness was never important for me...</p>

<p>But I will not get the 5D mkIII any time soon because of the price... (or in fact go FF because of the lenses that I have)</p>

<p>Btw. re Scott up in the thread - the difference in prices between Europe and USA was never due to the real exchange rates between currencies but rather beacuse of different marketing policy of camera manufacturers - As far as lenses were concerned, very often the price in EUR (like 700EUR) was numerically the same as in USD (700USD). So I only bought lenses, even back in the analog days, before any crisis, when I could visit the US...</p>

[x]

<p>I’ve been very happy with my Mk II except for the autofocussing which is too unreliable. It has performed worse than my older EOS models. The Mk III seems to offer better autofocussing so that’s a big plus. </p>

<p>Often I could use a faster winder and that’s been usefully speeded up. The high ISO is apparently improved as well although the Mk II is very good for most real world situations. Other areas like the bigger screen are just incremental.</p>

<p>I’m disappointed by the lack of an increase in Megapixels although part of me wonders whether there’s any real world benefit as it is hard enough to get the best out of the current model by avoiding camera shake and focussing accurately. The tests of the D800 should be a revelation in that respect. I don’t want the pain that goes with increased file sizes from a bigger sensor but that might be a necessary evil. Perhaps what we really need is a 5D Mk III E – 22 MP without the anti-aliasing filter.</p>

<p>The price increase is a big problem though. Hopefully it will come down quickly. That will be the biggest indicator of the the Mk III's success, noting that the Mk II was such a success that the price held higher, relatively, than its predecessors for a long time.</p>

<p>So overall is the 5D III what I wanted ? No.</p>

<p>The biggest disappointment for me is the lack of a decent 50mm lens from Canon. The f1.8 is badly made rubbish, the f1.4 is sloppy and unreliable while the f1.2 is too big and expensive. I’m hoping they will produce an IS f1.4 using the barrel recently introduced on the new 24mm and 28mm.</p>