Leica debuts S-system, 37-megapixel flagship S2 camera

[podstawek]

It is so good and comforting to read about a dream system that I will never, ever possibly own. If it was still

expensive, but within any reasonable reach, I would read these revelations with anxiety and lust, or would even start

thinking about saving or selling my current stuff.

 

Whereas with these prices I can stay assured I will never be able to afford it. It makes the reading so much more

enjoyable.

[ralph_jensen]

"Who was CEO during the development of all these new products?"

 

Andreas Kaufmann, the CEO (and longtime Leica buff) who took control of the company after Steven Lee. WSJ says

Kaufmann is worth "hundreds of millions of Euros," which will underwrite at least a little R&D, and he has been

the most prominent public "face of Leica" at photokina this week.

 

More background on Kaufmann (and Lee):

 

http://www.wsj.com/article/SB122152103387739231.html?mod=article-outset-box

 

http://www.economist.com/business/displaystory.cfm?story_id=11413199

 

There have been numerous photo-forum discussions about the leadership of Leica, here at photo.net and elsewhere.

[mohir_ali]

'Mr. Lee quickly rolled out a new line of lenses called Summarit that didn't match the quality of Leica's traditional optics but -- at a retail price of around €1,000 -- cost less than half as much. Mr. Lee also hired back production and R&D staff that had left during earlier downsizings.'

 

'By early 2008, some managers shared their grievances with Mr. Kaufmann. They accused Mr. Lee of having belittled managers, calling them dumb farmers and other names during meetings. In late February, Mr. Kaufmann fired Mr. Lee.'

 

So, Mr. Kaufmann headed the company during the development of the S2 and nine S lenses, four M lenses, and a projector only since February, 2008? Quite impressive.

[jonathan_reynolds]

Are there any sample photos yet?

[ralph_jensen]

"So, Mr. Kaufmann headed the company during the development of the S2 and nine S lenses, four M lenses, and a

projector only since February, 2008? Quite impressive."

 

I'm sure those products were under development well before Lee left last winter. If the S2 does well, both Lee

and Kaufmann will likely take credit for launching that project, but if it fails neither will!

 

Jonathan, no sample photos yet that I know of, although in his update Tuesday night 9/23 (where he describes the

handling,

viewfinder, battery, etc. of the S2) David Farkas says he saw samples on screen. (http://dfarkas.blogspot.com/ )

 

So the S2 being shown at Photokina isn't merely a "cobbled-together non-functioning mockup" as some people feared.

[peteradownunder]

A great Blog from David! thanks for the link Ralph.

[ralph_jensen]

I can't get over how similar in size the S2 is to the D700 - not the D3! - in the side-by-side photos in that

blog post. Wish the S2 wasn't so expensive...

[Landrum Kelly]

"Leica is not trying to compete against the big guys, Nikon, Canon, Sony, etc. but rather in the MF space where only Hasselblad provides any serious competition."

 

I don't think that this is entirely true. Anytime a company can come out with an industry-leading product, prospective customers at all levels are compelled to examine its other product lines--and in the case of Leica that could include traditional RF film cameras as well as whatever other products, digital or otherwise, they might release in the future.

 

This move establishes--with authority--Leica as a major player in the digital realm. (Its hold on the traditional RF set is secure.)

 

Although I will never be able to afford these "ultra-high end" cameras, I am glad that someone will--and get great results from them as well.

 

Leica's progress could also serve to keep other manufacturers honest about what is possible and desirable in a camera--and technology does trickle down in terms of affordability sooner or later.

 

We are all wealthier for these developments, even if we are not wealthy enough to afford the very best.

 

--Lannie

[frank_bunnik]

Come on, Leica is not a major player in the digital realm, not by far! The M8 is not a great camera.Sure the company has a hold on the digital rangefinder but only because Leica is the only manufacturer of this type of camera at this moment.

 

I wonder who the S2 is aimed at. Professionals who can afford an expensive digital camera work either with Nikon or Canon or it they need a bigger format, Hasselblad. I just received a mailing from Hasselblad announcing both a 60mp digital back as well as a significant reduction in the prices of the H-series. Thus making the S2 even less interesting.

[doug herr]

"<I>I wonder who the S2 is aimed at. Professionals who can afford an expensive digital camera work either with Nikon or Canon or it they need a bigger format, Hasselblad. </I>"

<P>

It's aimed at professionals who use both Nikon/Canon and medium-format digital. The S2 can be used in the studio where medium format image quality is required and on location where weather seals and 35mm-like handling are beneficial (and you get MF image quality too).

[el_fang]

<i>This move establishes--with authority--Leica as a major player in the digital realm. (Its hold on the traditional RF set is secure.)</i>

<p>I agree with Frank. Judging from Leica's track record in the "digital realm" I'm hesitant to consider the company a "major player" at anything at this point. Having a "hold" on a market segment when you're the ONLY manufacturer of a product in that segment isn't really hard, is it?</p>

 

<p><i>I wonder who the S2 is aimed at. Professionals who can afford an expensive digital camera work either with Nikon or Canon or it they need a bigger format, Hasselblad. I just received a mailing from Hasselblad announcing both a 60mp digital back as well as a significant reduction in the prices of the H-series. Thus making the S2 even less interesting.</i></p>

 

<p>I think the S2 would have a chance to actually sell if Leica were to release it now or shortly after Photokina. However, as you correctly pointed out, good as the S2 looks (or otherwise) at this point in time, things move along so quickly in the digital world that anything could happen between now and the announced release date of summer 2009.</p>

[don_e]

">>> Of course not! In order for that to happen Brad needs one.

 

For street snaps? No thanks...."

 

But it doesn't matter which camera you use. Just ask Jeff... 8-)

 

(but I'll keep the IIIf)

[Landrum Kelly]

"I just received a mailing from Hasselblad announcing both a 60mp digital back as well as a significant reduction in the prices of the H-series. Thus making the S2 even less interesting." (above)

 

"Leica says it'll perform 'twice as fast as Hasselblad H-series cameras,'" (from the link)

 

Speed and convenience seem to be major selling points here for a camera that will have the resolution of some MF cameras--but which are comparatively slow and unwieldy.

 

C'mon, guys. I shoot the Canon 5D and the 1Ds Mark II--hardly pieces of junk. Even if I had the 5D Mark II and the 1Ds Mark III, I would not be able to do with them what I could do with this camera. This is a major development, even though this will admittedly be one product among many in an increasingly competitive environment.

 

The real point is that Leica is acting boldly and decisively to introduce new products in the digital realm. That bodes well, I think, for a company that has been accused of being too staid and complacent. It is also encouraging to all of us who have this dream of shooting with greater and greater resolution with more speed and less trouble. Competition is always good for the marketplace. I could benefit from this even if I never buy another Leica lens--and I only have one. I am hardly known as a cheerleader for Leica, but this development is exciting and encouraging on a number of fronts.

 

In this case, I am happy to give a cheer for Leica.

 

--Lannie

[kostak]

Since the pixel density (as stated in a post above) is about the same as a 24 MP FF sensor, I wonder at what aperture diffraction becomes an issue. I haven't wrapped my head around the science behind this, but I will share this link:

 

http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/diffraction-photography.htm

[Robin Smith]

I find it fascinating all this fuss suddenly about diffraction as though it is a new issue. It exists with film just the same

and is no more or less important, the only thing is that it will become more easily detectable as the resolution of

sensors improve - using a 35mm or a MF film camera the effects of diffraction can be relatively easily seen.

What is old is suddenly new again. Perhaps it is connected with the fact that people are stopping down more

because of the low light capabilities of digital cameras, so are habitually shooting at high ISOs?

[icuneko]

"yikes...what is this gonna cost... " Not to worry. The US Treasury is going to bail out Leica too so you can apply to them for a loan to buy it. No sweat; they'll bankroll anything these days. Even if you can't pay back the loan, you can still get the camera.

[beau 1664876222]

Who'da thunk? Suddenly Leica has new and interesting products coming out the yin-yang. Reminds me a little of Apple right after Jobs returned. Time will tell if the images look good enough to justify the price tag, though.

 

Rough day for Brad and Fang ;)

[trex1]

Right. I love the way they bail out the worst scum of humanity, that made their money on the backs of the poor, but all

those who got foreclosed, oh no, they don't need to be bailed out do they? Man, if Americans ever woke up....there would

be a revolution in that country.

[el_fang]

<i>Suddenly Leica has new and interesting products coming out the yin-yang. Reminds me a little of Apple right

after Jobs returned.</i>

<p>Puh-leeze. One only has to compare the two companies' financial reports to see that Leica can in no way, shape

or form be compared to Apple. Apple is a small company that has its much larger competitors playing catch-up to

its innovative products that are appreciated and purchased by a vast number of consumers. Leica is a small

company that since the digital revolution has been trying to catch up to its much larger competitors due to its

stubborn refusal to recognize where the market was going (digital), and today very few consumers have even heard

of the name Leica. Say the word "M8" to some random Joe on the street and he'll answer "Er... BMW?" On the other

hand, say "iPod" and he'll instantly know what you're talking about.</p>

<p>Yes, Leica and Apple are both small companies. That's about where the similarity ends. Look at the M8.2's

baseplate. Steve Jobs would never approve the inclusion of a 5-1/4" floppy drive in his new MacBook Air just

because it's "cute" and a "throwback" to the glory days of the Apple II. One company looks forward, the other

looks backward. I can't think of two more diametrically opposed corporate philosophies.</p>

 

<p>I like how the Leica fanboys are in joyous uproar over the announcement of a <b>prototype</b> that's not even

scheduled for release until a year from now, and that's barring any unforeseen problems. A bit premature, dontcha

think? Let's see if Hasselblad and others actually stay stationary for the next year. I'm no crystal ball reader

but something tells me they won't. Kaufmann would probably cream his pants if Steve Jobs were ever to express

interest in Leica's CEO seat. Doubt it's gonna happen, though.</p>

[doug herr]

Fang clearly hasn't had enough self-humiliation.

[kens]

If you would ever stop categorizing people as fanboys they might actually take an interest in what you have to say. Doubt that's gonna happen either. So the appearance of trolling is perpetuated.

[el_fang]

Truth hurts, doesn't it? :)

[el_fang]

I'm expressing my opinions just like everyone else on this forum. Don't like 'em? Fine, don't read 'em. Not everyone likes my style, and variety is the spice of life. No need to take things personally.

[joshroot]

The comparison to Apple circa 1997 isn't that far off. The company was a mess and had used time and money on a

lot of failed projects/products. Jobs was reinstalled as CEO and the iMac was released in '98 followed by the

ipod in 2001.

 

Sure, there are lots of differences. But it's also not a bad comparison to make. A lot of the world thought that

the industry had passed Apple by and that the future of computing was all in Redmond, Wa. But game-changing

products, a good marketing campaign, and good design turned everything around.

 

Will this be the start of such a turnaround for Leica? Is the S2 a game-changing product? I'm not particularly optimistic. But then again, I don't

remember thinking that the iMac was super amazing when it came out either. So who knows. I think only time will tell.

[el_fang]

Fair enough Josh.