P6000 with raw support and integrated GPS

[walterh]

"If it is merely a software issue, I am sure Nikon can fix it easily with a future version of Capture NX2 ..."

 

Perhaps in a few month we need to pay for an upgrade for NX2->NX3 that might come in cheap at 99US$ to be amazed

by the benefits of the new Nikon RAW format ^^.

 

Or perhaps NX3 with WIC support and conversion into a MAC NEF format will be a "completely new" product like it

happened to me with Nikon camera control (just to set the shutter speed and trigger the camera going from D200 to

D3) and there is no "cheap" upgrade^^.

[albinonflickr]

Still, I am interested in this camera.

 

If image quality (please enlighten me, what is this "IQ" that I read in every 3 photo.net postings?? Is it "image quality" ? "Intrinsic?" "Internal"..) is excellent up to ISO400 at least, my interest is raised even more. 'Manual focus' is promised, hopefully through a direct ring around the lens! And the GPS feature is absolutely nice to have, for recording natural history data, for example.

 

...Should I continue saving & salivating for the D700 first?

[Richard Williams]

'A new restriction in RAW format conversion is just what we need - especially in view of the history of

"excellent" software rom Nikon. Nikon must be out of their mind.'

 

It's quite possible that NRW will have no more restrictions than NEF does, and I think the WIC support discussed

on the Adobe forum may be a red herring. NEF files are also supported by WIC if you install Nikon's codec, but

this doesn't mean that NEFs can only be read via WIC. If NRW has a standard Bayer pattern and a conventional

(unencrypted, not deliberately obfuscated) file structure, then I imagine it will be supported quite quickly by

3rd parties in exactly the same way they support other file formats (i.e., straightforward reverse engineering -

no mainstream raw converters use Nikon's own full NEF SDK , and as Thomas Knoll suggests WIC isn't suitable for

ACR-style raw converters even under Windows).

[walterh]

Richard reversed engineering is limited by legal restrictions. The short lived Nikon encryption of the white balance data in NEF files was not a tough job for reverse engineering but may have required some illegal actions and Adobe was careful not to go along this road.

[mark liddell]

Sounds like fail: "But, though it has raw capability, the P6000 doesn't shoot Nikon's NEF format, instead producing .NRW files using Windows Imaging Component under Vista"

 

Given that many of the people wanting raw capability are serious photogs are likley to be using a mac I do not understand this at all.

[ilkka_nissila]

I suppose the idea here is that every Windows application will be able to read the NRW files without going through a raw converter outside of the operating system. It's a convenience feature (for the expected user base). I wonder what software will eventually emerge that will be able to edit the NRW files. Perhaps there will be an option to do it using Microsoft software.

 

Macs ... yes, but a Mac user is likely to be a serious photographer, not a point and shoot user. ;-)

[Richard Williams]

'Richard reversed engineering is limited by legal restrictions.'

 

Yes, potentially it is, but only if it involves breaking encryption, etc. (as in your example). Adobe reportedly

only uses a small piece of Nikon code (the so-called 'mini SDK') to decrypt white balance (and as you suggest,

purely for legal reasons). Everything else (and support for nearly every other raw format) is done by reverse

engineering, since hardly anyone publishes their formats. Incidentally, I don't think Nikon ever stopped

encrypting a portion of the metadata - a quick look at the ExifTool Nikon.pm code suggests it's still necessary

to invoke the decryption function to read MakerNote data from even the D300 etc. But Nikon has chosen not to

change the infamous 'xlat' encryption/decryption key in the later models even though they must know it's been

compromised. Let's hope that means they've learned their lesson and won't start playing games again with the NRW

format...

[phule]

[[thinking to replace my Canon A620, which shoots a 7.1mp file and no RAW format. ]]

 

Off-topic here, but you can indeed shoot RAW files with your A620. It just takes a 3rd party tool that sits on your memory card.

 

http://chdk.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page

[michaelkh]

They asked the wrong question on that Adobe forum, as far as I can tell.

 

Of course Adobe aren't going to support WIC (they would be nuts to re-engineer their app to support a competitor's technology).

 

The question they should have asked was whether the P6000's raw format is to be supported, not WIC.

[bruce_margolis]

IMO, Nikon had an opportunity to finally offer a P&S that could appeal to DSLR users who shoot RAW. Yes, I often

take a P&S with the rest of my gear. Comes in handy sometimes for the 'better to get something than nothing'

shot. I guess Nikon doesn't see me as part of their target market.

 

JPEG shooters won't use the RAW, NEF users will be frustrated with it. So just who is the market for this camera?

Since most P&S users only shoot JPEG anyway, why not leave out RAW altogether as Nikon has done in the

past? By adding this limited RAW conversion, who do they hope to attract?

[ilkka_nissila]

I think the idea behind NRW is that every application will see the exact same image. As opposed to NEF, where

changes made in Nikon Capture NX cannot be correctly read by other programs like Lightroom, and vice versa. So

the image looks different in every program you can open it with. Nikon doesn't like this, hence they try to

monopolize the raw conversion algorithm and incorporate it into Windows as a WIC codec. This way, all

applications will be able to read the image but how much control over the raw conversion there will be in the

applications, I have no idea. Perhaps there will be a little control, similar to what is provided in the camera

post-processing options, or the upcoming version of ViewNX which supports NRW. In any case it's a closed format.

They don't want other applications to directly access the data and do the bayer interpolation with non-Nikon

algorithms. That doesn't mean there won't be any benefits over JPG.

[photo5]

Even Mac OSX 10.5 can read NEF in the finder and display them with quick look. I doubt NRW format will act this way. Sad. I am looking for a small point and shoot like this to supplement my photography. If quality is good enough it could become a good walkaround anywhere camera for places where I'd not feel comfortable wielding my D300 around. And quieter too. This is one area Canon has a major advantage over Nikon, that they make their RAW format open and compatible whereas Nikon does not.

[mrtim]

I asked the Bibble developers in their forum what they thought about the new RAW format. They don't seem to

think supporting it will be a big deal, although they aren't at all interested in WIC:

 

http://support.bibblelabs.com/webboard/viewtopic.php?t=11072

 

For my RAW workflow as long as Bibble works I'm there. So as far as this camera is concerned, I'm more concerned

about the noise levels with that sensor density. I guess we'll see.

[perryarbor_perryarbor]

<p>I wonder What’s the difference between intergraded and independent third part device?</p>

[reversu_dee]

<p>As far as I know, Sony, Nikon P6000 have intergraded device. While Nikon cancelled this function since P7000 because it needs much power and its instability. On the other hand, independent device with its high stability and multiple choice ( Aoka, Easytagger, foolgraphy etc. ) that is pursuing by most photography funs. </p>