Fuji Voigtlander 667 video (in Japanese)

[db1]

I wish I knew what this guy was saying.

 

No matter, the camera looks amazing.

 

http://davidbram.blogspot.com/2008/10/fuji-voigtlander-video.html

[aplumpton]

Looks fine, if a little plasticky. On the other hand, the Fuji GW and GSW IIIs stand up pretty well (except, perhaps, the

plastic baseplate). Wonder if the Fujinon lens (on Japanese Fuji models) is the same as the Heliar on the Voigtlander ex-

Japan models? Rangefinder base doesn't appear to be huge. The ability to close the front is great.

[starvy]

actually, if i can afford one new i shall definitely be getting one. it would be my first 'proper' medium format!

[leicaglow]

It doesn't look too plasticky to me. It's a lot bigger looking than I imagined, but then I'm a 35mm Zeiss Contessa, and Voigtlander Vitessa user. It sounded pretty solid when he closed the lens. Another interesting thing: the viewfinder looks like a 6x9 ratio, but the film is 6x7. I wonder if a 6x9 is in the cards.

[a._t._burke]

Thanks for the post. There is also another video on it at:

 

 

In your posted video it looked like the front cell of the lens stayed put and the rear cell/cells moved for focus. Many of the old folders used to use movement of the front cell to focus. This was supposed to produce lesser resolution results than moving the whole lens. These lenses would produce better focus at either infinity or closest focus, but neither would be as good as resolution by moving the whole lens. I wonder if best resolution is obtained at closest focus or infinity on the new 667?

[a._t._burke]

Michael Axel... Yes, I noticed the same thing. In the second video the man in the jacket was pushing something just to the take-up side of the film plane. I wondered if this was the image size switch. Specs from Photokina showed it to be changeable from 6x7 to 6x6. I wonder if maybe there is a "Japan only" version that is also 6x9 or 6x9 only. The GW690III and GW670III were imported. There was also a GW680III (not to be confused with the GX680) which was Japan only and shows up on sleezebay every so often.

[aplumpton]

Interesting point about the lens focussing. This may or may not be the deal maker-breaker for some of us. But who

(journals, independent reviewers?) will take the time to critically review lens performance on a model of presumably limited distribution?

 

While very acceptable and desirable to MF film users, it doesn't look to be much of an evolution vis-a-vis the excellent and much regretted

DOI Makina 670, which was not a very big folding camera with light metering. I will probably be proven completely wrong, but I would be

really surprised if a 6x9 version of it is offered, here or in Japan. The lens circle coverage extends no doubt beyond 6x7, but 6x9 is a big

leap. Of course, the GW 690 III also existed in smaller format versions (GW 680 III and GW 670 III), but it can be argued that the common

90mm lens was made initially for 6x9 coverage, and the GW 690 III camera was a sister to the wider angled GSW 690 III, also intended for

the 6x9 format.

[vijay_nebhrajani]

There are some high resolution images <a

href=http://www.voigtlaender.de/cms/voigtlaender/voigtlaender_cms.nsf/id/pa_fdih7jzkae.html>here </a>. Click on

the images to download high resolution versions.

<p>

These clearly show the 6x6/6x7 switch in the back.

<p>

The first video clearly shows the front element(s) or perhaps the entire lens moving forward and back as the

focusing ring is turned. I couldn't see any evidence of rear focusing. Where did you see that?

<p>

Based on the high res pictures that I linked above, I actually have some observations and concerns - firstly,

look at the frontal view - looks like a rather bizarre shutter, with two leaves. Secondly, looking into the open

back, you'll see some foam-like pieces on the corners of the lens mounting board. These look rather crude, and I

hope that they will fix them when the production model comes out. Thirdly, look at the open back, I don't see a

spool release lever. Could the little orange/red buttons be it? Maybe, but they look rather small to be spool

releases. And the viewfinder base does look a little short.

<p>

Now look at the top view. Do you see wires running from the body to the lens? I don't either. But there must be

wires, or flex-pcbs or some form of electrical connection from the lens to the body, since the shutter speed dial

and aperture-priority mode control is on the body. The battery is also on the body (baseplate has a coin-turn

type chamber, it appears). So we are going to have electrical connections from lens to body on a folding camera.

I am somewhat apprehensive that the connections won't be as reliable as they need to be.

<p>

Finally look at the closed top view. The bulge of the lens cover is a lot, don't you think? They could have made

the camera thinner in my opinion. That would fit coat pockets better. Oh well.

<p>

Initial concerns aside, I am looking forward to this camera - it is as close to my dream camera as anything I can

find -

modern multi-coated glass on a vintage folding type camera.

[david_littleboy__tokyo__ja]

It sure looks nice, but the second video indicates that it will probably set you back around US$3,000. Ouch. I was hoping for under US$2,000. Sigh. And it might be out by the end of the year. Maybe.

 

"The bulge of the lens cover is a lot"

 

I suspect they didn't want to compromise the lens. It's an 80mm lens covering 6x7, and most of the Planar derived normal lenses are 6 or 7 elements (this lens is 6 elements in 4 groups) and it moves the whole lens (not just the front element) for focusing, so it should cough up serious image quality.

[vijay_nebhrajani]

Ouch indeed. $3000 is quite some dough in this recessionary environment.

[a._t._burke]

Vijay Nebhrajani... You are right. I saw a clearer video and it appears as if the whole lens moves forward from the front of the bellows. I like it better that way!

 

If our dollar goes down anymore it might be more than 3000 (devalued) dollars.

[a._t._burke]

I looked at the large still photos. Although there is room in the back for a 6x9 cutout, I cannot see room in the front opening to expand the bellows to fit the 9 dimension of the 6x9. If the rear bellows opening is already 6x9 and I just don't see it maybe there is a 6x9 in the future. Otherwise it would be tough.

[db1]

$3000 is a deal killer for me.

[ilkka]

"So we are going to have electrical connections from lens to body on a folding camera."

 

Fuji GA cameras have a flexible PCB that connects the moving lens to the body and it seems to work pretty well. To me, the attractiveness in Fuji medium format folders has always been the good quality lens, fairly solid construction, and reasonable price. $3000 is not appealing at all. I just spent that much on a SonyA900 so that I don't need to shoot as much medium format film anymore.

[vijay_nebhrajani]

You're right. Ilkka, I had forgotten about the GA series. Now I am only much more confident that Fuji/Cosina will get the flex PCB right. I have been burned by this issue with Rollei in the past, hence the concern.

 

Thanks.

[aplumpton]

At $3000 (if true), I believe you might be better off with a near mint used Makina 67 or 670 (almost pocketable when folded), or a Mamiya

7-II with 65 or 80 mm lens. The latter is bulkier, but allows lens interchangeability.

 

The excellent and recently discontinued (post 2000) non-metered Fuji GW 670s and 690s are selling in near mint condition for

well under $1000! They may be a bit bulky, but they are well built and have an excellent lens.

 

If they charge $3000 (or even a bit over $2000), I think they will be only shooting themselves in the foot!

[gt1]

"$3000 is a deal killer for me."

 

Way too much money. Initially I saw reports at around $1400. I would buy one at under $1500 but not a chance at $3000. I have a Mamiya 7ii with 80mm and paying $1500 more just to get a folding camera is absurd.

[hclim]

$800. Give me or leave it.

[Dave Luttmann]

$3000....I'll pass. I'll just grab a Mamiya 7ii instead. I honestly feel it will be a lot less though.

[aplumpton]

A mint used GW690III with a new VC-2 meter sitting on top will set you back only a third of that. What are Fuji-Cosina thinking?

[david_littleboy__tokyo__ja]

"Initially I saw reports at around $1400."

 

That was me thinking wishfully. Sorry.

 

"What are Fuji-Cosina thinking?"

 

I'd guess that they are thinking that (a) they couldn't turn a profit no matter how many they sold at US$1500, and (b) most of the people who would shell out US$2100 would also shell out US$3000. Sigh.

 

I was thinking that getting the 43/4.5 for my Mamiya 7 plus the Fuji would make a kit that covered more sins than my current Mamiya 7 + 65/4.0, would have the same weight and bulk as Mamiya 7 +2 lenses, and wouldn't have the incovenience of changing lenses. But in real life, the Mamiya 7's 80mm lens is a seriously superb lens, and a lot cheaper than the Fuji. Sigh.

[hclim]

I remember when Fuji first announced it they said it is going to be affordable. Maybe in Japan they can afford to pay expensively.

[richard_]

At first they were talking in the $1200-1500 range - which would sound fair to me. Over $1500, I'll pass...

[david_littleboy__tokyo__ja]

"I wonder if a 6x9 is in the cards."

 

Unlikely. An article I read claimed that this is the first new folding camera in over 25 years, and the previous folding camera (the Fuji 645 folder) was also the first new folding camera in over 25 years. (Although I think that ignores the Plaubel cameras since those are collapsing, not folding, or argues that they are all derivative of the original 1920 design.)

 

Also, by the way, I accidentially took a photo with my Mamiya 7 + 65/4.0 of a building in the distance with a high-contrast test-chart like pattern that the 5D + 35mm lens completely fails to resolve. (Since this was shot from a pedestrian overpass it's completely repeatable.)

 

http://www.pbase.com/davidjl/image/102380922/original

 

Although I haven't put up the image yet, the 5D + 50/1.4 at f/8 does manage to capture the pattern (although Moire is a problem with it). What this says is that 6x7 (Provia 100F or TMX 100) + Nikon 9000 really is a lot better than 12MP digital, and probably closer to 24MP digital. While the top end of the dSLRs are in the over 20MP range nowadays, finding lenses that are as good over 24x36mm as the Mamiya 7 lenses are over 56x70mm is going to be hard.

 

The point being that 6x7 with a Nikon 9000 is still a viable option for prints in the 16x20 and up range.

 

Sorry for the off-topic randomness.

[gt1]

Sorry to encourage the randomness but how is the V700 at 6400ppi? I have a V700 and I've seen better comparisons to the Nikon.