SNAKES!

[erik_loza]

Thanks for sharing those nice photos, Derek. I've been in Austin since 2004, but otherwise spent all my life herping in California. I'm jealous; anthicus is not yet on my list. West Texas also has beautiful coachwhips; almost a flourescent pink color. So far, my most exciting lifers have been Drymobius in the Lower Rio Grande, Micrurus here in Austin, and Drymarchon (the true King of Texas Snakes, IMO). This is a photo of the first one of those I ever caught, back in May of 2004 at Santa Ana NWR. The image is poor because the lady I sequestered to take the photo's hands were shaking so badly.<div></div>

[derek_thornton]

"Thanks for sharing those nice photos",

 

Thanks for the compliment but I think the shots I have used here are all bad. The last shot I took handheld with a 70-200mm in low light. The Brown Water was not that bad. I am just a little leary about posting pics here. Dont know why, that is what this site is for.

 

Anyway, I have yet to see a Speckled Racer or Indigo in the wild. The Indigo you are holding must be a baby, a big baby! If you live in Austin area you should take a trip out to west Tx. in late May. Anywhere from Big Bend to Del Rio. I found 4 lifers in one evening there.

 

Also, I meant to thank you a while back when you recomended the 105mm micro in a post I had. I love that lens but I am going to get the 60mm too as soon as I can.

[erik_loza]

Hahahahaaa... I just got back from Del Rio with friends last month. Was still cool and rainy, but we did see a suboc plus five-thousand atrox.

[michael_bizon]

Mark,

 

thanks for all your help. I can only offer my personal experiences, so by no means am I

authority on much, I'm glad you took the time too help me out, and I'm sorry if you haven't

seen a rattlesnake coil up in a bush, then uncoil and start heading the same direction you

went after a few minutes later, might be a rare thing , but it's happened more than once,

out where my cabin is.

[michael_bizon]

My bad!, I'm surprised no one mentioned I was spelling Mojave, wrong!, I get mixed up

because all the old maps pre-1910 and books tend to call it Mohave, why the change? I

don't know but when you read too much of about old mines, trails, and towns, from the

original sources, you sometimes tend to stick with their spelling.

[mark_chappell]

<I> I'm sorry if you haven't seen a rattlesnake coil up in a bush, then uncoil and start

heading the same direction you went after a few minutes later,</i><P>

 

Wouldn't be surprised if that happened, particularly if both of you were heading for shade.

But the idea that they<I> "... uncoil and</i> <B>start looking for the intruder</b>..." is

what raised

my eybrows, and I think Erik's as well. Rattlesnakes are emphatically not interested in

interacting with people and -- given half a chance -- will avoid any encounter.

[michael_bizon]

that's what I thought, the 10 years I have been living in the desert, then I noticed this

Mojave green, It was coming up canyon in the sand (300' wide canyon) and I was heading

down, well once it sensed me it shot off to the nearest Greasewood. and started rattling

away, well I watched it for a moment then continued down canyon 50 yards, wasn't even a

couple of minutes heres comes that Mojave, going slow and trying to sense (something,

me! I don't know) well I stood up a little and it takes off to the next greasewood and starts

to rattle away, well I decided to head back up canyon and take a ridge, so I look back and

here's this Mojave heading back up canyon again.. This isn't the only time, I've witnessed

it with these guys, I've seen Western's duck into a bush and stay put for well over 30 min.

I brought this up to a couple of old timers that have lived in the area their whole life

(they're 75 now) and it was story after story about these Mojove's and how they were

extremely aggressive, verses all the other rattlesnakes,. Maybe it's a local thing?? anyone

have an experience like this.??

[mark_chappell]

What makes you think it was chasing you or being aggressive? After all, when it noticed you

it went under a bush and rattled -- it didn't start to slither after you and attempt to bite.

Rattling is a totally defensive behavior -- they only do it to try and prevent a close encounter

that could be mutually dangerous.

[michael_bizon]

Just a little story Mark, I didn't pull out a handgun and blow it away? because I thought it

was being aggressive!, or do I think It was chasing me, but 20-30 encounters I've had out

here in the desert (where I live) with rattlesnakes, I found it a bit too odd!

[erik_loza]

Coincidence on part of the snake + assumption on past of the human being: "It was chasing me". Funny that I actively pursue snakes and have seen and caught more than 1,000 (including lots of Crotalus), and never been chased by any. Maybe you smelled like a female rattlesnake in season, though? Or a kangaroo rat?

[greg s]

"I figured I would go ahead and catch him." << please stop doing that and leave the wildlife alone, as they have every right to be.

 

If people in a nature forum were discussing netting and caging birds or mammals, that wouldn't go over very well. When it comes to reptiles and amphibiums, some seem to think the ethics are altered. Not so.

 

I saw one of those PBS Art Wolfe episodes where they were catching snakes in the tropics for photography, and was disappointed to see that message being distributed on the TV. Steve Irwin was a nice guy, but the snake catchin' thing was generally a bad idea. Unless a venomous reptiles needs to be relocated by an expert, please leave them alone. -Greg-

[erik_loza]

Whose ethics are those? I have caught and photographed a lot of snakes, but must have somehow missed that memo. 99% of snake images the world sees would not happen if the snake wasn't caught. If that seems distasteful or phoney, then we all have a right to our own opinion about how a photo was gotten. Don't know what to tell you, because it's standard practice.

 

In fact, "relocation" of rattlesnakes almost always means sure death for the animal, while a snake which is captured, photographed, and released can go on with it's business without harm. I know of what I speak....

[michael_bizon]

Mark and Erik,

 

Good luck to both of you on your snake catching expeditions, It would be a real bummer

if one was to turn on you and give you a little present.

[derek_thornton]

Greg,

 

I never expected that! I have never hurt an animal in my life. I do not catch them and hold them captive. When I catch a snake it is photograhed and set free. Maybe you should turn your attention to the pet trade or herpetaculturist. Those people collect animals from the wild to sell. They breed bad blood, like albinos, sell them to children who several months later release them to the wild. Maybe you have confused me for one of those types.

[mark_chappell]

Personally, I rarely catch snakes, although I'll occasionally shoo one off a road to keep it from

being squashed.... VERY carefully if it's venomous.

[erik_loza]

...Good luck to both of you on your snake catching expeditions, It would be a real bummer if one was to turn on you and give you a little present..."

 

Who said one already hasn't?

[james_wingo]

I grew up in the Mississippi delta. I think that cottonmouths might be the most common snake there. I have seen them in lakes quite a few times. Once while paddling across Lake Boliver, We had one attempt to climb into the boat with us quite a ways from shore. I think that it might have been tired of swimming and maybe thought that the boat was a log that it could rest on. Once in 1976, when I worked as the Park Naturalist at Leroy Percy State Park, I saw one out in the lake which had caught a sunfish that was too large for it to swallow and it seemed to be unable to turn the fish loose. It finally went under and I never saw it come back up. I believe that it drowned. The attached photo was taken in a large drainage ditch behind my father's house.<div></div>

[derek_thornton]

James,

I never said you could NOT find a cottonmouth in a lake. I said they are much less common in lakes and large rivers. You can find a cottonmouth anywhere, even far from water in pine forest. Also in SC we have the E. cottonmouth, In Ms. and Tx. you have the W. cottonmouth. The two snakes are very similer but habitats are differant to the east and west of the Mississippi River. However, I lived in Tx. and still found the cottonmouth to be much more common in the swamps than in big water. But, I also found the western race to be much more common in ponds than the eastern. I caught many cottonmouths at the edges of farm ponds in E. Texas, rarly do I see a cottonmouth at ponds in SC.

 

This is my count so far this year:

 

Pine flatwoods 3, cypress swamps bordering rivers and creeks 49, Pine bogs/barrens 34, carolina bays 36, sloughs/ditches/canals 16.

 

This year I did not see any cottonmouths in Lake Marion or Lake Moultrie or even the swampy areas bordering the lakes. I saw no cottonmouths in the man made ponds withen the Francis Marion NF. I spent a lot of time on my kayak in the Santee, Cooper, Wambaw, Edisto, Wadbo and the Echaw Rivers and found 0 cottonmouths. However, I found 49 snakes in the floodplains and cypress swamps bordering these rivers.

 

The only differance I have seen between the eastern and western races, is that in the west cottonmouths are much more common in manmade ponds. Mississippi, Alabama and Kentucky are the only states in the range of the cottonmouth that I have yet to see any.

 

In SC all the aquatic snakes seem to prefer a differant habitat. You can find any watersnake or cottonmouth in any aquatic habitat but they do have preferances. The Brown Watersnake loves large rivers, lakes and oxbows, the green watersnake has quite the same taste but is not at all common in SC. The Banded Watersnake likes creeks, ponds and cypress swamps. The Redbelly Watersnake loves small waterholes like sloughs and bays that are going dry. The Redbellies are very nomadic traveling from waterhole to waterhole in search of frogs. When all the holes dry up they move on to the cypress swamps and creeks. The Same was true in Tx. Diamondbacks love big water, yellowbellies love the waterholes and tiny ponds moving from source to source. Broadbandeds love the creeks, swamps etc.

 

I would never say you CAN'T find a certain snake in a certain habitat. But I will say that the cottonmouth is much more common in the cypress swamp than in big water.

[derek_thornton]

James, I also wanted to comment your photo. That is a perfect example of how a cottonmouth floats on the water, as I said earlier. Watersnakes do not do that. When a watersnake is in the water and not moving, all you see is there head above water. Also, on your photo you can see how prominant the backbone is. Watersnakes are round like a hose, cottonmouth are triangular, due to the backbone.

[stemked]

I actually stepped on one (Western Cottonmouth) and yes it was a Cottenmouth.

 

I was walking around a small ditch near Houston watching a turtle and not where I was going. My large boots came down mid-way on the Cottenmouth. The only reason I suspect that it couldn't bite me at that moment was that it had just swallowed a toad, which it spit out. Scared me to death!

 

Last week I was with a ranger in a wildlife refuge near Denver. We were talking and he suddenly cursed saying that he had just driven over a Bullsnake. I jumped out of the truck only find the snake hadn't been hit and he was dead-wrong, I was mear inches away from a completely aroused Western Rattlesnake. He/she moved off quickly so I missed a great opportunity to photograph the animal as I wasn't willing to chase him into the nearby shrubby grasses.

[sandysocks]

Everything about the second photo looks perfect. The first photo still looks weird. Cameras can do that. Anyway, I miss the snakes. All we have here are western garter snakes.

[gerhard_hofmann1]

James,

 

Leroy Percy http://www.hofmann-photography.de/html/leroy_percy_state_park_mississ_5.html

 

definitely is the place we saw cottonmouths most often. We are conducting a study on over-wintering Rusty Blackbirds there and have to follow birds which have transmitters attached to them. And as soon as spring is arriving it seems we find cottonmouths all over. Btw Leroy Percy is my all time favourite place to take pictures particularly on Sundays if it was a bad day one can at least go for the buffet and make the day a successful one.

 

Can't wait to come back to the Delta

 

Gerhard

[tim_raymond]

This is a photo essay on a snake eating another snake: http://www.startri.com/snakecrime.htm<div></div>

[caleb_hickman]

<p>Tim- I am wondering if you are still on this. I would like to have the story behind the cannibalism. I too wrote something on this and see something interesting in your photo I would like to get feedback on.. Please e-mail me calebh "at" hot mail<br>

Thanks.<br>

Caleb</p>