HP5 Agitation Issues

[neil_rankin1]

Has anyone experienced agitation issues with HP5. More than any other film HP5 gives me more problems

in regards to uneveness at the edges. I've shot almost entirely with Tri-x because I've not had the issues

with Tri-x. Those of you with HP5 experience with metal tanks and reels, what is your technique with

development? How much chem do you put in the tank? Do you dunk the reel in an already filled tank, or

pour in the top. What is your agitation technique? Please be specific. Does anyone use the cocktail shaker

technique? Or is inversion the preferred method? Do you prewash? Thanks to all.

[frank.schifano]

I don't know. Most of the time I use either D-76 or XTOL diluted 1+1 and the same agitation technique with both films and the results are what you'd expect them to be. that's to say good to excellent. Agitation is five seconds each 30 seconds whether I use SS tanks and inversion or plastic tanks and a twirling stick. Something else is going on here.

[ronald_moravec1]

For best results, drop the loaded reel in a full tank, cap, invert 4 times in 10 sec, 1/4 turn twist, set down.

 

Wait 50 sec, repeat 4 inversions, twist, rest.

 

No presoak. Don`t use more than 8 oz so the developer can move into the top on inversion.

 

If all else fails, use a two reel tank with film on the bottom reel, empty on top as a spacer. Use but 8 oz developer so the film totally leaves the developer on inversion.

 

Do not try minimal agitation or stand etc. They make things worse.

[stwrtertbsratbs5]

I've used HP5 in 135, 120, and 4x5 and I've never had any problems at all. For Normal development I use D76 1:3 @ 68 deg for 14min, with 2 inversions each minute. Note that I use a Combi tank for 4x5. I just add the developer to the tank, invert a couple of times after I cap it, and then 2 inversions each minute. I always add volume of developer as specified on the tank.

[mitchell_kirschner]

I'll go out on a limb and make two wild guesses.

 

First possibility - HP5 has a thinner base than Tri-X (at least for 35mm), supposedly making it trickier to load onto a SS reel. Is the problem happening consistently, or is this your first roll? Are you confident the film was loaded properly onto the reel?

 

Second possibility - mild fogging along film edges from light leak? Are you using a bulk loader?

 

My standard is Tri-X in D76 1+1. I just finished my first roll of HP5+ and will be developing it soon (also in D76 1+1). I'll report back if I have similar problems.

[rick_jones5]

I too have, in the past, had problems with increased edge density with both 35mm and 120 although HP5 is not a film I have tried. After much hand wringing this is what I found cured the problem for me: 32oz SS tank fitted with a plastic top, 2-120 reels and 1-35mm reel, film on bottom reel, tank prefilled with 26oz developer, presoak film and reels about 30s to temper to 68 degrees, all three reels dropped into developer, agitation - constant for first 30s then 3 inversions on the minute. While it is difficult for me to entirely separate cause and effect I don't believe uniformity of development was effected so much by the presoak and agitation pattern as it was by the fact that I started allowing a generous space for developer movement.

[neil_rankin1]

Well, I have a theory as to what my issue may be. I think its my agitation technique. Again,

with Tri-x, Pan-F, FP4, I've had no issues, but HP5 has never seemed as even (and this after

dozens of rolls over the years). I believe HP5 is more susceptible to overagitation with

cocktail

shaker style agitation, AND is more susceptible to uneven agitation with the inversion

method. So, I am going to try a roll of 120 today. I will pay special attention to my developer

volume in relation to the top of the reel, so that I will not have any issues up there. I will give

my inversion technique a very slight adjustment. I will only give an inversion, there will be

force added at all to the inversion. I will report the results. Thanks.

[bob_the_builder1]

Hassleblad 500C/M. Planar 80/4 CF. HP5+ D76 1+1. Xtol 1+1. Intermittent agitation

(inversion technique). Never had any problems with HP5+. Perhaps you have a bad sample?

[jmalever]

Howdy Neil,

 

I use a single reel (Hewes) in a stainless tank. I fill the tank through the pour spout. I use 240ml of developer (D-76 or HC-110). Agitate for 10 seconds each minute, which usually amounts to 3-4 inversions just to give you an idea of the speed of my inversions. I then rap the tank on the counter top twice, moderately. Repeat for desired processing time. I have never had a problem with HP5+ or any other film for that matter. As far as agitation goes, I'm fairly gentle. I've read many people's descriptions of their agitation technique and they often seem overly vigorous. If you think about the effects of agitation, it seems odd to agitate as harshly as many do.

 

Jonas

[bob_smith]

I use one or two reel Nikor tanks with SS reels. Ilfosol S or ID-11. Pour it in the top until full.

Inversion agitation for 30 seconds and then four inversions every 30 seconds until done. I

have used this same sequence and developers with HP5, FP4 and Pan F since 1997 and don't

have any problems

[allanjensen]

I do exactly the same as Frank Schifano and never had problems with HP5. Neither with TRI-X. I use at least 200 ml of stock developer per film no matter which solution I make. Some say 150 ml is enough but I do not save money here.

[neil_rankin1]

OK. I processed a roll of HP5 120 in Xtol 1:1. Upon first inspection. The roll is an

improvement over more vigorous agitation methods, more even. I agitatated for 1st

minute, ten seconds every minute thereafter. But the roll is not perfect, there are small

black edges near one end and in another spot. Also, there is a funky spot closer to the

middle

of the roll. in an inch or so. Sorry I can't post a picture until it dries. It's enough to screw a

frame or two

depending on its position. Overall, though. I'd say the roll is an improvement and I realize

I can start shooting the stuff again. As for the agitation, the adjustment I made was a

subtle one. I used what I will call soft inversions, trying to remain even, and I rotated the

tank during the agitation cycle. Rather than throwing the chemistry from side of the tank

to the other during inversion, I concentrated on pourig the developer through the reel. Not

too bad, the roll is nice and clear, the Ilford marks look nice and crisp, but I want to stop

having any funky spots, at all. What is the cause of these spots and what can I do? I will try

and post a scan.

[aaron d]

No help at all - I'm having the very same problem. I had used 35mm FP4 for years with no

problems at all. Now I'm using 120 (6x9), still FP4, but the first batch of rolls I did got the

dark edges. I assumed it was my inversion style agitation and that I hadn't noticed the

overdeveloped edges before because the distance that the sprocket holes added to the

edge of 35mm film, though I don't remember ever seeing surging through the holes. So I

tried the twist thing (in a single roll Patterson tank, 500ml of D76 1:1) and got the

same results but worse. I'm using a newish Arca-Swiss (Horseman) back on a 4x5 camera

which seems to be in fine shape. I got the most visible dark edges - because the image

was mostly clear sky - in three consecutive frames that I took without removing the back,

or inserting the darkslide, even, so I'm pretty sure there are no light leaks. I do the same

with color and have no troubles. Getting tired of wasting film.

 

(Just to beat the horse a little - the tank I used with 35mm was a single roll, 35mm sized

tank, so you'd think that removes variables from the equation...)

[aaron d]

Sorry to keep busting into this! Niel, I re-read your last post. About your spots - I had

circular spots, some ring shaped even. Turned out to be residue from photo-flow solution.

The ring is a popped bubble I think. I may have been mixing it too strong, but I've avoided

the problem altogether by doing a final rinse in distilled water. That way even stuff in the tap

water is rinsed off. Could use a squeegee, but they make me nervous... Probably your spots

are something else still, but it's worth a shot.

[daniel_polednak]

Now this is scary stuff. So many people with the same problem. And guess what? I'm another one with uneven development issues. Light leak shouldn't be my problem because I ran a test roll of color film, had it processed in a lab and it's fine..

I'm bulk loading my film.. I'll try in a changing bag next time.

I'm using ID-11 1+1, inversion technique 10 inversions first 20 sec and 5 inversions in 11 secs with a little twist with each inversion every minute. Developed for 9:30, exposed at ISO 200 (sunny day).

I developed 2 rolls. First roll I developed yesterday was fine with online a little bit of dense areas on the outer side of the sprocket holes. Only 1-2 frames were affected.

With second roll I tried to develop a little bit more gently, that is I tried to move the liquid from top of the tank to the bottom by 'sliding' it on the walls of the tank rather than droping the developer onto the roll with a fast inversion. I got even worse results. Insane overagitation marks.. I'll post a picture soon when the negs dry up.

Maybe something screwed up Ilfords HP5+ production? any information about that?