Jobo-Which one?

[steve_wiley1]

I'm considering a Jobo. I'll be processing 100-150 B/W rolls a month. Is the CPP worth the extra $500.

[pete_andrews]

5 or 6 rolls of B&W per working day?<br>I'd say you'd be better off

with a couple of double or quad stainless tanks, and 6 to 8 reels, or

even a deep tank setup. It'll cost you far less initial outlay, and

you'll spend much less time cleaning down, drying, and loading. You've

also got a warm up time with a rotary processor, unless you leave the

tempering unit permanently switched on. The actual processing time is

minimal compared to these maintenance overheads.<br>Just MHO.

[dk_thompson]

I'd say a small deep tank setup as well. 2 gal. tanks would probably

work pretty well. If you're using one-shot chem. you have to factor

this in your cost, with a deep tank you should be able to handle that

volume on a monthly replenishment schedule. I haven't used a Jobo, so

I can't comment on what your chem. usage will be like. Of course, you

could always look around for a rebuilt Wing Lynch...they're pretty

convenient.

[scott_walton1]

If you are wanting to be "tied down" to the processor, the CPP is a good choice. I think if all your wanting to do is film though, the ATL 1500 (auto film

processor) might be a better bet though. Go to: http://www.jobo.com/ and find some used refurbished stuff also. An ATL 1 or 2 are good choices

also for a more automatic unit. Essentially, they are the same as the CPP but with an automatic lift and dump...

Cheers

[terry_carraway]

The CPP offers digital temp control over the CPA2. FOr up to 5 rolls a

day, a CPE2 will do the job for even less money. The big advantage,

IMO, is that if you swithc what you are doing, the CPP is easier to

set the temperture versus the CPA and CPE. You just set the digital

temp and give it time to equilabrate.

 

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Whatever model, budget a Lift. It makes a BIG difference in using the

processor.

 

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For B&W the warm up time will be minimal unless you keep your darkroom

very cold.

 

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But for a 5-6 roll every day, I would look at the ATL series. You

load the drum, put the chemistry in the bottles, push a button and

walk away. When it is done, you hang the film to dry.

[dk_thompson]

It is true that you'd be "tied" to the processor with a deep tank

line, but I don't know if you all have priced the ATL series at all.

Unless you can find one used, it looks like $4,000.00 or so is the

base price for the ATL 1500. That's kind of why I was suggesting the

deep tank, and mentioned a used Wing Lynch as well. You can probably

find a rebuilt 4, or 4E Wing Lynch with all the tube sets that you'd

need for $5-10,000.00. You could probably also find just a used one

for less than the price of an ATL-1500. They're pretty simple

machines, but they require a Nitrogen tank, and a water panel. They

come with battery backups and all that too. I haven't noticed alot of

Wing Lynch users on this forum, but I thought I'd throw this

suggestion out.

[steve_wiley1]

Thanks to everybody for the generous advice. I'd ruled out deep tanks

because:1) I prefer one-shot to replenishment. 2) I'll be processing

film with grey backgrounds and have had problems with surge at the

film edges with deep tanks. 3)I routinely print negatives processed at

various labs in NYC and the film processed at Kelton Labs, who use

Jobos, is far superior to the other labs who I know use deep tanks.

4) I would love to use the Expert drums for my own large format work.

Thanks again.

[dk_thompson]

Steve, it's great that you've made up your mind, but the reason why I

suggested a deep tank was because I was unsure of your budget. It is

true that some people have horrendous agitation problems with deep

tank lines, but I just want to say that we shoot all our tabletop

stuff on med. gray backgrounds, and run our film through a repl. deep

tank line. We've been doing this for over ten years, and get clean,

consistent negs. Since we switched to TMAX RS about 6 years ago, our

negs have been super clean. But, it's really a personal thing. To each

his own, but I like the predictability of a seasoned dev. Good luck

with the Jobo.

[triblett_lungre_thurd]

I dunno 'bout the wang dang idear... we used to call our model 3 the

"WING BITCH", ... it liked to spit the tubes up thereby lifting the

lid....plus it had a belt-driven agitator spindle that would foul

often... eventually I remounted the agit motor a little higher and

with a couple of set screws in a collar, converted it to direct drive.

It helped. Even the new model five seems to have that hokey method

of agitation. You should be able to find a wangdang at your local

newspaper... I work at just such a place and we've got a model 4

upstairs rotting amongst all the digital workstations. For room temp

stuff like BW... well I'd just buy a 8 reel tank and get busy. A jobo

won't be any faster than that.

[dk_thompson]

I've heard many stories like that too. But I really am a deep tank

person myself for b&w. I only mentioned the Wing Lynch because I could

never bring myself to pay as much money for a Jobo, despite all the

fantastic things I keep reading about them. Yes, you could buy a

rotting wing lynch for less than the cost of a manual jobo, and they

probably would all come from newspapers that have gone digital...6

rolls a day is nothing in a deep tank. Even a home made setup using

PVC drain pipe tubes could handle that & be left up permanently (as

was done at newspapers too.) Oh well, I'm not trying to stir up

trouble

here, really, but it just seems like by the time you get everything

set up, and attend to the processor, and knock it down/dry the tubes

out for another run, that you could have just run the film through the

tanks and have been done. I better stop now while I can...

[james_megargee]

I concure w/ DK on using a deep tank system w/ a replenished developer. I have

always found greater consistancy in using a seasoned developer over one shot.

Some points on surge - as you more than likely are aware - its a result of

improper initial agitation, usually establishing itself during the first 30-60

seconds of development and is more prevelent when using high energy type

developers w/ short development times. Also, a rotary processor is not

immmune to this problem. I have seen surge on negatives that were processed

using a JOBO that was as bad as anything Ive seen with other systems.

[steve_wiley1]

Back to the original question. Is the CPP mechanically better?

Is the build quality higher, or is it just the cold water solenoid and

digital readout that adds to price? If I'm only processing B/W, can I

add my own $40 digital thermometer to the CPA and be just as happy?

As always, your collective consideration of this matter is deeply

appreciated.

[dk_thompson]

Steve, sorry that my answers caused the topic to drift so. My gut

reaction (again I am not a Jobo user) would be that if you are only

going to be doing b&w, and that's all you ever think you will do, then

why pay for the extra control? Unless of course this cooling solenoid

can actually function in a water-chilling capacity. This might be nice

if you live in are with not so cold tap water, and you are trying to

run a water jacket in the summer time. I suspect it has more to do

with E6/C41 proc. though. One thing to think about is whether or not

you'd be limiting yourself in some way, if you did decide to run color

someday. Hope this helps, and no more comments from me on this one..

[boris_krivoruk2]

Steve, CPP is not mechanically better. All it has extra is cold

solenoid and digital builtin thermometer to control temperature.

[terry_carraway]

There are the same mechanically.

 

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But I think the CPP uses a digital thermostat, not just a digital

thermometer. This will allow you set different temps easier, just set

and wait to stabilize. The CPA and CPE use an analog setup that does

require tweaking to get the temp right.

[paul_hutchison]

http://www.jobo-usa.com/products/cpp-a.htm <br>

Should anwer most of you questions. Units are identical besides the digital temp set and measure (more accuate for color work, not a must for b/w) and the cold water solenoid for rapid water bath cooling (or bringing below room temp). Not that the CPA won't do color, just not as temp accurate as CPP, and temp is critical in color. Think you'll get into color in the future?