Another "white spots on my negs" problem

[aeiffel]

Hi all,

 

<p>This is the second - AND consecutive - time this problem occurs.

The first time it only affected 2 frames, but now the roll I've just

developed has those spots all over it. I've already developed dozens

of rolls the same way before and can't understand what happened

here.<br>

I think I've seen a similar problem posted here not very long but

didn't manage to find the thread again. I feel I'd better ask here

directly because there are a couple of different factors that might

be responsible for this... and here they are :<br>

- I used the 30 remaining ml of a 500ml Rodinal bottle, so maybe some

particles in the bottom could explain this (I doubt it though...) ?

<br>

- I opened up a new bottle of distilled water, perhaps particles in

it too ?<br>

- both films were loaded in a rather dusty and windy environment, I

did a quick check : camera and lenses look almost dust-free...<br>

- Must be some other reasons, hard water in summer, etc...</p>

 

<p>some details on the development :<br>

small paterson hand tank<br>

Tri-x 35 rated @250<br>

developer : rod 1:25 mixed with distilled water, 5'30", 30" intial

agitation, agitation once every 30" (no plain inversions, only 45?

tilting)<br>

stop bath : tap water<br>

fixer : fresh Ilford rapid fixer (4'30")<br>

wash : tap water<br>

drying at room temp<br>

(temperature of all solutions : 20?C)</p>

 

<p>Attached are scans of the most damaged frame (upper half) and a

detail of one of the spots.<br>

Thanks for your time.<br>

fred</p>

[aeiffel]

detail of the spot on the left of watchtower

[frank.schifano]

That's not dust. It looks like airbells to me. Rap the bottom of the tank a few times after you fill it and agitate more vigorously. A 45 deg. tilt once every 30 sec isn't going to do much.

[User_502260]

It might be air bells but it could also be something else. It is nice to know that film developers like Rodinal and Edwal FG-7 can last a long time. This doesn't mean we should use the last few drops if we aren't sure it is still good. If you must use developer with particles floating in it then at least pour it through a coffee filter so the particles don't stick to the film.

 

To be safe, developer should be mixed with or diluted with distilled water. I haven't heard of problems with tap water for stop bath (if you use it) or fixer. The final rinse should be with distilled water and Kodak Photo Flo or a similar wetting agent. This will allow the film to dry evenly and with no streaks or stains from minerals in the tap water. If you keep these precautions and agitate the tank sufficiently you should not have this problem again.

 

Jeff Adler

[ronald_moravec1]

My guess is concetrated developer particals that precipitated from the solution. Don`t use the bottom of the container. Draw out developer from stock with a syringe, transfer pippette. or eyedropper getting developer from just below the surface of the liquid. Don`t suck up the junk from the bottom. Don`t agitate the bottle drawing stock out, Don`t pour out into measuring container.

 

A coffee filter is not fine enough to clean this up. The best you can do without pressurised lab filters is a cotton mass in the neck of a funnel. A portion of make up cotton ball works fine. Better to just get some new Rodinal.

[rowland_mowrey]

There are five types of white spots that one can find on processed negative film, either B&W or color.

 

1. Irregular spots scattered over the film are usually due to dust on the film when in the camera being exposed.

 

2. Regular circular spots can be spots of dust or water on the lens (if diffused) or water droplets on the film before processing. These sometimes have a darker center.

 

3. Regular circular spots with a darker center can also be due to contaminated chemistry which has crystals of developer, oxidation products, old flecks of emulsion (if used developer), or iron or other dirt from the water used.

 

The dust spots can be eliminated by cleaning the lens.

 

The others require filtered clean fresh developer.

 

Straight water caused spots can be eliminated by making sure your equipment is dry, dry, dry.

 

4. Now, airbells usually form circular white spots with no dark center. They are almost always eliminated by a prewet with water. I know that there are posts here and elsewhere that claim that a prewet will cause nonuniformity, but that is simply not true. In fact, EK recommends a pre-hardener for B&W films and a wash if temperatures become too high for the 68 degree process recommended.

 

There you have some common causes of lighter spots on negative films and possible methods of elimination.

 

5. The worst spots I have had are due to small shards of paper and glue on 120, 220, or 35mm film coming lose in the process and 'gumming up the works' so to speak. You have to make sure you get the tape and paper off of the film before processing, or you run the risk of getting small bits of the glue and paper into your solutions or stuck to your equipment. These cause light spots if they come loose during development and stick to the film, but they cause dark spots if they are allowed to dry on the film. In addition, they can lead to scratches if you wipe the film down with a squeegee or sponge after processing if any of this gunk is on the film. The sticky glue can also cause problems with your reels and make film harder to load onto the reel. This last problem is nasty as you can prevent all of the others, and then lose a frame or so if static electricity causes a small 'dot' of paper to cling to the film, or if you inadvertantly tear off a small shard of tape. I am extremely careful during this stage of loading to prevent this type of problem, and I clean the reels well afterwards. I also filter my photo flo or color stabilizer to insure clean solutions.

 

Ron Mowrey

[aeiffel]

Thanks all for your help, and especially Ron for his comprehensive contribution on the 'spots' topic. I made sure to save it on my HD.

 

I'm guilty of forgetting the basics sometimes, and it looks like I finally paid for it. My guess, according to your answers and the way I developed these 2 rolls, is that the problem came from particles/crystals in the Rodinal and insufficient agitation after pouring in the developer. I'm glad this isn't a more serious issue...

[richard_cochran]

Those are classic textbook airbells. Rap the tank after

agitation to dislodge

the air bubbles. The reason you can tell they're airbells is

because they're perfectly circular and they're LIGHT on the

negative (dark on the print). Airbells are caused by bubbles

that prevent the developer from reaching that section of the film,

hence that section of the film is underdeveloped and light.

[al_divenuti]

I echo the Airbell theory. These are far too close to regular circles to be particulate matter. I've messed up a roll of APX 100 in 135 due to failing to completely dissolve the Borax I added to my Rodinal 1:50 laced with sodium ascorbate. The resulting white spots were irregular shaped blotches - not circles or ellipses.