Refurb D600 has 5436 actuations!

Discussion in 'Nikon' started by peterd, Aug 26, 2013.

  1. Hi All, got a question. I bought a refurb D600 that I just unboxed from Adorama and I was expecting some light usage, like maybe up to 500 pictures. However this thing has over 5000! This to me is not refurbished but rather used. I am headed to portland where I planned to get a lens no tax. Should I send this back to Adorama and just get a new one? I am kind of upset by the count. Peter
     
  2. Please drop me an email: Helen@adorama.com with your order number and I can advise on how to return it.

    Helen Oster
    Adorama Camera Customer Service Ambassador
     
  3. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    First of all, refurbished cameras are indeed used cameras. In the grand scheme of things, 5436 actuations is not all that many, as the D600 is rated to 150K and perhaps a lot more in reality. To me, what is more important is whether that particular D600 is problem free, but you are the one who is buying and this is solely your decision.
     
  4. Does Nikon pick up image counts from previously used cards like Canon cameras? On a Canon camera, the file name will go to the next highest number if the card was previously used in another Canon camera. So, let's say camera 1 had an image file name of 1234 then the image file name on brand-new camera 2 will start at 1235.
     
  5. refurbished = used but brought back to a known 'good' condition (ala 'certified pre-owned')
     
  6. 5436 / 150000 = 3.624%. That's not much usage. I've had refurb'd equipment. Sometimes it's worked better than an original out of the box. It is quite a bit though. It was probably a demo unit.
     
  7. I'd send it back. That is ridiculous.
     
  8. If the sensor is clean (meaning no oil/dust), I wouldn't worry. But do what you feel comfortable with. It is your camera and you have to be happy. And Adorama wants you to be happy.
     
  9. All refurbished Nikon units sold by Adorama Camera come with a 90-day return-to-Nikon warranty - which includes a 30-day returns period to Adorama - and have all been factory refurbished by the manufacturer.
    A refurb will have been checked over by the manufacturer by hand, inspected very thoroughly, diagnosed, and calibrated by experienced technicians, and could therefore turn out to be more dependable than a new item - which will only have been checked by a process of systematic quality control protocol (ie by random sampling as it comes off the conveyor belt).
    Refurbs can have simply been pulled from the production line if something appears faulty, or if they haven’t passed the final inspection. Most of the time it is a very minor issue that needs correcting, nevertheless, once it is pulled from the normal flow of production, it gets flagged as a refurbished model, so you may get a unit straight from the factory that has never been used. (I have three myself, and for sure they were all factory-fresh!)
    A refurb may also be an ex-store demo, possibly used in field tests or sales displays, or it may have been ordered in error and returned to the retailer (who can't then sell it as 'new' so it has to be sent back to the manufacturer for refurbishment).
    In addition, Refurbs come into us with the firmware updates and latest fixes which were carried out at whatever stage it was at when we took delivery.
    As to the individual history of a single item, the honest answer is we have no way of knowing. Refurbished equipment is not like new inventory; the manufacturers contact us when they have a batch to sell, and the availability is unpredictable.
    However, if you were to ask my personal opinion on whether the equipment that Adorama offers as refurbished is typically less than a year old, based on the regularity with which we receive batches, I'd be inclined to think it is all relatively new.
    I hope this helps, but as I noted above, if the OP would like email me directly: Helen@adorama.com I will be delighted to assist in advising on the returns procedure.
    Helen Oster
    Adorama Camera Customer Service Ambassador
     
  10. Nikon doesn't warranty shutter actuations. 150K means nothing, except that Nikon designed it to last 150K clicks. If your sample survives 200K or dies at 10K is an open question.
    That said it is quite possible a pro used it very briefly. Wedding shooters and sports shooters could rack up that amount of clicks in just two days.
    But if it was mine I'd return it.
     
  11. If the sensor is clean (meaning no oil/dust), I wouldn't worry. But do what you feel comfortable with. It is your camera and you have to be happy. And Adorama wants you to be happy.
     
  12. I'd send it back. That is ridiculous.​
    I disagree. What is reasonable? I often take this number in 1 weekend's work event shooting. It's not being sold as NEW, it's used! 10 is really pushing it, 20 is notifiable!
    Unless I'm mistaken, there are reports of NEW cameras having a couple of hundred on the counter and that's just written off as good random factory testing....especially regarding the D600's oil drop problem.
    I guess you have a years warranty?
     
  13. 90 days return-to-Nikon warranty, which includes a 30 day returns period to Adorama.
    The OP has been in contact with me and I have advised him how to return it to us, so I guess this topic can be closed?
    Helen Oster
    Adorama Camera Customer Service Ambassador
     
  14. 5,000 on a refurb is nothing. I would take 5,000 on a refurb over 500 on used any day of the week. As already mentioned you have 90 days to see if its working perfectly. Refurb is not new, thats why its refurb, but you get a short warranty that Nikon stands behind and they go over it to make sure its working.
     
  15. pge

    pge

    5,000 does seem like quite a bit. I was just looking at an ad on Craigs List today for a 2 year old D700 and it had 2,000. I shoot about 7,500 a year so 5,000 in my hands would be quite a lot of use. I bought my most recent camera in late May and it doesn't have 5,000 yet.
     
  16. Helen is a princess, trust her. Adorama is a great dealer to work with. I have had nothing but great experience with them. No, I do not work for them, but have been very please with my purchase experience with them.
     
  17. For me, I would tend to have more faith in a refurb than one brand new, because 1st, it is repaired if necessary, and thoroughly checked and tested, and 2nd, the calibration and function is checked thoroughly for this particular camera, rather than a production run which may have only spot testing of samples selected at random. Of course, there is also the matter of a better price. :)
     
  18. Somebody who's had a D700 for 2 years and only took 2,000 frames needs to get out and shoot more! If I saw something that odd I'd think there must be something wrong with the camera. Has he not been using it because it has a problem he never wanted fixed, or is it because all he does with the D700 is sit at his desk and fondle it, and which of those would be worse? Or maybe it was bought by a rich guy who got the idea from reading web sites that he just had to have a D700 because it was the only thing capable of taking photos of children, and then he left it in a damp, salty locker on his yacht, getting rocked back and forth and bumped around 24/7 for the better part of those two years before he upgraded to a Leica M.
    IMO a camera that's been owned previously should have at least several thousand shutter actuations so I know it's been broken in and used by the sort of person who's not crazy enough to own a really good camera and never used it. Or we could stop looking at shutter actuations completely because it's a pointless metric that tells us nothing about the likely actual condition of the camera, which has much more to do with how was used than how much it was used. These Nikons don't just wear out. I have one that's 50 years old and doing fine.
     
  19. Adorama, via Helen, did what it always does--stand behind the product.
    Thanks, Helen!
    Paul
     
  20. Like others have said, 5,000 is nothing!
     
  21. I'm going to throw into the camp that 5,000 is nothing. My D80 had that after 4 months of enthusiast use. If I had used it for events/paid work, I could easily have racked up 5,000 in two or three weeks of use, before being able to decide whether the camera was suitable for making a living or not. As mathematically shown above, sending a REFURBISHED camera back for 3,000 actuations is like turning down a used car because it has 10,000 miles. It comes with the territory, and if you're more worried about worshipping your camera than using it, then go get yourself a new camera in a shiny box, and leave the refurbs to people that won't spaz out.
     
  22. Especially with the D600 I would probably rack up a few thousand shots before the return period is over just to make sure I have a copy that doesn't keep throwing oil onto the sensor - unless I am prepared to deal with it on a regular basis. Since a few people report that even after a repair by Nikon the problem resurfaces, I'd be skeptical buying a refurbished D600 since chances are that it had the problem before.
    But I agree with some above that 5,000 isn't something that would give me much pause when buying refurbished - after all, I am getting a decent discount and whether the shutter has done through 100 or 1000 actuations hardly makes a difference. In addition, one can't be certain that a lower-mileage one didn't have the shutter count reset by Nikon - and it was "forgotten" for this particular copy.
     
  23. I guess I will finally chime in here. Its kind of like the thread is going toward the direction of a blood letting here (mine) because
    the tone is starting to go a bit neg in regards to my questioning if this is too many shots for a fairly new refurb. A few details I didnt share is
    that the body and accessories show a bit more wear than I feel they should. For example the plastic cover screen shows
    a lot of scuffing. Big deal right? But that makes me think how did that get like that to begin with. The one on my 5 year old
    camera that has traveled the world with me, driven thousands of kilometers and passed many customs is in better shape
    by far. I did a lot of research prior and most folks said often the cameras were like new including actuations. This amount
    shocked me and I stand by that. What I dont like are comments like I am more interested in worshipping the camera etc.
    Its not that at all, because what I think is that someone bought the camera, used the hell out of it and then returned it to
    avoid paying for it. Happens all the time. This is not a fair comparison to 10000 miles on a car. Its not the same because
    you cant drop the car. :) That said, I did reach out to Helen and I will evaluate the camera but its unlikely I will keep it
    because I can do better and honestly my money my choice. Refurb or not 1600 is not cheap and whats at stake here is
    that I wonder if that previous owner abused the camera. Kinda like buying a used car from a smoker. No matter what you
    do that smell always comes back. Thank you Helen and Adorama for letting me decide what to do and I agree with her, to
    me this is now a closed issue.
     
  24. Oh, then you've got a complaint - least they could do is replace the plastic screen guard if it's scratched.
     
  25. "The OP has been in contact with me and I have advised him how to return it to us, so I guess this topic can be closed?" (Helen Oster)

    Oh, no no no. This thread will live on for years! In 2018 someone will see this thread for the first time and respond to it! :)


    (PS, if it had been me, I would have kept the camera. At least I would know THAT one was working OK.)

    Kent in SD
     
  26. Hand to the forehead.
     
  27. Or it was used by me or Shun or another reviewer. After the review process is finished the gear is returned (you think we
    get to keep this stuff? hah!) and I assume it goes through the refurbishment cycle unless there was a problem with the
    camera or lens.
     
  28. Guys i havent returned it yet. Stop with the sarcasm already.
     
  29. You posed a question but left out some facts that were relevent to the situation. You did one thing right, you bought your refurbished camera from a legitimate dealer.
     
  30. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    I think we (or more like Peter Denny and Adorama) are in the current situation due to some misunderstanding. Apparently Peter was not aware that refurbished Nikon equipment is indeed used equipment. If it were a refurbished lens, unless it has scratches and "brassing" all over, it would have been difficult to tell how much usage it has had. The fact that digital SLRs have a shutter actuation counter is both good and bad. Again, IMO, 5436 actuations on a refurbished D600 is low. However, this is Peter's purchase; he is the one that needs to be happy with it and only his opinion matters here. And since Adorama is willing to accept this return, both parties are ok with it.
    Peter did ask a question here, and a bunch of us gave our suggestions. It is entirely up to Peter to decide what to do.
    Frankly, for the rest of us, it is none of our business any more.
     
  31. Peter was not aware that refurbished Nikon equipment is indeed used equipment.​
    It isn't necessarily used. As I stated above:
    "Refurbs can have simply been pulled from the production line if something appears faulty, or if they haven’t passed the final inspection.......once it is pulled from the normal flow of production, it gets flagged as a refurbished model, so you may get a unit straight from the factory that has never been used. (I have three myself, and for sure they were all factory-fresh!)

    A refurb may......have been ordered in error and returned to the retailer (who can't then sell it as 'new' so it has to be sent back to the manufacturer for refurbishment)."
     
  32. If no sensor and AF issues, I would keep it. One of my refurb D800 had 10K actuations and since it didn't have the notorious left focus problem, I decided to keep it. :D
     
  33. You may be lucky, and only problem is with wrong expectation or understanding what refurbished means.
    The camera required repairs only after some 5000+ pictures?, that is what made it REFURBISHED so soon?
    I would risk saying that all REFURBISHED cameras are USED cameras as well, so getting a refurbished camera one should not expect to have the shutter actuation counter reset to zero.
    ... and Nikon camera shutter actuations have nothing to do with memory cards etc., as someone questioned.
    You have 2 choices:
    1 - original owner of the camera when it was a new, abused it badly, or something bad happenned to the camera. I would assume that the refurbishing proces fixed and eliminated all problems that brought the camera for refurbishing.
    2 - you have a lemon camera, and the next need for repair or return and refurbishing again could come soon.
     
  34. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    It isn't necessarily used. As I stated above:
    "Refurbs can have simply been pulled from the production line if something appears faulty, or if they haven’t passed the final inspection.......once it is pulled from the normal flow of production, it gets flagged as a refurbished model, so you may get a unit straight from the factory that has never been used. (I have three myself, and for sure they were all factory-fresh!)​
    Ok Helen, your description is far more accurate and inclusive.
    But some refurbished equipment is indeed used; apparently Peter the OP was not aware of that fact.
     
  35. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    And Helen also wrote:
    The OP has been in contact with me and I have advised him how to return it to us, so I guess this topic can be closed?​
    It sounds like this case is closed, indeed.
     
  36. For example the plastic cover screen shows a lot of scuffing​
    Just curious, but wouldn't a thorough Nikon refurb have replaced this? Not meant to be a criticism, just a question!
     
  37. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    Mike, my experience with Nikon USA refurb equipment is limited, but at least in one occasion, the refurb is not at all thorough. In fact, it was extremely sloppy:
    • The refurbished 70-300mm AF-S VR I bought from B&H, not Adorama, showed some motion blur at 300mm on a tripod, even with VR switched off. Admittedly, that problem is subtle and I can certainly see why a technician may have missed it.
    • However, the one my friend received would rattle when you shook it. Clearly there was a loose screw inside. The entire AF mechanism didn't work. I can't see how that lens could pass any QA. And there is no way that a screw inside a lens should come loose during shipping, with no damage on the package.
    http://www.photo.net/nikon-camera-forum/00Y8dY
    I suppose Adorama and B&H received their refurb Nikon equipment from the same source, namely Nikon USA.
     
  38. C'mon what are we talking about?!

    I bought a second hand D700 on 2013-01-12 with 49,957 actuations, today it has 53,374 actuations and still works like a dream!! It's a workhorse use it and enjoy it !!

    my 2 cents ;)
     
  39. Bart, you've managed 3400 frames in 8 months?...that's a very relaxed 'Workhorse'...:)
     
  40. Wow Bart I can shoot that much in a weekend. Sometimes in a day...
    My experience with refurbs has been limited to one. It was a D300s that I purchased as a refurb from Nikon USA. Showed up at my house DOA. Kind of chilled my outlook on Refurbs and on the whole hand inspected thing. If they had put a battery in the camera they would have found the problem right away. I did send it in to Nikon for repair under the 90 warranty and they did fix it on the first try.
     
  41. Thanks guys ;)

    You understand what i mean to say right :D

    50.000 or more actuations is nothing for a professional dslr, so what's 5436 actuations ?
     
  42. I typically buy refurbished equipment and check it thoroughly when I get it. However, I would expect a refurb unit to be restored to the same condition as it was when it left the manufacturing line. A few dozen actuations is okay, but over 5000 screams demo unit as opposed to refurb. I would buy a demo lens, but not a demo camera. My own quirk. I would return it and try to buy another refurb. I would imagine Adorama would have several refurbished D600 units on hand at any given time.
     
  43. Wow Bart I can shoot that much in a weekend. Sometimes in a day...​
    mm more than 3400 in 1 day, ..
    All "Keepers" ?
    Must take a lot of time to view a 1 months worth of pictures then.. ;-) :)
     
  44. He didn't say "keepers".
    If you're shooting certain kinds of sport, it's actually pretty easy to rattle off 3000+ frames in a day, especially if you're shooting at (say) 8 or 10 fps - I've even managed 2000+ in a single session shooting birds - but it's obvious that this is the pre-culling count, and there'll be a lot less after the culling stage.
     
  45. Helen's responses sound reasonable and Adorama is a reliable source. That said, I just ordered a refurb D600 (w/lens) from an Ebay listing and I called the dealer (not Adorama, sorry) prior to ordering to ask some questions about all this. They said they can not determine the history of the camera but offered to check the number of "clicks" before shipping since they had several units on hand. So I requested 500 or less, please. They emailed me today that my camera had only 1 (one) "click". Wow, but I wonder how that can happen? My theory was that the number of "clicks" might be a clue as to the camera's situation, but I was not prepared for 1. Any theories?
     
  46. Well Helen told me they are not allowed to open refurb packages per Nikon but if its true you made out much better than I did. If you get it please post what it is. I am curious.
     
  47. If they did the test properly, one click would mean a camera that has not been tested. They take a shot, read off the
    number of clicks, and it says 1, which is the shot they took. If the camera had been tested at the factory it would have a
    couple hundred or more - which is why new cameras often have a few hundred clicks on them.

    More likely, they either made it up and never checked the camera, or took a shot, saw that the file was DSC0001 (or
    whatever it is on a D600) and thought that meant 1 click.
     
  48. Wow, but I wonder how that can happen? My theory was that the number of "clicks" might be a clue as to the camera's situation, but I was not prepared for 1. Any theories?​

    As I said above:

    "Refurbs can have simply been pulled from the production line if something appears faulty, or if they haven’t passed the final inspection. Most of the time it is a very minor issue that needs correcting, nevertheless, once it is pulled from the normal flow of production, it gets flagged as a refurbished model, so you may get a unit straight from the factory that has never been used. (I have three myself, and for sure they were all factory-fresh!)"


    Helen told me they are not allowed to open refurb packages per Nikon​
    We are not - but not ALL refurbs are manufacturer refurbished (and perhaps there are retailers who have different agreements with manufacturers, or who don't adhere to them?)
     
  49. Sorry Helen I was just trying to point out that you guys are top notch and that person may not be dealing with a reputable dealer.
     
  50. I just received a refurb d600 from Adorama as well. After digging around to figure out how to find the number of shots (Just switched from an F100 so its not obvious to me), I discovered I only had about 90 actuations.
    I'm not sure how I would feel about 5,000 to tell you the truth. The price discount would probably make it worthwhile to me, but on the other hand that does seem quite "used".
     
  51. That's what I am thinking. If I had that number of actuations this would never have come up. That is quite a disparity.
     
  52. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    As some others have pointed out, when I photograph wildlife or sports, I may capture 5000 frames in 3, 4 days. Therefore, at least to me, whether a refurbished camera has 90, 5000 or 10,000 actuations is next to meaningless. I would expect most refurbished cameras to be used, perhaps with some problems so that they are returned to Nikon. Hopefully Nikon has indeed fixed those issues. Therefore, I would test any refurbished camera or lens out carefully. In fact, I would do that with any new cameras also.
    George Simler, I would be interested in knowing whether your refurb D600 has any problems, especially any dust or oil issues, as we discuss on this recent thread: D600 Sensor Spots Appear Again - Any one with same issue
     
  53. My $0.02 worth. A modern car has an estimated lifetime of ca 300 000km barring accidents!). If I managed to buy a used car with 5 436 km on the clock I would consider myself very fortunate
     
  54. I have not had the stamina to read the whole thread, but those contemplating buying a refurb might like to consider a simple question on principle: why would you expect a pristine new camera for the savings you intend to make on buying refurbished? If you want new, buy new.
    Simple.
     
  55. I have not had the stamina to read the whole thread, but those contemplating buying a refurb might like to consider a simple question on principle: why would you expect a pristine new camera for the savings you intend to make on buying refurbished? If you want new, buy new.
    Simple.​
    This misses the point entirely. There is a expectation being maintained by manufacturers and retailers that there is a difference between used and refurbished. In reality there seems to be far more grey area with respect to what defines refurbished than I myself would be comfortable with. The perception I get from these types of stories is that you cannot count on "refurbished" meaning anything other "somewhat less used". The idea that a refurbished item, by definition, has been brought back into spec by authorized servicing seems to be false.
     
  56. The idea that a refurbished item, by definition, has been brought back into spec by authorized servicing seems to be false.​
    A refurb will have been by definition, checked over by the manufacturer by hand, inspected very thoroughly, diagnosed, and calibrated by experienced technicians.
    As I said, above:
    "Refurbs can have simply been pulled from the production line if something appears faulty, or if they haven’t passed the final inspection ]so] it gets flagged as a refurbished model, so you may get a unit straight from the factory that has never been used. (I have three myself, and for sure they were all factory-fresh!)
    A refurb may also be an ex-store demo, possibly used in field tests or sales displays, or it may have been ordered in error and returned to the retailer..."
    Complaints like Peter's while not quite as rare as hen's teeth, are pretty close!
    As I have explained on this forum, and to Peter by email, he has a full 30 days to return it to us for a full refund, or exchange. If he decides to keep it, then he still has up to 90 days from purchase to send it back to Nikon under warranty. The warranty covers anything the manufacturer's warranty covers for a new unit.
     
  57. A refurb may also be an ex-store demo, possibly used in field tests or sales displays, or it may have been ordered in error and returned to the retailer..."​
    This basically supports my statement:
    The idea that a refurbished item, by definition, has been brought back into spec by authorized servicing seems to be false.​
    Adorama's good intentions and excellent customer service aside, I believe the definition of "refurbished" depends too often on who's doing the defining. I'm not pointing a finger at anyone in particular, but you surely must see how other people's lax definition and poor enforcement of that definition hurts you as well in the long run.
    I suppose it's a price that must be paid to have such generous return policies for new purchases. Despite have never returned a piece of photo gear myself, I do find these policies reassuring. It's just that when it comes to refurbished, it appears my expectations are out of line with industry standards.
     
  58. I suppose it's a price that must be paid to have such generous return policies for new purchases.​

    Are you suggesting that Peter's unit was a a customer return to Adorama? If so you are 100% incorrect.

    All refurbished units as I have explained above, are refurbished by the manufacturer. They are sent into us in sealed boxes which we are not permitted to open.

    We have no idea at all of the history of any refurb; eg where or when it was first purchased, (if indeed it was); why it was refurbished or exactly what work was carried out on it for Nikon to define it as a refurbished unit.
    BTW, many units are returned that have never been used; they may be 'change of mind' returns; unwanted gifts; 'I-was --just-canned-&-can't-afford-to-keep-it' returns; my-wife-has-said-she-will-leave-me-if-I keep-this' returns; 'I ordered in error' returns.
    They may have been opened but unused, but it doesn't mean we can sell them as new; we have to send them off for refurbishing - but it doesn't mean we get the same units back.
     
  59. Are you suggesting that Peter's unit was a a customer return to Adorama? If so you are 100% incorrect.​
    My comments are meant to be general in nature and not specific to Adorama or Peter's camera.
    They may have been opened but unused, but it doesn't mean we can sell them as new; we have to send them off for refurbishing - but it doesn't mean we get the same units back.​
    All this means is that what you sell as refurbished is dependent on what other sellers think they can get away with refurbishing. Which is kind of my point.
     
  60. All this means is that what you sell as refurbished is dependent on what other sellers think they can get away with refurbishing. Which is kind of my point.​
    NO!

    If you buy a manufacturer refurbished unit from a reputable retailer, it depends on the standard set by the manufacturer!
     
  61. To me this thread is developing into Adorama bashing.....
     
  62. As the original poster I have only great things to say about Adorama. If that is what you are seeing its not from me nor am I in agreement with it. I think its more people hashing about what a refurb definition is etc. Helen has been nothing but stellar in her replies and attitude. Personally I am surprised people keep posting. At this point if I could figure out how I would delete the whole thread... Peter
     
  63. Honestly - even 10,000 isn't much at all. Think of it this way: how long would you expect the body to last? 5 years? 10 years? Even if there were 10,000 exposures on it - if you averaged that in a year, that's 15 years before the camera reaches the Nikon expectations for shutter durability before it needs a servicing... you honestly think anyone will be shooting with a D600 in 15 years? How many people are still posting about the D70?
    All the panic about 'high shutter' counts kind of mystifies me. Me? I'd be happy to save a few hundred bucks on a camera that is Nikon refurbished, and has under 10,000 shutter count, as long as it performs well. In my book- that's a good as new. (Heck - even a few mess-arounds with some timelapse shots will easily rack up a few thousand shutter counts... and that's not exactly 'hard usage.' It's just a number. And unless you're using it as a full-time pro (and putting the miles on it accordingly) you're still going to be WAAAAAY off from ever seeing the shutter fail, unless the camera is defective. And if it is - it's going to need to be serviced anyway... c'est la vie! How many cameras have you owned with over 100,000 clicks on them? And of those, how many have you ever had to get the shutter serviced/replaced? Get out. Shoot. Just enjoy!
     
  64. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    To me this thread is developing into Adorama bashing.....​
    Authur, I wonder why you got that impression. Not that they are prefect, but Adorama is among the very best mail-order stores; as far as I can tell, that is exactly what this thread shows.
    Personally I am surprised people keep posting. At this point if I could figure out how I would delete the whole thread... Peter​
    People keep on posting because those people have nothing better to do. :) And once you post, per photo.net's rules, photo.net has the right to display that forever if they choose to do so.
     
  65. Shun, the reason why I state Adorama bashing is simple. Peter bought a camera that did not meet his expectations. In my opinion he should contact Adorama first and offer them the chance to set things straight for him before posting here.
    I have no business with Adorama, it just didn't seem fair to me.
     
  66. I have purchased two refurbished cameras, both from Adorama, I believe, and wouldn't hesitate buying another one. I fail to see the problem.
     
  67. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    Shun, the reason why I state Adorama bashing is simple. Peter bought a camera that did not meet his expectations. In my opinion he should contact Adorama first and offer them the chance to set things straight for him before posting here.​
    Arthur, well, I never feel that way at all. In the US, it is actually Nikon USA that performs the refurbishing, just like Nikon (Thailand) manufactures the D600. The likes of Adorama, B&H, etc. merely sells whatever they receive from Nikon USA (or, in the case of gray-market items, from someone else).
    The fact of the matter is that a lot of (but not all) refurbished items are used items, many with problems that went back to Nikon for repair. It should surprise no one that a refurbished D600 has 5000 actuations or even 10K or 20K actuations. Personally, that is not really an issue. One way or another, if there are any issues, such as the totally non-functioning refurbished 70-300mm AF-S VR my friend received, it is Nikon USA's responsibility, not Adorama or B&H. The problem here is that Peter the OP has a different expectation; he thought "refurbished" is almost new. And he is doing the right thing to return it for a new D600, which is what he really wants.
    In these cases, Adorama and B&H are also doing the right things: helping the customer for a refund or exchange.
     
  68. Arthur Richardson[​IMG], Sep 03, 2013; 05:07 a.m.
    Shun, the reason why I state Adorama bashing is simple. Peter bought a camera that did not meet his expectations. In my opinion he should contact Adorama first and offer them the chance to set things straight for him before posting here. I have no business with Adorama, it just didn't seem fair to me.​
    To be fair to me, I simply asked if that was a high number of actuations. I wasnt bashing adorama, i was asking about my camera I received as it was my first refurb. Why dredge this up as an issue now? I already said it wasnt as has Shun.
     
  69. Peter you are totally right to ask the question about the actuations. I have no problem with that all. I, however, would have done things differently.
    About the bashing: I got the impression by Helen's repeated reply, that the thread was developing in a way I thought was unfair. Posts by other people than you. I should have mentioned that in my previous post and I do not think you are responsible for other people's input on the discussion.
    Having re read the discussion I believe that the majority of posts are positive about Adorama, no advertising can replace that. Most important thing is that you got what you expected to get.
    Perhaps I am accustomed to the generally speaking poor service you get at the average shop over here in The Netherlands.
    I hope that you did not take offense by my "contribution" to the discussion. Now let the camera's speak!
     
  70. I also bought my camera refurbished from a local dealer. No problems after over three months. And my dealings with Adorama have been top notch.

    But one question. I suppose I can look this up but this is quicker. Where do you find the actuations on the camera?
     
  71. The shutter count is listed in the exif data, a random exif-viewer (to find with google) reveals the info.
     
  72. Well, I downloaded the exif add on for Firefox and have examined a photo taken with my D600. In the data I don't see anything I can interpret as a shutter count. Is there an exif viewer that shows this or is there data on the Firefox add on that is coded somehow?
     
  73. Irfanview can read the shutter count from Nikons.
     
  74. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    While some of the info maybe older and out of date, for shutter actuation count, please see this thread from 2008: http://www.photo.net/nikon-camera-forum/00Nu42
    I am sure you can search for newer info also.
     
  75. Thanks Lex! I'd missed that..:) 'Total Pictures' under EXIF does sound a bit final!
     
  76. Wow! I just used Mike Halliwell's link and my D600 is a refurbished camera that I purchased a few months ago. The shutter count on it is 549!! I have probably taken most of those number in the time I have had the camera. Thanks for the info. This site is great.
     

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