Use no stop bath!

<p>My buddies at APUG might have a take on this subtle issue</p>

<p>Glenn, Happy Whatever to you, too!<br>

I don't use stop bath because my development time is usually above an hour and my developer's highly dilute (stand processed Rodinal 1+100) ... I rinse at developer temp before fix at developer temp.</p>

<p>Certainly, with a tank processing line (as opposed to 500cc Nikor tank/reel), I'd use a stop.</p>

<p>I lurve vinegar but prefer it balsamic, with olive oil.</p>

<p>I have not developed a film for some years but please remember the critical factor is ensuring all liquids are at the same temperature. <br>

Too many of my previous friends would just slosh a stop bath medium into a measure of tap water with no attention to the temperature or strength of dilution. But even then, I would very much doubt if this would lead to a change in grain but would most probably lead to reticulation which is often mistaken for grain if it occurs in a minute strength and which can also be repeated if you rinse in running tap water immediately after the developer bath.<br>

Always use a stop bath but ensure it is not in an aggressive strength, check your temperatures and ensure your procedures are repeated identically and your results should be fine.</p>

<p>JohnL</p>

<p>At one time the use of an acid stop bath was thought to cause pinholes on the negative. With modern film this is never a problem. The stop bath is a good idea in order to preserve the life of the fixer.</p>

<p>I don't use acid stop with EFKE and ADOX films for this reason. they are real old school films but look great in Rodinal. I got pinholes with some I used recently using acid stop.</p>

<p>If the specific question is whether there's a difference in grain between stop bath and water, I'd say, nope, not in my experience. Even with pushed film I've seen nothing to indicate an effect on grain. And I've never experienced the pinhole effect or other peculiarities in emulsions.</p>

<p>Years ago, as a reporter/photographer, I usually shot Tri-X at 800 and souped it in HC-110 dilution B, because it was quick. Sometimes I'd warm up the solution to speed things up to meet deadline. I always used a stop bath because timing is critical with short development times. Later, when not under deadline, I used a similar technique without the stop bath, just using water. No difference in grain.</p>

<p>Same with other combinations of films and developers. There may be a peculiar combination of a certain film and developer that might possibly react oddly to stop bath, but these are usually anecdotes based on individual experience rather than official statements from the manufacturers. (Which, incidentally, includes my own anecdotal observations, so don't take my word as absolute.)</p>

<p>The moral of this story is...... Do what works for you.</p>

<p>Use stop bath for more consistent results. And dilute it properly. Some people will mix too high a concentration of bath resulting in too high an acid concentration that will damage the emulsion. Dilute it properly and you will be fine.</p>

<p>There was a thread about the use of over use of water. I think thats what is the basic arguement here. If you don't stop your film you are using more water than you would if you stopped your film. I use stop. Saves me wasting fix which is water soluable. This could go on for years. Use what you think you need and MERRY CHRISTMAS</p>

<p>Pinholes with stopbath and Rodinal - interesting! Pinholes are supposed to be caused by the interaction between carbonates and acetic acid generating small carbon dioxide bubbles in the emulsion. Now Rodinal doesn't contain any carbonates, so, err, what's the explanation here? Could it be a case of manufacturing emulsion fault and coincidence?<br>

Personally, I have NEVER, in over 40 years of experience, seen any emulsion pinholes that could be put down to the use of a stop bath. Probably because the use of carbonate alkalis in any decent film developer ceased about 50 years ago. Also, any reasonably modern and scientifically formulated film developer (which Rodinal isn't BTW) has a buffered pH low enough not to cause any noticeable reaction with a properly made up stop bath.<br>

I don't think the continuation of development in a plain water rinse should be ignored completely. After all, this is the principle of one method of compensating development. I've noticed a definite increase in negative density whenever I've substituted a water wash for stop-bath. However, as long as your developing regime is consistent, I don't think that an acid stop bath is absolutely essential, but some sort of wash between developer and fixer is a must if you're going to re-use your fixer.</p>

 

<p>"Personally, I have NEVER, in over 40 years of experience, seen any emulsion pinholes that could be put down to the use of a stop bath. Probably because the use of carbonate alkalis in any decent film developer ceased about 50 years ago. Also, any reasonably modern and scientifically formulated film developer (which Rodinal isn't BTW) has a buffered pH low enough not to cause any noticeable reaction with a properly made up stop bath."<br>

Joe, try mixing up some D2D from The Darkroom Cookbook, use an acid stop bath. You'll see blisters, not just pinholes.<br>

The use of carbonate in a dev makes one undecent?<br>

Rodinal isn't scientifically formulated? How about Ansco 42? </p>