TonyW

Mask foreground to enhance colour, selective D&B, dodge to increase mist

I do agree that correcting the WB is the starting point. However, hjoseph also stated, " ...I tried everything, but every time I print it, it looks Yellowish. I'm wasting tons of paper that I can't afford right now ! I would like it looking warm, but not yellowish !... So, in my opinion just correcting WB alone would still not produce a pleasing print and therefore potentially waste even more costly paper and ink so I thought illustrating one possible edit may help the OP look a little further fully accepting that his and YMMV. 😀 I think we may have all missed an important question that we should have asked i.e. what tools does the OP have at his disposal to edit his JPEG?

Just looked at my post and realised I had not posted a web friendly image. So FWIW this is what I would have done with the colour including darkening background and lighten faces

There are many ways to do this e.g. Curves and masking. Probably the quickest/easiest way if you have a later version of Photoshop is to open the image in Camera Raw and use the Mask tool to select the subject; it should select all the kids then make your adjustments. In this instance I just increased exposure +0.50 and reduced colour temp -20, you may wish to adjust to your own preference. One thing about the mask selection is you would probably need to finesse the gap between the girls heads to remove a little of the mask spill onto the background

I think you hit it out of the park when you made these comments [quote]I'm wondering if what's unique to Frans's raw and green overlay is: Underexposure 3EV, “over develop” (push “Exposure” more than 1.3+) and other kind of wacky rendering edits....[/quote] I began searching for any underexposed images of my own. Slightly embarrassed to say I found one and managed to replicate the green overlay. Must make my excuses first I was checking out my new Fuji GFX and finding out what all the buttons did. During the course of my play I accidently fired off some shots this is one (for some reason I saved all the images including this one!!). This is massively underexposed at least 5+ stops. Rawdigger will not even attempt to render an RGB image it is that far out. Hope you can accept and believe I am not that bad a photographer 😇 Images probably self explanatory, so just a little detail: ACR images the top is the initial import into PSE version of ACR. Bottom image exposure slider to max at +5, still no sign of clipping to the red channel, so increased Sat,Vib,Clar to maximum giving me the required red clipping. PSE conversion top image Open into PSE image appeared OK until I applied the Haze correction; bingo, green overlay appears. Bottom image after Convert to Adobe RGB a normal looking image; well considering what we started with 😁

Thanks for the link Andrew to Michaels post about the colour spaces in PSE. Had to try myself and obviously found as per your link the choice you make in the File menu >Color settings: * No color management * Always optimize for computer screens [sRGB] * Always optimize for printing [Adobe RGB] * Allow me to choose The last three do not seem to work (always sRGB?) so this is a bug that is probably not going to be fixed any time soon, if ever. And the omission of choice from the ACR dialogue window is sad but again unlikely to change. Based on my admittedly limited experience with PSE my recommendation would be for users of the ACR implementation would be to make sure to edit in 16 bit and once brought into PSE that they remember to convert to Adobe RGB to ensure that as much of the cameras potential gamut is retained within the limitations imposed by Adobe RGB. If you are happy to stay within the limitations of sRGB then it does not really matter. Do you think that a sound recommendation? Good to see that Adobe has provided a workaround to the latest version of ACR for those that have issues.

Caveat, I am a complete noob to PSE and struggled as i did not and have not RTFM; so features were not where i expected them to be if even available. Nagging concerns about green overlay really bugged me and the fact that it vanishes once zoom exceeds 67% only to return when zoomed out again. I tried half a dozen of my own Neff images from D90 and D800e and whatever I did I could not repeat the green overlay effect. I did not try but wonder if the overlay would appear in a print; I suspect not. Another quick play with Frans raw file I noticed when I first saved the image showing green overlay it changed to sRGB and saved image shows no green once opened in PSE! So looked for a way to save a 16 Bit TiFF. Image>Mode only shows RGB & 8 bit options WTF!! Looked in Image>Convert Profile>Convert to Adobe RGB Profile. Aha! Voila! Eureka! once clicked on this the green overlay vanishes on screen and the saved TIFF is fine I have to say that I still do not know what to make of this particularly why only Frans raw displays this; admittedly with only few additional raw images tested. When exiting Canera Raw into PSE I could not find a way to change the profile which seems to be sRGB although 16 bit selected; I may have missed the obvious! In that case once the image appears in PSE if Image>Convert Profile>Convert to Adobe RGB selected then Haze removal applied there is no green overlay

Andrew that is very odd, with that amount of clipping in your image you would have thought that Haze removal would display a similar overlay to Frans raw. I will see if I can repeat what happens with Frans image with on of mine Did you see the green overlay vanish when image zoomed above 67%? What to make of that?

Andrew the images should be the raw. Anyway like you I see the red and the blue clipping warnings. I am on a PC and the version is PSE2023 ACR v 14.4. I probably did not explain correctly (too much of a hurry - sorry for any confusion caused!) in the prior post and actually it does not matter if you turn on or off clipping. First image shows Camera raw with Fran AZSunsetraw.Nef. I increased exposure by 1.3 and used Adobe standard profile. Highlight and shadow clipping showing When this is opened in PSE there is no highlight issue seen, until you select Enhance > Haze Removal, accept default and apply. After a short time of working the green highlights appear. Increase the zoom to 67% and above and the green vanishes.

Actually my earlier guess at what may have happened is incorrect. I could not explain the green so decided to download PSE to the good ladys PC. Seems PSE has a different way of working than expected when bringing images in from Camera Raw. It may be a feature that is documented somewhere within the Adobe archives, who knows? Anyway opening Frans raw file 16 bit in Camera Raw and turning on the clipping warning the clipped areas turn red. If the image is opened in PSE the green highlights appear where the red was - effectively showing OOG warning ! Turning the clipping warning off in Camera Raw and opening the image in PSE the green is gone (sounds like a Cillit Bang ad. (that may be understood by UK audience!)

Frans, as far as exposure for raw goes with your Z5 I believe that Nikon metering is calibrated to about 12.5% (at least for spot reading). If you take a spot reading of an important highlight area you should have about +3EV before you clip highlights in the raw file. Your raw file is less than optimal exposure so highlights are well contained as seen earlier with zero clipping of any channel. From all that we have seen thus far the attachment seems to be a likely candidate to explain what you experienced. Please ignore the difference in image colour and the difference in OOG/clipped warning. While our ACR versions are different the engines will be the same with some omissions for the Lite version in PSE: 1. Your posted image illustrating the green highlights is I believe likely to be a crop from the Camera Raw dialogue in PSE (in my version the clipping warning is red of course) 2. You have set Camera Raw to output your files as sRGB 3. You have the clipping warnings on when you made the screen capture 4. Unknown which Camera profile you picked, either one of the Adobe or a Camera Matching one. In any case you will find that the clipping changes depending on the camera profile chosen. 5. I suspect as the raw image was presented too dark that you increased the exposure slider and possibly changed other parameters before altering the Dehaze slider. All these changes will affect the look of the image and the amount of clipping shown 6. If you deselect the clipping warning highlighted in the attached GIF when you have your 16 bit image then the green highlights should disappear.

Yes, that looks the most likely candidate so far to explain the green/red highlight issue. Good catch John 👍 So Frans did you make a screen shot of the Camera Raw screen and just crop to the image area leaving out the surrounding dialogue box?

This old fellow is going to get some rest as it is past curfew but will check back tomorrow 😴

You are not looking at raw data in ACR. What you are seeing is a rendering of your image data with varying adjustments including exposure changes including baseline compensation and camera profile preset adjustments to make the initial image look good as a starting point. The net result of these adjustments can look like you have clipped channels when in fact you may have less than optimal exposure in the raw file, this may be as much as 1.5 stops less than optimal. The Rawdigger histogram shows an accurate view of your raw image data without any additional rendering

As Andrew has already said the raw file is not really of use in this case other than to confirm that there is nothing of concern with the capture. There is no sign of any channel clipping as can be seen in the histogram attached; in fact another stop or so would still be within an acceptable exposure range. I cannot repeat your green highlights even taking Dehaze to maximum and adding saturation and vibrance in ACR How is your monitor profiled i.e. do you use a calibration device and make sure that Windows is actually using the ICC profile you made? Please follow Andrews request for images

Yes PM sent with email address

It will be interesting to see your original file when you upload to dropbox for us to look at

Then please post as requested a native image file in 16 bit and answer the question what RGB numbers do you get when you mouse over the green areas in you 16 bit image

What you have shown with your images is pretty much what you would expect with having the OOG overlay turned on. Attached same image with OOG on in 16 bit and 8 bit JPEG note the lack of green in the 8 bit JPEG Frans you are not helping us to help you here when you do not supply what is asked here and in the other forum. I asked on the other forum (as did digitaldog) before knowing what your image looked like [quote]If the highlight areas are meant to appear neutral what RGB numbers do you get when you mouse over one of the areas editing in 16bit and similarly in 8 bit? Have you tried printing one of the green highlight images to see if the patches appear?[/quote]So obviously in this case highlights are not neutral however if you did mouse over the values would change showing huge move to green if this was an image data issue between 8 and 16 bit. Remaining the same could be a Display issue, profile issue etc. Similarly if you did print and no green highlights further proves not an image data issue or PSE issue

Indeed 😉 What happens when you press the following keys at the same time Shift+Ctrl+Y