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It is still your photograph. I work with a very talented makeup artist. The models I choose are also very talented. However, the creation of the image doesn't end after the makeup is applied and the pose struck. In fact, most of the work occurs later either in the darkroom or in Photoshop.

 

If you simply make a snapshot of someone else's work, that's a different story though....

I love the Rubens suggestion! I'm planning on shooting a model who much bigger than average (in height also). Look for smooth surfaces for tonality....your shots should be incredible.

 

If it were me, I'd just shoot a LOT of film (or cards), trying to get a feel for the best angles. Watch the light also, I'd imagine that as the sun gets higher, it might not do good things for her....

Aaron, I've on occasion been threatened while shooting, usually by a mentally unbalanced individual. Not much you can do about that. As far as needing a form or permission, only if you intend to use the image commercially. For documentary purposes, you don't need it (although some newspapers require name and the like, in fact all newspapers I think).

Finally have time to post the resolution for the moment. I ended up working my way up the management chain, about mid way. At each step, I was told that there was no policy, law, or anything else banning photography. The final resolution is that I now have the name and number (both office and cellular) of a fairly high muckety muck who will speak with the driver when this happens again. He found the behavior of the driver completely unacceptable, BUT has limited ability to discipline the guy, the entire route (bus and all) are subcontracted (again, convenient way of limiting liability), and I'm not allowed to speak with anyone at the subcontractor ;-).

 

Hopefully I've made enough noise to get some communication going between RTD and the subcontractor ;-).

I don't think it is naive to assume that a published, award winning photog who has worked as a journalist off and on would be able to do street photography without being threatened by peons (I still am not comfortable on the 30, the drivers threats would be fine if I didn't have a bag of gear).

 

What is really troubling and upsetting is that I've shot in countries under Martial Law, I've shot in countries before and after coups. I've probably got some old film with Taiwanese military compounds (let alone the time I wandered inadvertently onto a military base in Taiwan with a model, the MPs were VERY kind in pointing out roughly where the boundary was). I've NEVER had ANY trouble, and was shooting in Thailand when a train was blown up (relatively common).

 

The only place in 30 years of photography, both professional AND for the fun of it, I've only had trouble in the U.S.. An aside, I've hung and sold nudes in numerous countries, and ONLY had them pulled from galleries in the U.S......just really bizarre.

 

Having BEEN a bit of a cowboy photog and rarely even knowing where to get permission in other countries (the U.S. is foreign to me, I've spent 1/3 of my life elsewhere), it really strikes me as bizarre that I need to ask for permission to exercise my first amendment rights in the country where I was born. But. The reality is that I do have to ask, and even then it probably won't mean much. My question is when "they" will start demanding my camera illegally, and I'll have to apply for permits to get it back. Sliperry slope idea.

 

BTW, the day after this I had some figure studies removed from a gallery because some busy body had complained of the "pornographic images." So. My tenure here may be simply to the point that my kids get through college, so the probability is that I'll take that RTD press credential, to hell with the larger implications, and simply bail in 9 years ;-).

 

Oh, and personally, I'm lovin' the side conversations, and again, I really appreciate being taken to task on my historical missteps :-).

Fascinating analysis, I could agree to some extent if this were a private bus company, but its the public transportation system, so...ermm...I'm warily skeptical.

 

No flash, not on the street. My entire purpose is to document people as they are, not to draw attention to myself. I was probably 20-30 feet away from the person being photographed, and the angle was such that the three people in the frame weren't aware that the photograph had been taken. I've been doing this a long time (which is part of my point, no problems in areas where terrorist acts regularly occur, the only place where I've had trouble is in the nation that purports to be the bastion of freedom, grrrr)...in any case, been doing this a long time, and 7 of 10 shots the subject doesn't know he/she/they is/are being photographed.

Yeah, actually, as someone who works downtown and commutes by bus/train, I'm used to the crew in the back. Have some photos of them, they are part of what I'm working on. I deal with the public 7 days a week (both in this project, and in the job that is allowing me to shoot it). This particular driver needs to find a new line of work.

 

I'm tempted to take the easy path and simply do what you suggest, get the press credentials. But. The realty is that I don't legally NEED them, and by accepting them I worry that I'm rubber stamping the de-facto ban on photography. In all honesty, I've had some good interactions with the security officers. In some ways I see their point. Security. But, no laws have changed since 2002, what they are doing was illegal then, is illegal now. I actually suspect that I WILL take the credentials (I'm a wuss, I'm 40, I have too much to get done before I kick the bucket, and maybe civil rights and the constitution isn't on that agenda...yet...many more instances like this and I may well take that up as a hobby).

 

The strange thing, I've spent over a decade shooting abroad, sometimes in nations under martial law...Thai insurgents blew up a train the last time I was there, yet I've NEVER been questioned anywhere in the world, only in the U.S.. Reminds me of the paranoia over The Russians Are Coming! during the cold war....sorta has some overtones of what people were trying to do with The House Unamerican Activities Committee

I'm not sure what to do about this, but I've been working on a project of

photographs from and on and around the busses and light rail in Denver. The

first incident involved me photographing Northern Pacific engines waiting to be

refurbished at the NP yard, I happened to be close to a light rail line and, in

fact, got a rather unusual photo of two light rail trains in the station at the

same time (rare, usually only one shows up at a time). In the first, rather

minor incident, a couple of RTD security officers asked to see my ID. Knowing

that they had no right to even ASK, I also realized that arguing with them would

allow the light to get away, so I handed them the ID and a business card with an

"Well, even though you have no right to this, here. I have work to do." They

then proceeded to watch me taking pictures (no big deal, its a free

country....or so I thought).

 

Incident #2 happened about an hour ago. I was taking my usual bus home, saw an

interesting ad above an interesting passenger and shot it. At the next stop the

bus driver said "Did you know it is illegal to take photographs on busses?" To

which I replied "Nonsense." He refused to leave the stop until I got off the bus

and said "Come up here and we can *discuss* this *further*" in a very

threatening manner. I refused, so he sat at the stop. This was irritating the

gang bangers at the back of the bus, and I realized that if I DIDN'T get off the

bus, I'd have more trouble than a 40 year old photographer wanted to deal with.

So I got off the bus.

 

In the mean time, I was contacting RTD to see if they even had a POLICY on on

photography. They didn't As I was talking with the person, an RTD security car

(unmarked) screached in front of me and ordered me to hang up the phone. At that

point, the RTD rep on the line hung up on ME. They admitted that there is not

only no law, but not even a policy. It is my understanding that a public

transportation company can't HAVE a policy that would prohibit photography.

Toward the end of the conversation, I was also told "There really isn't anything

that we can do about it anyway because we've leased the bus to a sub-contractor

and the driver isn't an RTD employee." (Convenient, eh?).

 

So, I was ejected from a bus for doing nothing illegal, had RTD security again

demand ID (I refused, but gave them a business card and told them to look it

up). Anything I can do? Anyone else have a similar experience? Do I give up my

First Amendment rights in the interest of ?????. Do I give up my Fourth

Amendment rights and refuse to give ID or a business card unless under arrest?

Any ideas? I have months in to this project....

Interesting comments on the TLR or waist level viewfinder, quite true in my experience. I tend to have more trouble when shooting my 35mm SLR than when shooting a medium format with waist level viewfinder (but opt usually for the autofocus of the SLR).

 

I do get quite anxious when shooting on the street and on public transportation. I've been verbally assaulted and chased on many occasions, but the way I work is probably more conducive to negative reactions (the longest lens I use is 50mm on a 35mm body).

 

The reality is that my choice of subject matter tends to dislike being photographed, so its part of the game (just means that I think three times before raising viewfinder to eye and squeezing shutter release).

Now that I've crawled off the floor after riotous laughter, thanks so much for the responses. I'm going back a few decades and will use D76 as the developer and the first 10 shot test is exactly what I'm looking for.

 

Wouldn't be concerned at all if this were an older emulaion, finished my last roll of 120 technical pan a year ago and if I recall, it had expired in the late 90s. However, I've only shot a few rolls of modern emulaions so don't exactly know what to expect, he he. The source is Wolf Camera in downtown Denver (16th and California). I think there are a few more rolls there and they DO ship :-).

Hi, I just bought 200 feet of TMax that expired 2/2007 and have the opportunity

to buy another 400 feet for $20 per 100' roll. I'm figuring that it should age

about the same as older emulsions, but it is occurring to me that I ought to get

some input since I haven't had much experience with this film (I've shot HP5 in

35mm for years, and recently shot a few rolls of TMY and really liked the

results at 800ASA).

 

Any particular problems that you think I may run in to when processing expired

TMax 400? I tend to shoot it at 800, but sometimes shoot 400 or 1600....

Read quite a few of these, interesting thoughts. But. The reality is that for some photographers, their pictures need to tell stories. For others, the story isn't important. Depends on the photog and what he/she is trying to accomplish. There isn't a way to definitively answer this question for each and every photographer.