jerry_pfile3

James,

The stopped silver lenses in the 70's, came back with them in the 80's (albeit with a $100 premium), then dropped the premium in the 90's.

The best answer is "Who knows?". My suspicion is they'll repeat the above cycle when they discover they may be losing sales. Although the premium may never go away if the market will sustain it. I'm glad I have all the lenses in silver chrome that I want.

Jerry

I beleive Carl is correct in that the device is used for the 50mm Summicron. (Older versions with the notches in the aperature selector ring.)

One removes the optical portion from its mount, then slides it over the lens end. The lens is then placed into another focusing mount for use on an enlarger or Focuslide. Don't know the ID of the focus mount.

Jerry

Also remember to set the lens to infinity when you mount it on the later Ms (M6 and on). After it's locked on, then you have the full range of focus w/no problems.

Wonderful lens BTW.

Jerry

John,

Probably not if he has to remove his shirt to use it! [:>))

Jerry

Remember Leica is a small outfit, and I'm sure each one is both handmade and inspected to a fare the well.

Canon and the like probably produce more cameras by sundown the first production day of the year then Leica does by the time the next year rolls around.

Don't think you'll ever see them arriving at dealers by the pallet load.

Jerry

Strange!

I had this problem for the first time this AM shooting one of my Grand Daughters soccer games.

Details were: Had shot about 5 frames (all on auto), then left the camera on during halftime. At the resumption of action was depressing shutter button when I saw the ASA light up. The only other thing that may be of relavence was that it was cold, about 40 F, with a 25+ MPH wind.

Resolution-Turned camera off/on and then all fine. Hence my concern with your post.

I think I'm going to dig up my IB.

Best,

Jerry

Yes-Get the M7.

Jerry

I too used to think that for a 'professional'camera, one would think the ratio of lenses to cameras would be greater.

However, all the P&S Leica cameras, along those Leica digitals manufactured by others, also fall into that 3,000,000+ body serial range.

In other words, that total includes a lot of cameras which had an lens that couldn't be removed from the camera. (and had a lens w/no serial)

How many of them were there? Dunno, but removing those bodies from the total would surely make the LTM/M, lens to body ratio climb quite a bit.

Best,

Jerry

In the short run, M8 sales will prove a saviour for the imaging side of Leica AG.

However in the 4-5 years or so it will take them to develope a FF M8.2 or whatever, the price of M8s will drop drastically, expressed as a % of their new purchase price. Much more so than have their film Ms have in the past, or the future. That is the pace of the digital world.

Don't know what the Bill of Materials looks like for the M8, but suspect the RF is still the most costly part (and it is a new one). Add to that the sensor, and the LCD screen which are new parts to any M (the purchaser always bought his own film before), and then the price is not surprising. Don't forget they have to amoratize some completely new tooling also.

To the central question of why are any Ms so expensive? Because they are crafted and assembled in a country where skilled (very) labor combined with a social system make it so.

Best,

Jerry

As I recall, Leitz discontinued chrome lenses back in the 70's, then reintroduced them in th late 80's with a $100 or so premium, then dropped the premium in the 90's.

I suspect they'll be back. There is the market for them.

Jerry

Should Leica also get into developing and printing too? Or just make film for the white glove crowd to fondle?

Perhaps Kodak will make them a "ball knocking deal" on Kodachrome 25.

Jerry

Your post reminds me of some info on a phamplet I got from Tamarkin re: their pedd;ing of the M8 last weekend.

Among other things, if I order the body from them, for an additional $99 I can get their 'kit', which includes a sensor cleaning pack.

Also, should I buy a new lens (coded) with the body, they'll throw in an additional lens coding for free. Seems that coding is NOT by Leica, but by a third party.

Given the cleaning kit, must presume that the sensor can be cleaned at home.

However, the ability to clean it also presumes it will/can get dirty in use. Hummm

Jerry

The M9 will come around, although perhaps badged the M8 v 1.x as someone else noted.

When they can figure out firmware/software to allow non-vignetted images with a FF sensor to allow current and future lens to provide proper images. Five to siz years I imaginine.

After all, the apparant purpose of the 6 binary codes on lenses is to combat this now. When it happens around 12-13 megapixels I would suspect.

Best,

Jerry

Lucien,

While not supported with a set of framelines, I imagine you'll be able to use the edges of the visible frame to approximate the full FOV using a 21. Although it would be unweildy I suspect.

Mounting a aux finder of 28 mm should do the trick though.

Ulf,

Focusing accuracy is based upon the relationship of the RF baseline length and VF magnification. As neither will change, and a 135mm will be the equivelent of 180mm given a crop factor of 1.33, that would be tough.

Imagine focusing a 180, even on a M3. Remember that you focus using the RF patch, not the full frame in the VF.

Best,

Jerry

Bill is correct that Leica will sell you some things.

Tried to get an engraved siver top cover for my M7, configured for and including the old style rewind knob, along with the older wind lever.

They'll sell you all of the above except the engraved top cover.

Gotta protect ala-carte I guess.

Jerry

OOPs!

Forgot to mention that feel there will be one more finder difference.

Given that there will assuredly more info to be presented given the digital nature of the M8, they'll make the eyepiece lens larger in diameter (if not the front glass also) to accomodate it.

Somewhat like Nikon did almost 3 decades ago with their F3HP.

Jerry

Dave,

Nothing more than suspicion, but.....

I suspect the finder magification will be the current 0.72. No reason to make a new finder.

However the finder masks, which yield the framelines after all, will reflect the FOV when any lens from 24 through 90 is mounted on the M8, given the 1.33 crop factor.

So say the 24 is mounted on the M8, the frame lines will deliniate those of actually a 32mm lens were one available and mounted on the film Ms from M4 on w/ a 0.72 mag finder. (1.33 x 24 = 32)

And so on up to the max of 90mm, which will be an equivelent FOV of 120 on a film M.

That would give 3 settings which to activate a FOV with 2 pairs of lines each. As we have now for the film Ms. As with using the finders edges with the 24 on a film M, now those same edges can be used to approximate the FOV with a 21 mounted.

The only difference will be in how the frame masks are cut.

Best,

Jerry

I had the opportunity to use my Uncles' 1.2 back in the 80's. I thought it was a fine lens (but really heavy).

That said, I probably never used at more than f/8 but that's not the range it was made for. From 1.2 to 5.6 it performed as one would expect, but wasn't as good as my 50DR from 2.0 through 5.6.

I wouldn't mind having one today though. Would probably make my heirs happy.

Jerry

If you bought it new and it's less than 3 years old, your PassPort should cover it.

Jerry

Yes Kelly he did.

Marc did yeoman effort in creating an album for my Wife, made up of Kodacolor MF negs shot by a pro, and Kodachrome II slides shot by Uncle at our '64 wedding. (Not OT, Uncle Bill used an M3 w/35 and 50 Summicrons)

I was amazed both at what Marc had to do, and was able to accomplish w/PS, to recover the images on the Kodacolor MF.

As you may suspect, the KII images were as clear and bright as they were in '64. Should be in the archives somewhere, around the Spring of '04.

Well, opinions are free so here goes:

Sales of the M8 for the first 18 mo/2 years will be limited by their production capacity only. As they say here in the auto industry in Detroit, "We'll sell everyone we can paint." What that number will be is anyones guess. The camera will probably take a lesser time to assmble than the current Ms, and many of the components come from their supply chain, which doubtless has improved. I think 10,000 per year is on the low side. After all, that only 40 per day.

There are goodly number of collectors out there, the "white glove" crowd, who will buy one of every model and simply put it on the shelf. Been that way for decades now. When they do part with them, rarely is it on that auction site. How many? Only Leica knows, but the line of their commemoratives is probably a good place to start.

The only "new" customers they'll probably pick up are the PJs, who have shyed away from Leica and the M's, simply because they have been film based, and therefore too slow in this instant reportage world. They know the quality, but the slow speed of film has held them back. After all, they have to put bread on the table with their work. I suspect Leica wants them badly.

The balance will be purchased by the same collection of customers that have kept them alive to date. The serious amatuer, and the well heeled shooter who has to have the best, or whatever his neighbors perceive to be the best.

I suspect they'll also continue the film Ms. Film will be around for at least as long as anyone is who looks in or contributes to this or any RF forum. Albeit probably increasing in price quicker than inflation.

If anything fades away, I suspect it will be the ala cart program. Regular film Ms (MP/M7) will be in the catalog for a good while. I don't think their history will allow anything else. But I think the number of camera shops where you can go down to and fondle one will continue to dwindle. Nothing surprising there. If I want to handle one, I have to go to Big Georges in Ann Arbor, where I can also buy washers, dryers, and vacuum sweepers to.

In 2/3 years, there will be an M9 (or M8-2, etc.) with a bigger, and/or better sensor. That's the digital world as compared with that of analog. (Still using your 10 year old PC?)

In summary, I don't think the M8 signals the end of an era, rather the beginning of another branch on the tree.

Best,

Jerry

And whereabouts may this sighting have been John?

Jerry

I've never been into all that "chart stuff" that many hang their hat on, and in the interest of honesty have never shot with the 21mm ASPH or the 28mm Summicron.

I can attest however, that the 24mm ASPH is amazing in the way it handles distortion for a 24mm lens.

After the 50mm DR I think it is the best shooting RF lens Leitz/Leica has ever made.

Just an opinion of course, but don't see anything out there to change my mind.

Best,

Jerry

A joke?

Not really; They work and I still use them at f5.6 on my M2 and M3. Can't recall ever using them at F16 though. In fact, can't recall the last time I ever shot anything at f16.

Probably abandoned to save a buck or two. Wish they had them on the M7.

Jerry

Jerry,

Like Keith said.

Get the D2.

Get Elements 4.0. Got mine for $49 sealed on the net. (Then download the Adobe fix for RAW in Elements, don't bother with the stuff Leica packs w/the D2)

Spend $500 or so and get a new PC.

Keep the $2,500 or so you won't spend. You'll love the D2.

A DMR/R8 would be the equivelant of taking a cannon on a squirrel hunt if I read your digital photograpic asperations correctly.

Jerry