Best substitute for NPZ: Press 800 ???

[bernhard]

I was asked to take pictures of a rock band on stage next saturday and

without much thinking decided to use NPZ (35mm). I thought I just have

to walk to any of the pro stores around and get some rolls, but after

trying several pro stores in the area and finally <B>calling Fuji

Germany, I found out, that NPZ is not available in 35mm in Germany

(only 120) !!!.</B>

<br>

<br>

So I'm trying to find out what would be the best substitute for a

situation with rather high contrast, where I really need the speed and

of course want to keep grain to a minimum.<br>

<br>Back in the US I only used NPZ in those situations, so I haven't

tried anything else in that speed category and nee some advice what

film would be the best alternative, with emphasis on speed 800+ and

low contrast. I think I really don't want to use higher contrast

Superia 800 or Max 800 and will probably have a hardtime getting some

rolls 'til saturday, so I wont be able to run tests.<br><br>

 

Thanks for your advice.

[phule]

If not Fuji Press 800 I know I've seen Konica Centuria 800 mentioned in a couple threads. I've not had the chance to try this film out though so perhaps others that are more familiar with it will speak to its behavior.

[david_bolduc]

How about using the Fujipress 800 if you can get it. I recently shot a Bull Riding competition indoors with NPZ 800 and Press 800, and both turned out equally good.

[phule]

Nevermind on the Konica. It's a consumer film (I didn't realize). If you were to dip down into the consumer film market you might as well use Superia X-Tra 800.

[lex_jenkins]

Here are a couple of examples of Superia Xtra 800 from a War concert.<div></div>

[lex_jenkins]

And another - a tiny Brazilian babe shakin' it onstage during the War concert...

 

Wish I could find my scans from a Shana Morrison (daughter of Van) show. There were fewer lights aimed toward the audience so flare was less of a problem. Those shots looked better overall.

 

Anyway, Superia Xtra 800 ain't bad if you can't find anything else.<div></div>

[gary_watson]

As much as I like NPZ, I've never been let down by Superia 800(CZ). Although its contrast and saturation are maginally higher, Superia 800 is a remarkably versatile fast film that handles mixed lighting well.I'd not waste the extra money on Press 800 which is essentially the same film.Try to avoid underexposure.

[bernhard]

Lex,

Those Superia 800 pics seem to have a lot of contrast, more than I think I would like to have, but if I don't find anything else ...

 

Thanks for your help so far.

[dfdncithekxlbn8kaglf33]

CZ, its press- and Supreia-named variants, is a good film. The colors block up a bit, but in a nice way. I have pushed it to 3200 and got results that were not surpising. It is not as nice as NPZ or NHG, but it is very good and dead cheap. I might be inclined to Try the Portra 800, but not having used it and the price would be a big factor in doing an expirement like that...

[gary_watson]

With respect, Bernhard, the sort of stage lighting caught in Lex's shots is "high contrast," so I'm not certain Superia 800 had much to do with the "look" you find displeasing.

[bernhard]

"With respect, Bernhard, the sort of stage lighting caught in Lex's shots is "high contrast," so I'm not certain Superia 800 had much to do with the "look" you find displeasing."

 

Of course that was a high contrast situation and that's the situation I will have to deal with, that's precisely the reason, why I would like to use a lower contrast film, especially as this is only my second serious attempt at that subject matter and I'd like to have some exposure leeway, especially as I might have to do a 1 stop push.

 

And I never said I found the shots displeasing, I apologize if I sounded that way. I just try to avoid blown out highlights. As I never used Superia 800 I really shouldn't have a prejudiced opnion about it, but I used Superia 400 once and there was a hell of a difference to NPH and NPZ and that's why I'm not too thrilled to work with this material.

[bernhard]

Guys, you can watch me eating humble pie now:

 

Just came home from work and carefully looking at the pics again at my monitor at home the highlights don't look as blown out anymore and after looking at it in PhotoShop there seems to be reasonable detail in the highlights. So maybe Superia 800 would do the trick.

[gary_watson]

Not a problem, Bernhard. I've come to appreciate Superia 800 greatly over the past 2 years. For clubs, concerts, indoor sports and social events, it works nicely when paired up with fast lenses.Rated at ISO 500-640, it looks better to me than Superia 400--which I agree is pretty bad. Superia 200,like 800, also lacks the pumped-up contrast and saturation characteristic of most consumer-grade print films.

[lex_jenkins]

Yup, if you look at the slinky Brazilian dancer's white pants closely on a well calibrated monitor you can see highlight detail.

 

Again, I wish I could upload a few examples from the Shana Morrison concert, also taken using Superia Xtra 800 @ EI 800. No back lighting, no problems with flare so the pix looked great overall. I just can't remember where I put those pix at the moment.

 

I'd prolly rather have NPZ but have used Superia Xtra 800 often enough to know what it's capable of. For example, I used it (along with Portra) for available light snapshots at a wedding. In some cases the skin tones of the Superia Xtra 800 shots looked better. More natural, less contrast.

[bernhard]

OK guys, there seems to be quite an agreement here that Superia 800 will be fine, so I'll go with this film. Thank you all for your help, I'll try to post some pics after I got them.

[scott_eaton]

I swear Press/Suepria 800 is lower in contrast than the nasty Superia 400.

 

My biggest problem with Superia 800 compared to NPZ is the lack of neutrality with the Superia film under daylight. When you start dealing with stage lighting and other wacko lighting conditions NPZ starts losing it's advantages. It's still the better film, but Superia 800 can do the job if given sufficient exposure.

 

Once again the assumption here is that negs films are flawed, and drugstore printing is perfect. That same role of Superia that looks perfect given Frontier processing/printing might look like crap on Agfa Type II or Kodak Edge paper. If I were doing dedicated film scans I'd have no issues grabbing some Superia/Press 800 because the contrast is more easily controlled vs making scans from the proofs.

[bernhard]

Scott: "Once again the assumption here is that negs films are flawed, and drugstore printing is perfect. That same role of Superia that looks perfect given Frontier processing/printing might look like crap on Agfa Type II or Kodak Edge paper."

 

Nope. The wrong assumption on my side was that Superia 400 and Superia 800 have similar characteristics. I shot NPZ and Superia 400 and got them printed on the same Frontier on Fuji CA. Superia 400 looked ridiculously contrasty and disneyish, while NPZ, despite chalky skin tones from this lab, just stomped Superia.

 

Obviuously Press 800 / Superia 800 is different and that's good to know as I shot te event last night using Press 800. I'll get my proofs from a Frontier and scan myself.

 

Thanks Scott :)

[igsman]

Check this out:

 

http://www.popphoto.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=389

[bernhard]

Hi thanks again to all of you. Fuji Press 800 turned out much better than I expected, proofs from a Pro Frontier Lab were very clean without much grain/noise. I just managed to upload a pic <a href=http://www.photo.net/photo/2370248&size=lg>

http://www.photo.net/photo/2370248&size=lg</a>, it's a heavy crop and not my favourite shot, but the one the client selected to have 5000 flyers printed.

[bill_tuthill]

Bernhard, can't you mail order 35mm NPZ from 7dayshop or equivalent?

A few months back I saw a thread about this, but can't Google it now.

[bernhard]

Yes I guess I could mail order NPZ from the channel islands or the dutch Calumet branch. The problem is that my local prolabs (Frontier w/ Crystal Archive) almost never see that film (as it is not available in 35mm in Germany) and did a less than stellar job printing two rolls I had left from the US. I talked to them and they see Press 800 very frequently and did a much better job with (pushed !) Press 800. So when I need proofs, I'll stick to Press 800.

But I'll put some NPZ in freezer for jobs where I'll scan only.

 

Shows again IMO that the whole imaging chain is important and that one weak link can more than offset the beneficial effects of a single component.