Mamiya Tlr 80 2.8 s

[januaryabc]

I have searched discussion online regarding the differences between the old black 80 2.8 and the newer 80 2.8 s. Everyone said they are optically the same for the taking lens with multicoated on S lens. Nevertheless I just discovered from a c330s manual and noted that it is described as having 4elements in 3groups rather than 5elements for the old one. Could someone who got the lens look into that and report their findings? 
 

[januaryabc]

[orsetto]

The above diagram is not accurate:  possibly ianbfoto re-composited their page from several sources and an error crept in. The only four element version of Mamiya 80mm TLR lens was the slower, rather uncommon f/3.7 (almost never seen anymore).

The 80mm S employs (in its lower "taking" lens barrel) the same 5 elements/3 groups formula as all previous variants of Mamiya 80mm f/2.8. Mamiya has never officially confirmed the 80 S has multicoating: that is popular conjecture based on the unique color of the S coatings, which may or may not be multicoating. The only confirmed radical change made to the final 'S' variant was cost-cutting of the upper viewing lens assembly: unlike all previous Mamiya TLR lens iterations, the upper viewing lens on the 80 S is a different, cheaper, incompatible design (quite possibly 4 elements) in a permanently fixed barrel that cannot be opened for easy cleaning (or to replace a damaged element of the lower taking lens).

You can verify the 5/3 construction of the 80mm S lens via the diagram and description on pages 31 and 32 of the (genuine unaltered) instruction manual for C330S camera that was introduced alongside the 80 S:

Edited January 6, 2023 by orsetto

[januaryabc]

The same 4 element 3 group description also appear in another c330s catalogue which looks like unaltered mamiya's original copy.

 

https://ianbfoto.com/downloads/Brochures/Mamiya C330S Brochure.pdf

The angle of view is a bit wider.

 

5 element description appear in older brochure, with angle of view a bit narrower.

https://ianbfoto.com/downloads/Brochures/Mamiya C330F-C220 Brochure.pdf

 

So it is interesting if mamiya did make some mistakes in those description.

Edited January 6, 2023 by januaryabc

[orsetto]

Hmmm... that is strange!  This printed discrepancy doesn't seem to have been discovered in other similar discussion threads over many years, perhaps because most Mamiya TLR enthusiasts tend to refer back to Graham Patterson's definitive archive as their source of info for any items they don't personally own. My original C330S manual, plus the PDF on the Butkus manual website, list the 80mm S as 5/3 construction. In any case, a 4 element 80mm f/2.8 would give noticeably poor performance at wider apertures (making it unlikely Mamiya would suddenly choose to downgrade the final version sold as standard equipment with their final, most expensive TLR).

I do happen to own a pair of of Mamiya C220F bodies (sister of C330S) along with all lenses except the 250mm. Among these are two 80mm S examples and one of the earlier black 80mm.  I just took a few cell phone snapshots of them next to each other. Second photo from the top shows older and S version front lens barrels unscrewed: you should be able to see they're identical (I can also confirm they are the same, having disassembled them both down to individual glass groups for cleaning).

Third photo down shows the rear barrels: I have not been able to unscrew my 80S rear barrels so can only show them affixed to the lens board.  I am quite sure they are the same cemented element pair internally, the 80S (on the right) looks taller only because its barrel lip extends further beyond the glass for extra protection (vs the earlier 80mm rear barrel which is nearly flush with the glass surface). Hope you find these pics helpful with your question.

 

Edited January 8, 2023 by orsetto
Typos