Help identifying camera

[ringop_parkjer]

<p>Hello guys,<br /><br />I am in kinda need of some help. A few weeks ago I found this camera at my grandma's house. I have no idea what it actually is. Took it to some photography shops, but none could tell me what it is. They looked and told me that the lentile looks in good condition and seems to work.<br /><br />Can you tell me what camera this is?<br /><br /><br /><a href="https://postimg.org/gallery/38ag0rpgw/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Postimage.org — free image hosting / image upload</a><br /><br />Thank you</p>

[Two23]

<p>I'll through out a guess as the ICA(?) precursor to the Zeiss Miroflex?</p>

<p>Kent in SD</p>

[thirteenthumbs]

<p>If the lens serial number was readable in any of the photos then I would be able to tell you the vintage of the lens which appears to be original to the camera.</p>

[Dustin McAmera]

<p>I believe it's an Ernemann Miniatur-Klapp Camera. The part on the top (which does look a bit like a folding hood) is in fact just a Newton finder (i.e. a simple negative lens), with two metal flaps covering it. This is used with a swivelling arm on the lens-board as the front 'sight'.<br /> The pictures I can find to compare it with all show different shutter controls though, with two knurled knobs, one of which is usually engraved for Ernemann. This one seems to be fitted with an earlier model of the shutter.<br /> Here's a good picture of one in the same size (4.5x6 cm plates, with the 7.5 cm lens): it has the other shutter, but the same shutter-speed table on the front. It's pretty small, isn't it?<br /> <a href="

[ringop_parkjer]

<p>The serial number on the lens is : 331130</p>

<p>Took it to a shop as I said and they told me that the lens are in perfect condition and they might be from 1925 or 1927. I am trying to figure out when it was made and if it is valuble because and put it in a safe place</p>

[thirteenthumbs]

<p>A Lens Collectors Vade Mecum has a list of serial numbers for Carl Zeiss Jenna lens.<br>

322,799-351,611 <strong>1919 </strong><br>

Camera lens may not be put into immediate use so the camera may not have been sold until the early 1920's but likely before 1925.</p>

[Dustin McAmera]

<p>If I got it right, here's the version with the later shutter, at <em>Camera-wiki</em>:<br>

http://camera-wiki.org/wiki/Ernemann_Klapp#Ernemann_Miniatur-Klapp_4.5x6<br>

CW gives 1920-25 for this version, but says an earlier version with a different shutter was made 1913-20. However, it says that early model has a top speed of 1/2500, which yours doesn't, according to that speed table.<br>

<em>Collection Appareils</em> shows one with your style of shutter controls, and says it appears in a catalogue dated 1922. The tech notes confirm the shutter speeds are up to 1/1000. So I'd go with 'early 1920s', as Charles says.<br>

<a href="http://www.collection-appareils.fr/x/html/camera-20220-Ernemann_Miniature%20Klapp.html">http://www.collection-appareils.fr/x/html/camera-20220-Ernemann_Miniature%20Klapp.html</a><br>

Here's one with your style of shutter controls, for sale at <em>Leica-Shop</em> (they're asking 280 Euro, with a lesser lens, and the shutter not working):<br>

http://www.leicashop.com/vintage_en/ernemann-miniature-klapp-sku21606-11.html<br>

It looks like your camera is missing a bright nickel-plated knob from the bottom of the shutter controls.</p>

[James G. Dainis]

According to <I>McLeown's Price Guide to Antique and Classic Cameras</I> that is the Ernemann Miniatur-Klapp made from 1913 to 1920. It is priced at $300 - $500 for good clean working examples. <P>

 

The later Ernemann Miniatur-Klapp made from 1920 to 1925 had two round knurled knobs on the side as in Pete Hobbis' first link given above

[ringop_parkjer]

<p>Thank you all very much. You helped me a lot with this.</p>

<p>I really wonder how my grandma got that. Maybe a family gift.</p>

[Dustin McAmera]

<p>.. and yet McKeown has the top speed of the early model as 1/2500, which we know this one doesn't have. I suspect reality is more complicated than just two models.</p>

[Two23]

<p>It's in rough shape. It would be cool to have it restored.</p>

<p>Kent in SD</p>