j_buck Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 hello.im looking into buying a studio flash with continuous light (that has different stops of the continuous light)and has a bowens mount. i already own bowes mount softboxes.i shoot mostly film and some of my film cameras dont have fast sync speed, so this is why i would need continuous light with different stops. im considering METTLE or BOWENS. it should be ca 500ws but possible to power it down so i could shoot also 2.4 hope this make sense :-)i would spend 250e for second hand. thanks alot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles_Webster Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 <blockquote> <p>i shoot mostly film and some of my film cameras dont have fast sync speed, so this is why i would need continuous light with different stops.</p> </blockquote> <p>I don't understand what you mean by this. The sync speed of your camera (often as low as 1/60 sec) has nothing to do with whether you can/should use strobes.<br> If you are thinking of the modeling lights built into most studio strobes, they usually aren't bright enough to shoot by unless you are using a high ISO film.<br> If you want continuous lights, you need to get dedicated continuous light fixtures and modifiers, and if they are hot lights your existing Bowens softboxes probably won't be suitable.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig_shearman1 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 <p>To start with, "studio flash" does not have continuous light. It's either a flash or it's continuous, not both. The modeling lamp is continuous but that's not intended for exposure, only viewing and focusing.<br> "i shoot mostly film and some of my film cameras dont have fast sync speed"<br /><br />If you're shooting in the studio, the sync speed on your camera is largely irrelevant. The exposure time of the picture is determined by the duration of the flash, not the shutter speed of the camera. <br /><br />High sync speeds are needed when shooting outside in the sun, where maybe the exposure might be f/22 at 1/250 and you're using flash fill. in that case, you need 1/250 as opposed to the 1/60 you might find on an older film camera. In the studio, there is no other significant source of light other than your flash, so just about any sync speed will do.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodeo_joe1 Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 <p>I'm not quite getting the need to shoot with continuous light either. In fact a low camera X-synch speed would rather dictate that you have <em>less</em> continuous ambient light, not more. The issue being that the longer the shutter is open, the more likely it is that any "stray" light will contaminate the colour quality of the flash. It's for this reason that many monolight heads kill the modelling light at the moment of flash exposure. Although this feature can usually be turned on or off.</p> <p>All-in-all, having an overly powerful modelling light isn't a good idea. Or is that what you were getting at in your post J B? I'm pretty sure that most Bowens heads have a proportional modelling light, but it may not follow the flash power exactly. A 150W modelling lamp turned down to 1/16th power would be barely brighter than a candle!</p> <p>Here's a quote from Bowens' Gemini 500 Pro specification: "Advanced modelling lamp control allows the usual full, proportional and off settings but also incorporates a 'soft-start' and 'lamp-saver' option to prolong the life of the bulb."</p> <p>It would seem to fit the bill, but the new price is well over twice your budget and used flash heads tend to fetch around half to 2/3rds of their retail price - unless they're really old or really well-used.</p> <p>Do you really need 500 Joules? F/2.4 doesn't need a lot of light and you'd probably be turning the wick way down to 1/8th power or less most of the time on a 500 W-s head. A less powerful head would be a bit cheaper, and there's not much you can do with just one light. The Bowens 200/200 kit is around the same price as one 500 head.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ellis_vener_photography Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Does the OP wants to be able to use the same lighting for stills and video? While there are high quality moonlights and pack and head flash systems with 150, 250, and even 300 watt Quartz- halogen (3200k) modeling lights , they all by necessity have cooling fans and because of the fan noise, unless he's planning on not recording sound at the time of the shoot they are not suitable to his use. If by " film" he means real film, then he's against a hard wall as well, with the exception of HMI and very powerful LED lights, both of which are extremely expensive, there are no constant (AKA hot lights) which are really bright enough for short shutter speed work, especially in his budget limits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_buck Posted June 9, 2015 Author Share Posted June 9, 2015 hey, yes was thinking analog film.. not video.. but i dont mind using 400 asa or 800 even. my mamiya can sync at any speed, but the pentax 67 only at 1/30 so this is why im searching for a solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doug_armstrong Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 <p>J, You will need to describe your problem more clearly if you want help with a solution. None of us can identify a problem in what you have said -- other than a possible lack of understanding of how studio flashes work and of studio lighting in general. You should start by saying exactly what you want to be able to do. For example,</p> <blockquote> <p>I'm want to be able to photograph cat-and-dog fights in my living room. I don't want too much blur. I don't currently own any artificial lights beyond two household end-table lamps with one 60 watt bulb in each.</p> </blockquote> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig_shearman1 Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 <p>"the pentax 67 only at 1/30"<br /><br />Thousands of photographers over the years have used the Pentax 67 in the studio with studio flash with millions of photos to show for it. The 1/30 max sync speed is only an issue if you try to shoot outside using fill flash as I noted earlier. </p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ellis_vener_photography Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Pentax made a leaf shutter Super Takumar ,a 165mm lens as I recall, for the Pentax 67 cameras for higher sync speeds. But it f you are trying to freeze motion and shooting in a studio , that's down to your flashes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelmowery Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 <p>Please describe in detail your shooting scenario for which you feel you need to shoot at a faster shutter speed. If you were shooting outdoors in sunlight we could understand your concern.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_buck Posted June 11, 2015 Author Share Posted June 11, 2015 <p>i work in studios since long time, mostly digitally but also with film (mamiya rb plus portra 160)<br /><br /><br />after i got the wonderful pentax 67 i wanted to use it also in the studio but with the modeling lights, so i was just wondering what the temperature of the bowens modelling light is.. and if the gemini has different stops of the modeling lights.<br /><br />and if it would go well with colour film :)</p> <p>thanks for all the answers.<br> ps. i have a good deal on a used bowens gemini 500r, what should i be aware when i test it?</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelmowery Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 <p>Starting your answer with "I work in studios since long time" Trying to give yourself credibility, then ignoring my question to you is quite irritating. <br> If your question was "what strobes have an adjusting modeling light?" then ask that question. Why you have to then confuse everyone about your sync limitations is beyond me. FYI the modeling light adjustments is not adjustable in stops. The modeling light comes in either tungsten for which you will need tungsten film or LED for which your daylight film will be fine but not perfect. The lab will have to color correct the films in any case.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_buck Posted June 11, 2015 Author Share Posted June 11, 2015 <p>thanks alot for the answer!<br> this was the answer i was searching for.<br> kind regards,<br> J.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig_shearman1 Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 <p>I think I'm hearing two different questions here:<br /><br />1) You want to use the Bowens strobes with the Pentax 67. You will be using the flash to expose the film but you are concerned that with the 1/30 sync speed that the light from the modeling lights will contribute to the exposure and cause a color temperature problem. If that's the case, you don't have anything to worry about. The modeling lights are generally too weak to contribute to the exposure. For the modeling light to matter, you would need to be wide open at mabye f/2 or 2.8 and 1/30. With a 500ws flash your aperture is likely to be more like f/8 or smaller, so the film will never "see" the modeling light.<br /><br />2) Or are you saying you will turn off the flash on the Bowens and use just the modeling light for exposure? Don't do that. The modeling light is simply far too weak. As noted above, you would need to be at f/2 probably for it to register and maybe down to 1/15 (depending on film speed) to get a correct exposure. And the modeling light is a tungsten, not daylight balanced.<br /><br />As for light output of modeling lights, most strobes give you three choices -- off, full and tracking. Under full, the modeling lights are at their full brightness. Under tracking, they are reduced in brightness to match the setting of the flash (half, one quarter, one eighth, etc.) The problem is that modeling lights aren't very bright to start with, so when you put them on tracking they often don't put out enough light to be useful in composing or focusing. And they certainly do not put out enough light to shoot by.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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