5dmk3 or 7D and 5dmk2

[dcstep]

<p ><a name="00b60u"></a><a href="../photodb/user?user_id=7150338">christina hoffner</a>, Dec 04, 2012; 10:36 p.m. asked:</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>How much is a used 500mm IS v1 or v2 going for I can't seem to find any online? I must be blind</p>

</blockquote>

<p>They sell as fast as they come on the market.</p>

<p>The Series I 500mm is around $6,000, based on two or three sales that I saw over at birdphotgraphers.net The street price of a new Series II is $10,500 to $11,000, I believe. I'll be selling my 500mm Series I in the $6,000 range, but only after I scrounge up the $7,000 additional dollars needed to buy the 600mm SII. ;-) That could be a while...</p>

 

[christina_hoffner]

<p>lol David Stephens you seem to be very against the 400 5.6. I guess I will need to be saving my pennies for a 500mm! As long as the 300mm f4 + 1.4 will be good enough I will be happy :)</p>

[dcstep]

<p>I guess that I'm very pro-IS. IS simply opens up so many possibilities that it's hard to imagine the usefulness until you've pushed the limits a few times. Your best shooting is at dawn and dusk and you want to keep the 7D's ISO at 800 or less for the best results, so IS comes into play more often than you might think.</p>

<p>Still, you're right, start saving for the 500mm. If you get sucked into serious bird photography, that lens will change your life.</p>

[christina_hoffner]

<p>Thanks again everyone for answering all my many many questions. It's greatly appreciated! I have a lot to think about. Would it hurt to get both the 5dmkIII and the 7D or should I stick with just one or the other. Overkill? I was contemplating to just keep my 50D and use that as my crop sensor because it didn't seem like much of an upgrade and also I was waiting for the 7dII. I also do take portraits of my kids and sometimes friends children as well just to bring in some cash. For some reason I had my heart set on the 400 5.6 but I think the 300 f4 + 1.4 should do just fine correct? I guess I am trying to instill it into my head. lol. </p>

[dcstep]

<p>I love my two-camera rig, with the 7D and the 5D MkIII, but the MkIII is my primary bird body.</p>

<p>If you go for two bodies, I'd suggest buying the 7D used, so you can get out of it at a low loss to move to the 7D2 when it comes out. When you experience the 5D3's AF system, it's going to be hard to go to the 7D's AF.</p>

<p>Which brings to mind the recent experience of a new friend that I met a few weeks ago, shooting northern harriers. When I met him, he had a 300/2.8 II, plus a 1.4X TC mounted on a 7D. He also had a 5D MkIII which he hadn't really used yet and was using it for landscape only. He saw me using my 5D MkIII as my main mount for my 500mm and asked why I wasn't using the 7D for that and I said something like, "The AF system is so superior that I'm willing to give up a little reach." The very next day he moved his 300mm over to the 5D3 and never went back to the 7D.</p>

<p>Just saying... I'm not trying to brings us back up to the top of the thread again, but my friend and I made the same decision when confronted with the 5D3 and the 7D in our hands and with lots of experience with the 7D. We can talk about pixel-density and relative reach all day long, but a key determinant of file quality is, is it in focus? With the 5D3, many more images will have super critical focus, such that when you look at the eye at 200% it's going to be crystal clear and shiny.</p>

<p>Maybe you should rent the two bodies for a week before making up your mind. You're serious about jumping in the deep end. I was willing to sit back and let you muddle around with the 7D (like I did) and learn to deal with its shortcomings because I thought that you were constrained a bit financially. Now you're talking about two bodies, which I do practice myself, and I'm thinking that I wouldn't have bought my 7D if I had experienced the 5D MkIII back then. (I owned the 5D MkII at the time and never, ever thought of making it my birding body). Either find a way to get both bodies in your hands for a trial or go for the 5D MkIII. IME, if you have both in your hands the 7D is going to come out in 2d place, despite its extra "reach."</p>

<p>BTW, I like high density pixels and plan to buy the 7D MkII when it comes out. In this birding game, you almost never have too much reach.</p>

[christina_hoffner]

<p>So David Stephens here is what I am thinking....Buy the 300mm f4 + 1.4 and the 5dMkIII. Use my 50D when I need more reach, and save up for the 500mm and the 7dMkII. What do you think? And with that being said should I bother with a monopod and gimbal head? I already have a gitzo tripod with a kirk ballhead. Really wanted the RRS ballhead though.</p>

[dcstep]

<p>If you've got the big Kirk, then the Wimberley Sidekick is hard to beat. The RRS ballhead is beautiful, but you'll still need a Sidekick or gimbal if you want to use a tripod. The ballhead is ok for slow moving animals, but there's no hope with BIF. However, with you 300mm you'll have no trouble hand holding. If you find yourself in dark circumstances a good bit, then a monopod will give you the extra steadiness needed most of the time, but I predict that you'll be hand holding 420mm at 1/60-sec. before you know it.</p>

<p>I like your camera plan, eventually getting to a top drawer, two-body system. Lots and lots of peole suffer along with "only" 400mm of reach. I can't imagine that the 7D MkII won't be out by fall of 2013 and maybe even earlier.</p>

[christina_hoffner]

<p>Yes I have the big Kirk BH-1. So which one should I go for the sidekick or the gimbal? I was thinking gimbal since I plan on upgrading my lens hopefully by late next year.</p>

[peter_j2]

<p>Induro GHBA Gimbal Head would be a less expensive but capable option over the Wimberley's. The load capacity according to the manufacturer is based on the strength of your tripod.</p>

<p>http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/655338-REG/Induro_485_000_GHBA_Gimbal_Head.html/c/product/#inpage:IN+STOCK</p>

[peter_j2]

<p>The price gets even lower with this Gimbal head:</p>

<p>http://www.camera-enthusiast.com/forums/threads/gimbal-head.3786/</p>

[christina_hoffner]

<p>Thank you for the links Peter J</p>

[dcstep]

<p>Peter, those both look good. Have you used one?</p>

<p>Still, a gimbal vs. a Sidekick means that you've got a lot more to carry if you ever want to switch to a ballhead. Also, Christina already has a good ballhead and she's Jonesing for a RRS!</p>

[christina_hoffner]

<p>Oh yes I am getting an RRS for sure. And I don't mind the weight too much. That's what my husband is for haha! Anyways does anyone think I should sell my 100-400 or should I keep it. I have never actually used it for birds. I have been using my 70-200mm tc 1.4iii. I wasn't sure if the 100-400 would do well for larger birds or not.</p>

[dcstep]

<p>Your hubby seems brilliant. I own and use the Arca-Swiss Z1 ballhead, but the decision was down to it and the RRS. It's a great piece (I've tried a friend's) and you can't go wrong at that level. If your going to get the RRS, then I really thing that the Sidekick is the way to go. The RRS's pano function is smooth as butter, so you'll have a absolutely wonderful rig for sitting in a blind or under a nest. The RRS without the Sidekick is also stunning as a landscape photographer's tool. Get a stout Arca-Swiss style plate for the bottom of your cameras.</p>

<p>If you can, keep your 100-400mm to see if you use it. I like the 70-200mm in a two-body rig, but the 100-400mm covers a lot of ground and isn't really too heavy to carry around your neck while lugging your 500mm as your main set up. You don't have to make all of these decisions in advance.</p>

[christina_hoffner]

<p>Thank you so much. You have all been such a huge help. I appreciate it so much! Hopefully this thread helps someone else out as well. Wow I was not expecting so many responses. And thank you David Stephens, you have been a big help and have been very patient answering my many questions. I can't wait to start saving for my 500mm. Hopefully it won't take horribly long. Thanks again. I love this forum :)</p>

[peter_j2]

<blockquote>

<p>Have you used one?</p>

</blockquote>

<p>No David. I will be getting a refund for my Jobu Black Widow Gimbal Pro tomorrow and will get the Induro GHBA Gimbal Head. The Induro is light and compact. No need to change from my FOBA Superball ballhead to the Jobu. I just slip the Induro onto the Arca Swiss clamp of the FOBA and will have a competent Gimbal Head in less than a minute. I will update here after testing the Induro in the next day or two.</p>

[dcstep]

<p>I'll look forward to your report Peter.</p>

<p>The only thing that worries me is that is says that it's good for lenses up to 300mm. That seems incredibly pessimistic. It looks sturdy in the picture, but that limitation worries me, since I'd want to use it with 500mm and 600mm.</p>

<p>Well, here's something, B&H says of the Wimberley, "Ideal for 300mm, 70-200mm, etc." then, down in the body of the description it says, "Ideal for 300mm f/2.8 or 500mm f/4.5 lenes". That tells us that the description is very old.</p>

<p>As I said, looking forward to your report...</p>

[peter_j2]

<p><a href="http://www.tripodhead.com/products/Instructions-SK-100.pdf">http://www.tripodhead.com/products/Instructions-SK-100.pdf</a><br /><br /><strong>David</strong>: You can use your 600mm lens provided that the centre line of the lens is directly over the bearing area of your ballheads panning base. If the line is outside of this area, the mass of the lens will introduce an eccentric load creating an unstable structure and the tripod will overturn with your lens and camera impacting with the ground. To correct that issue, the instructions for the Sidekick recommends a lower profile replacement lens foot with an integrated Arca Swiss mounting plate. Because of the law of statics, this recommendation would be universal to all gimbal heads not designed for the largest lens with a large spacing of the bottom of it's lens foot to the contact point of the lens barrel.</p>

<p>Alternatively, Wimberley metal shims or spacer blocks can be purchased and connected to the Sidekick to stablilize the assembly.</p>

[dcstep]

<p>Yes Peter, I'm curious to see if the new 600mm II will comply without a replacement foot.</p>

[peter_j2]

<p>Balanced on the on the side mount Induro GHBA Gimbal Head with QR plate (Arca Swiss style), FOBA Superball Balla ballhead and Manfrotto Carbon One 441 tripod is the:<br /><br />-Canon EOS 5D Mark III<br />-Canon BG-E11 Battery Grip<br />-KIRK Enterprises BL-5DIIIG L-Bracket<br />-Canon Extender EF 1.4X II<br />-Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS USM with LensCoat Cover<br />-Hejnar Photo H-107 Arca Swiss Style Lens Plate<br /><br />With the exception of the style of knobs, the Benro GH-A is identical.<br>

<br /> http://www.amazon.com/Benro-BE2190-GHA-Gimbal-Head/dp/B004LB45K0<br>

<br /> The Induro and FOBA works as designed and is all that I will need in a gimbal head for now.</p>

[peter_j2]

<p>Sorry, here is the photo:</p>

<p> </p><div></div>

[peter_j2]

<p>Here is a photo of a Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II USM with Hejnar Photo H-106-1 Arca Swiss Style Lens Plate balanced on the Induro GHBA Gimbal Head.</p><div></div>

[dcstep]

<p>NIce rig, but I'd recommend hand holding that lens every chance that you get. Even parked under a nest I'd tend to hand hold a lens that small and light.</p>

[peter_j2]

<p>I always hand hold the 70-200/2.8. It was placed on the Induro for demonstration only. Notice the arm of the gimbal is on the left. If placed on the right, there wouldn't be enough clearance to the hand grip for my fingers.</p>

[dcstep]

<p>I'll try to remember to take a picture of my Sidekick/Arca-Swiss rig with the 500mm attached with the stock foot and a Wimberley plate. I mount mine on the left also.</p>