Wein Cells suddenly acting up

[kyle_madison]

<p>I had been using Wein Cell batteries in my Pen FT, Yashica Mat-124, and Canonet QL17 GIII for a year with pretty much spot on results in their meters. Suddenly (possibly post hoc observation) after the new versions of the battery come out with the extra nib I'm getting results that are about 3 stops over exposed. I tested the battery with a multmeter and it's returning 1.26v, which is slightly lower than the advertised 1.35. Anyone know what the problem is here? It's got the be the battery, right? All three cameras can't be crapping out at the same time in the same way. Anyone else having this problem with the Wein cells? Thanks!</p>

[lex_jenkins]

<p>Several years ago I tried Wein cell replacements for the defunct 625 mercury button cells. The first one I bought was dead on arrival. I returned it to the battery supplier. We tested several Wein cells - all were dead. They sat on the shelf too long.</p>

<p>It's just a zinc air battery, with a collar to match the original 625 thickness and diameter. You can buy them cheaply and <em>fresh</em> at any drug store. Get the 675 zinc air button cells in a pack of half a dozen or more. The characteristics are close enough to the mercury cell to ensure accurate metering.</p>

<p>Don't worry about the smaller button size - the spring pressure in most battery compartments will make adequate contact. I've used the 675 zinc air hearing aid batteries in Canonet GIII QL17, Canonet 28, Canon TX and FTbn, Olympus OM-1 and others, all without any modification, shims, spacers or other doodads.</p>

<p>Figure out replacing the zinc air cells every 2-6 months, depending on the camera, usage and climate. Some users claim taping over most of the air vents can prolong the life - dunno, never tried it.</p>

[kyle_madison]

<p>Lex, I think you just saved me a ton of money. I happened to have bought ten SR-44 batters for 8.99 (silver oxide, but identical to the LR44s you're talking about) for my new Olympus XA. I stuck one in all three cameras also without an adapter and they work perfectly. It is odd though that Wein's new batch of batteries have all been bad (I've tried two so far) while the ones from last year seemed spot on.</p>

[lex_jenkins]

<p>The Wein cells are probably fine from the manufacturer, but zinc air batteries have a relatively short shelf life, even unopened. That's why they turn over quickly at pharmacies.</p>

<p>Not sure they'll work in the XA. My XA3 needs the silver oxide cells to meter properly.</p>

[Matthew Currie]

<p>I think Lex has it on the zinc air batteries. I find with a (very voltage sensitive double cell) Konica FT3 that I have to compensate by about 2/3 of a stop with hearing aid cells over the original mercuries, but this is very consistent and very well within range. Other meters that are not quite so sensitive are right on. I doubt you'll need any appreciable offset on an old Minolta, for example. Some battery boxes will work fine with O-rings on the smaller cells, or even with nothing at all. Others (Nikon F Photomic, for example) that require contact on the edge, will require a metal ring. Meters that want a mercury cell need a voltage that is consistently very near the original, and those Wein cells are just way too low. </p>

<p>For cameras that can use silver oxide batteries, if you live near a Big Lots store, drop by from time to time. They get their button batteries, it seems, in random batches, and occasionally get a bunch of Sunbeam or ~lion (can't remember name) silver oxides in the correct size, at 5 for two dollars. They last fine. Dollar stores sometimes have good sized packs of alkalines, also, which will do for an XA or most other button battery cameras in a pinch. </p>

<p>My only caveat on the hearing aid batteries is that as the 176/44 size becomes less common in hearing aids, it is no longer guaranteed that they will be very fresh. Be a little cautious, look for signs of age, and try to patronize stores that will allow a return. </p>

[vince-p]

<p>I use the Wein cells in a Leica CL, which has rather unusual battery seating structure which involves sliding it into place under the film advance mechanism at the bottom of the camera body, a design decision which necessitates changing the battery ONLY when there is no film in the camera. Anyone ever try other cells in this? </p>

<p>Also, one can get any kind of weapon or drug in this country. Is it actually impossible to get a couple of illegal mercury batteries? They are very consistent and last for like ten years. I'd defy the law to have like six of them. Don't tell anyone I said so. </p>

[walter_degroot]

<p>if you live where you can get the mercury cells buy them and use them.<br>

It is somewhat crazy. but we likely will never see them again.<br>

The Incandescent light bulbs are being " phased out" The replacements, made in Chia comtain mercury.<br>

I do not know how much. but there are a Lot more compact florescent bulbs then camera batteries.<br>

Nothing these daya makes sense.<br>

The hearing aid cells have 4 holes. use craxy glue oor nail polich on a tootpick to block two/.<br>

If you buy a dozen. some will die before you use them.<br>

Bob S sent me some rings for batteries. I do not know if he buys them or makes them.<br>

but some cameras use a 625 sideways and a ring / flange is requires to make it work.<br>

( canonet 28) the Konica c-35 is ok.</p>

[dennis_w3]

<p>A few years ago, I tried Wein cells twice for both my Topcon RE Supers and Olympus 35SP. One was dead, the others died within a week. I've since used hearing aid batteries (1.4V) with rubber o-rings, and they're great. IMO, at $7.00 per, the Wein cells are a rip.</p>

[bebu_lamar]

<p>I do have a canonet QL17, and if I have your Pen and Yashica mat I would first try silver oxide battery and if the meters are not accurate then I would use them without. All three I think will work without batteries. I think Wein cell is a waste of money, you gain little with Wein cell and they are expensive and doesn't last long. </p>

[matthew_rusbarsky]

<p>Don't throw away your used wein cells. A hammer and a few appropriately sized nuts or washers can be used to tap the metal collar off the battery. The collar friction-fits very nicely onto the appropriate zinc air cell from your local drug store. Much cheaper, more likely to be fresh, and readily available.</p>

[walter_degroot]

<p>the future of zinc-air cells. <br>

I read a post about the Bulova Accutron wrist watch and<br>

the problem finding the rare cells. the author mentioned that<br>

other small cells are being phased out.,<br>

It is likely or possible, that as folks age and pass away.<br>

that the younger folks with hearing problems.<br>

will purchase and use smaller hearing aide.<br>

and the cell we rely on for our old mercury cell<br>

based cameras may become unavailable,<br>

I saw a lot of them in the discontinued half price bin. <br>

I am expecting to add a Shottky diode to the camera<br>

so a Silver-oxide call can be used. <br>

BUT I WONDER: why can we not use a silver-oxide call<br>

in older cameras and just make an asa adjustment?<br>

is there some kind of Linearity problem ?<br>

Some cameras are fairly simple to modify. others<br>

are difficult. </p>

 

[Mike Gammill]

I think two CFLs might have as much mercury as a dead mercury cell, but there are lots more CFLs and I doubt if much

care is taken in disposal.

[bob_sunley]

<p>675 hearing aid cells are on the shelf at Costco, inexpensive and they do last till their best before date on the package. <br>

Yes, I made those brass rings for the 675 cells. Lathes are handy toys. :)</p>

<p> </p>

[jim_momary]

<p>Walter,<br>

Exactly the problem, a fairly healthy non-linearity exists.<br>

From what little I have seen or played with, depending on the camera and the EV, I believe I have seem a worst case range as much as a 5 stop error when the EV varied from low to high, when I used silver battery in place of a merc. cell. Most of the time, the range seemed about 3 stops.</p>

<p>For me, so long as I can get to the back side of the battery cup, I plop in a properly sized Schottky diode, and enjoy the ability to fly with an SR44 cell. A 50 cent solution, tho I have no 'valuable' collector bodies I'm keeping original. The pricey battery adapters work without altering the camera and may suit most folks.</p>

<p>My silly 2 cents</p>

[Matthew Currie]

<p>Non-linearity seems to vary with cameras as well, and on some I think people get a bit overly fussy. I was told by a reliable source, for example, that the original Nikon Photomic meters were expected to be good to within a stop. The graduations of F-stop and shutter speed are in whole stops as well. There are people who try to calibrate their meters to be perfect, but what's the end result? I have found that if I center my recalibrated reading at a middle exposure value using middle ASA film, say ASA 100 or 200, the exposure meter will be within about a third of a stop throughout the range of actual use, which is probably better than the factory got it when new. It's good enough for slides, if you meter intelligently, and way good enough for prints. That may well not be as good as some others, or as bad as some others, but I consider that for this result it's worth getting in there and re-adjusting a meter for silver oxide cells. For others, it's undoubtedly easier to find a way to alter the voltage at the source, especially if you can actually fit a diode into the body of the camera. Not all make this easy.</p>

<p>Just make sure you label the camera, in case you or some future user forgets what was done. </p>