Tilted Horizons

[mendel_leisk]

<p>While I'm not technically a beginning photographer, this is a very basic and general question, so thought it best to post here. Moderators feel free to shift it somewhere more appropriate:</p>

<p>Just back from vacation, and I see more-or-less EVERY picture I took with a horizon is tilting: higher on left side, lower on right.</p>

<p>When reviewing shots when I see this happening I try to correct/compensate, but without much success. I could probably apply a 10 degree counter clockwise correction via batch process to all my shots, LOL.</p>

<p>I'd appreciate any feedback, tips.</p>

<p>I'm actually wondering if I should draw this to my GP's attention. Thoughts?</p>

[jim_j2]

<p>Mendel,<br>

Don't know that I'm going to be of much help, . . . but since no one else has responded, I'll try . . . . so here goes and maybe there will be something out of this that may help.</p>

<p>I shoot mostly from a tripod, so that alone may make this input worthless.<br>

I find that using the "Grid" in Live View, even if not shooting in Live View helps me a lot, to just take a quick look when I have the time. Otherwise I just correct the "tilted" horizon in post processing.<br>

But, . . . mine usually only require a rotation of about -0.1 or -0.2 degrees counterclockwise. Now I'm not sure if my software graduates in full degrees or not! But the 10 degree batch process sounds a bit high!</p>

<p>Hopefully someone will chime in soon!</p>

<p>Best wishes,<br>

Jim j.</p>

[David_Cavan]

<p>I find that when I start to consistently get this problem it is because I am hand-holding, and not recognizing what happens when I press on the shutter button on the right side of the camera. I think that naturally tends to push the camera down on that side as the shutter opens and closes. As soon as I start to think about it, I can make the problem mostly go away simply by checking the horizon as one of the final things before I press the button.</p>

[pbalko]

<p>My horizons often tilt down several degrees from left to right and I tend to leave more dead space on the right than on the left. My solution is to try to keep it in mind when I'm looking through the VF. I usually don't succeed.</p>

[natureslight]

<p>I used to have the same problem. I love photographing sunrise over the ocean (I live about a mile from the Atlantic), which can create issues because there is often nothing on the horizon upon which to judge angle. My solution was to always use a tripod; to use grid mode and – perhaps one of the most important steps – to step back from the tripod-mounted camera before I hit the shutter button. By stepping back, even in low light, I am able to see when the camera is not straight and quickly adjust accordingly. In truth, as soon as I began using a tripod for the vast majority of my shots, my success rate rose dramatically. A tripod is something of a double-edge sword: using one stabilizes everything, slows you down so you must take time to evaluate the shot before pushing the shutter and helps eliminate many problems associated with hand-holding. The downside of a tripod is weight and, the slowing down factor. If you are trying to capture fast movement, often times a tripod is simply not practical. But, as for getting the horizon straight, using a tripod sure works for me. </p>

[mike_stemberg]

<p>My response to your problem is an amalgam of what David and Phil (above) have written, but with an additional point. You might want to try re-thinking how you grasp your camera prior to pressing the trigger....</p>

[david_henderson]

<p>I have the same issue with this and previous cameras. I get round it in some measure by mostly shooting in Live View which gives me a gridded screen, and by making extensive use of the Lightroom straighten tool. But I previously had the problem when I shot with Bronicas with gridded screens and tripod unless I really checked every frame before shooting. </p>

<p>For me I think the root cause lies in the fact that I tilt my head to the right somewhat when shooting, initially because I used a relatively short tripod and subsequently because that pose became habitual ( only when taking photographs you understand :-) ). <br>

I think I'd steer clear of my GP on this one unless you're noticing that the beer in your glass is sloping as well. </p>

[William Michael]

<p>Do you wear eye glasses?<br>

How far away from the Viewfinder do you generally have your eye?<br>

Do you have an eyecup on the Viewfinder?<br>

<br>

I am adding these to the list of possible reasons, because I’ve noticed this in beginners who wear eyeglasses or do not push the eyeball up to the viewfinder.<br>

(I conclude) that the whole viewfinder is therefore not being scanned with full attention to the horizontal edge of the viewfinder.<br>

I understand you are not a beginner, but it might be part of the answer – just that you have fallen into an habit of NOT critically reviewing the bottom of the frame as your reference horizon BECAUSE your eyeball is too far away.<br>

<br>

WW</p>

[dan_south]

<p>Not all horizons are level, but it sounds as though you may have a habit of tilting your shots in one direction. It could be that you are looking at the viewfinder from an angle, perhaps as a result of wearing glasses.</p>

<p>Suggestions:</p>

 

<ol>

<li>Try using live view to frame your shots (using both eyes simultaneously).</li>

<li>Try leveling your camera with a bubble level (especially effective when working from a tripod).</li>

<li>If your camera has an electronic level display, try shooting with it engaged. Maybe it will help.</li>

<li>If the horizon is indeed tilted, decide whether your camera should be level or whether you can tilt the camera to match the horizon. You'll have to make this decision for each composition.</li>

</ol>

 

[Jeff Lear]

<p>Hey Mendel, I use the <a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?sku=402202&Q=&O=&is=REG&A=details">Ee-D</a> grid focusing screen on my 5D for precisely this reason. Because the 5D doesn't have LiveView, horizontal adjustments need to be made through the view finder or using a two or three-axis level (which I also use). The grid focus screen is awesome under most lighting conditions however, it doesn't work well for very low light, you simply can't see the grid lines. When I can't see the grid, normally under very low light conditions when I'm using a tripod, I use a three-axis spirit level that mounts in the hot shoe.</p>

[mark_drutz]

<p>The shutter release is on the right side. My guess is that when you press the shutter release you are pushing the camera down on the right side. Try pressing the shutter release more gently and just be aware of what you are doing.</p>

[lex_jenkins]

<p>The slightly forward angled shutter release button on some cameras helps offset this common tendency. I have to concentrate a bit more on my technique when using my cameras with top mounted, straight-down shutter release buttons.</p>

[jimstrutz]

<p>I have the same problem. Typically my pictures are tipped clockwise a couple degrees, and it always bugs me later. Recently I've been trying to be more aware while shooting and one thing I've noticed is that even if I start out level, as I pan to the right the pictures tend to tip increasingly. I used to run everything through Lightroom and individually straighten them all, but they are all tipped different amounts in my case, so batch processing them doesn't work. Lately I've switched to Corel Aftershot Pro since it is considerably faster than Lightroom.</p>

[ian_gordon_bilson]

<p>To the O/P : As an experienced pro, I have to say I have had this problem since I started digital.<br>

All my film cameras are fitted with grid screens -no problems there.<br>

But the 1 or 2 degree error has started to creep in lately. Blaming the gear is one option..lower production tolerances maybe?<br>

Technique is the likely problem here -if you flinch during the exposure,it will show.<br>

If you know any rifle shooters,ask them for tips. Otherwise,try a little overcompensation in the other direction.<br>

And - try to relax..</p>

[lachaine]

<p>Funny, I almost never had slanted horizons with my basic film cameras for decades. Since I started using modern digital cameras, I get them all the time, no matter how carefully I compose and take the picture. I've so far had this experience with several cameras, both compacts and a DSLR. I do think the fact that I now wear glasses may have something to do with what I see in the viewfinder or on the LCD. However, I have a suspicion that image stabilization may contribute to not giving us exactly what we thought we saw when this is combined with slight movement as we press the shutter, and perhaps also with distortion correction which some cameras do internally.</p>

<p>Where others would have you glued to the ground with a heavy tripod so that you can take boring, static pictures, I would say just do your best and if it needs slight rotation afterwards, no problem. It's digital after all, and we all know that anything goes. Seriously, even in the darkroom, photographers corrected for this whenever necessary, just by rotating the easel appropriately under the enlarger.</p>

[mendel_leisk]

<p>Thanks all. FYI, I'm using a 5D, so don't have a grid screen or the ability to preview on the LCD, though these both sound effective. I am wearing glasses. As several responders mentioned, it could be the way I'm depressing the shutter button. The few shots my wife took with the same camera were consistantly close to level, LOL.</p>

<p>I think I need to do some practice regarding this: take shots, review the results, repeat. I've fallen into a habit somehow, will work on it. It does seem strange, when everything looks fine through the viewfinder, but then... Ok, will work on it :)</p>

[Jeff Lear]

<blockquote>

<p>FYI, I'm using a 5D, so don't have a grid screen or the ability to preview on the LCD, though these both sound effective.</p>

 

</blockquote>

<p>I'm also using a 5D, but I've swapped out the standard focus screen for the Ee-D (see linked text in my previous comment) which has a super-imposed grid. This is what it looks like when I peer through the viewfinder of my 5D...<br /><br /><img src="http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r34/F1Addict/Miscellaneous%20Crap/IMG_0704.jpg" alt="" /><br>

Sorry for the poor quality image. Using my 40D to photograph through the viewfinder of my 5D proved to be not as easy as I thought it would be. Having the grid as a reference makes it infinitely easier to level my horizons. I still mess them up from time to time but nowhere near as much as I used to.</p>

 

[tom_harvey3]

<p>I had the same problem on my 5DII before I added the grid screen. I found that rotating Canyonlands, Monument Valley and Hoover Dam, to name just a few by .1 degree was a Herculean task.</p>

[mendel_leisk]

<p>Jeff, Tom, does that screen swap fairly easily? I've popped out the first few layers once or twice, to clear viewfinder dust. Is it one of those?</p>

[mendel_leisk]

<p>Just playing around, it seems like all I have to do is take a bit more time, make the effort to stay level. I've likely gotting into a habit, and need to unlearn it.</p>

[Jeff Lear]

<blockquote>

<p>Jeff, Tom, does that screen swap fairly easily? I've popped out the first few layers once or twice, to clear viewfinder dust. Is it one of those?</p>

 

</blockquote>

<p>Yep, it snaps in just below the pentaprism in the top of the light box. I think it took about 30 seconds to swap. I tried unlearning bad habits but in the end, I realized it wasn't necessarily a bad habit. My eye saw the horizon as level, even when using a tripod with a remote shutter release. Having the grid gives me a point of reference.</p>

[tom_harvey3]

<p>Yes, changing the screen is about a 20 second job.</p>

[john_macpherson]

<p>I've developed a tilt to the right over the years, noticeable and weird. Any one of you other tilters use your left eye?</p>

[mendel_leisk]

<p>I'm left handed/eyed.</p>

[john_macpherson]

<p>I'm left eyed too. And kind-of ambidextrous.</p>