Grainy Color Negatives - Where to place the blame?

[claire_atkinson1]

<p>I've just returned from a trip. I shot 35mm Portra 160, as usual, and developed the film at a local 'professional' photo lab. Nothing different from what I normally do. <br>

I'm scanning the images now and it is apparent that something has gone wrong. I am not using an amazing scanner (canon 8800f) but it cannot be responsible for these results. There is a lot of grain and some of the photos just look awful. I have inclued an image below.<br>

Is this a problem with the processing at the lab or maybe a bad batch of film? or bad scans?<br>

Any help appreciated, I've only been shooting color for a year now and I've never had such a disappointing experience as this one. <br>

Thank you</p>

<p><img src="http://clairejatkinson.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/beer.jpg" alt="" width="800" height="516" /></p>

[greg_miller10]

<p>If it were the lab you'd notice other problems as well. Over or under development can cause grain issues. Under development because you have to put an agressive curve on your scanned image to get the contrast and brightness correct and this causes grain. With over development the film is simply more grainy. Check the printing in the rebate of the film to see if it matches another Portra 160 that you've had processed in the past. Preferably one of a near same vintage. If the printing is comparatively dense or thin then there is likely a development problem.</p>

[starvy]

<p>Claire,<br>

It seems nothing out of the ordinary to me. The darker areas do tend to have rather more grain and this is the case here.</p>

[claire_atkinson1]

<p>I've included another image straight from the scanner to better show the quality (or lack there of)<br>

The images look a world away from anything I have shot before with the same film and lab. </p>

<p><img src="http://clairejatkinson.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/untitled-26.jpg" alt="" /></p>

<p> </p>

[greg_miller10]

<p>These images aren't big enough to see much grain and they aren't all that helpful for telling if you have a problem with how the film was developed or discovering what the issue is. To really tell a development problem you need to look at the negative and not the scanned image. There does seem to be an odd color crossover happening that is fairly obvious in the silly putty colored dirt while other parts of the picture are more neutral - but this could be a scanning issue too. </p>

<p>You need to look at the negative...how does it look compared to other negatives of the same type and brand? Is the orange mask different? Does the edge printing look different? Is the overall contrast and density different? Is it as transparent as your other negatives? </p>

<p>There could be a small amount of silver retention causing the grain in which case that can be corrected by rebleaching and refixing. If it is a development or developer problem then there's not to much to be done.</p>

[daniel_fortier]

<p>+1 for Greg answer<br>

In doubt with C-41 or E-6 re-bleach & re-fix films, there is no damage to do so X2 </p>

[User_502260]

<p>Backlighting and very bright subjects can fool your meter and cause underexposure. That's the easiest way to increase grain with color negative film.</p>

[bob_sunley]

<p>Underexposure increases grain as there are two layers for each colour, one is a fine grain low speed layer, the other is a high speed much coarser layer. When you under expose, only the high speed layer is exposed, giving you a nice grainy image. A proper exposure exposes both layers and the fine grained layer fills in the grain from the high speed layer.</p>

 

[david_l3]

<p>In both examples there are an areas of highlights which would skew a light meter toward under exposure. If the pictures were taken on color slide film we'd see more areas that are too dark. </p>

[claire_atkinson1]

<p>Thanks for the ideas.<br /> I have just picked up a strip of negatives from this batch and a strip from a previous batch of portra 160 and compared them. <br /> The negatives from the previous batch, which look perfect, have more of an orange cast to them. <br /> I am attaching here 2 negative scans to show the differences. If there is anything I can do to correct this I would like to try. Or at least show the lab. So Thanks for the help. <br /> The first scan here is from the previous batch of portra 160<br>

<br /><img src="http://clairejatkinson.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/untitled-4.jpg" alt="" width="1687" height="1107" /><br>

<br /> This second scan is from the new batch of portra 160, with awful results. <br>

<br /><img src="http://clairejatkinson.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/untitled-21.jpg" alt="" width="1707" height="1014" /><br>

<br /> Can this help to confirm any of your ideas?<br /> Cheers</p>

[claire_atkinson1]

<p>Also, I doubt I managed to underexpose every image on 16 rolls of film. I have since used the camera and developed film at home with no exposure problems at all and good results, so I doubt it is a fault with the camera battery or something causing underexposure. </p>

[StuartMoxham]

<p>Yep it looks less orange. Take both films back to the lab or to another professional lab and ask them why one is less orange than the other. Without seeing the films in person this just becomes guess work. If the lab has a chemistry problem then they really do need to know about it and fix it.</p>

[bob_sunley]

<p>Look at the sprocket hole area, if there is any difference in the density of the "printing" and the mask colour, it s almost always a chemistry/processing problem. There are differences in mask colour between different films, but there should be no differences between rolls of the same film.</p>

 

[larrydressler]

<p>I am thinking improper Bleach/Fix. Almost as if it had a bleach bypass.</p>

[greg_miller10]

<p>It's still difficult to tell for sure what's going on here but if the negatives are a good representation of how they actually look I'd say the film looks old. A lessening of the intensity of the color of the orange mask and a reduction of the saturation of the color is typical of old or maybe heat damaged film. Eventually that orange, in most cases, turns to a dirty green and this to me looks like it is going in that direction. Did you leave the film in a hot car for any amount of time? If the film had been under developed creating the lower contrast images, the orange mask wouldn't be faded as it is here.</p>

<p>I don't suspect a bleach/fix problem because there is generally a bit more of an unevenness than in this case. Would hurt though to rebleach and fix to make sure. My guess is that it's not a development problem...or at least one I'd know how to create.</p>

[greg_miller10]

<p>One more idea....I haven't had to deal with Kodak customer service at this level for a long long while but in the past, you'd have been able to send the film into a technician and get a real qualified answer to your question. Being a professional film I'm betting you still can. 1 800 242 2424 extension 19 (I think) for professional products.</p>