Will major solar storms damage Digital cameras & memory?

[paulie_smith1]

<p>MODS, if this needs to be moved, so so. I looked at 'off topic' but it said not photo related. My query concerns photo gear and our ability to use battery/digital stuff.</p>

<p>The link and short bit below is from Yahoo. Many other sites, from scientific to general also give information on what may be a problem for electronic cameras in the future. Anyone with knowledge know what the effect may be on digital cameras, CF cards and memory not in 'hard copy' fashion? I do know from reading a major event like that below or larger(like the 'it won't happen' 100 year floods in Minot, North Dakota - near me) can and will eventually hit. If so, what are our alternatives? Keep our digital gear in a tin foil wrapped refrigerator in the basement? Our computers as well?<br>

With the power grid down and major transformers not readily available(some scientific papers I have read say most electric suppliers don't have the larger ones on hand) how will batteries be charged?</p>

<p><a href="http://news.yahoo.com/power-companies-prepare-solar-storms-set-hit-earth-144759933.html">http://news.yahoo.com/power-companies-prepare-solar-storms-set-hit-earth-144759933.html</a><br>

Major disruptions from solar activity are rare but have had serious impacts in the past.<br>

In 1989, a solar storm took down the power grid in Quebec, Canada, leaving about six million people without power for several hours.<br>

The largest solar storm ever recorded was in 1859 when communications infrastructure was limited to telegraphs.<br>

The 1859 solar storm hit telegraph offices around the world and caused a giant aurora visible as far south as the Caribbean Islands.<br>

Some telegraph operators reported electric shocks. Papers caught fire. And many telegraph systems continued to send and receive signals even after operators disconnected batteries, NOAA said on its website.<br>

A storm of similar magnitude today could cause up to $2 trillion in damage globally, according to a 2008 report by the National Research Council.</p>

[David_Cavan]

<p>every few months...</p>

<p><a href="../off-topic-forum/00YGnE?start=0">http://www.photo.net/off-topic-forum/00YGnE?start=0</a></p>

[leighb]

<p>No. There's nowhere near enough energy reaching the surface to damage any electronic equipment.</p>

<p>Power company problems are the result of disruption of their radio communications systems. They still rely heavily on microwave radio to coordinate operations throughout the service area. If those comms go down, safety systems will shut down or reduce service to prevent major damage.</p>

<p>- Leigh</p>

 

[Ed_Ingold]

<p>There's a peak in solar activity every 11 years, at the nadir of sunspot activity. It affects radio transmission due to disturbances in the Heaviside atmospheric layer, and power transmission due to inductive effects over hundreds of miles of wire. It's not going to affect something as small and isolated as a digital camera or CF card.</p>

<p>By the way, does the foil go shiny side or dull side out for protective hats?</p>

[leighb]

<p>I believe the OP is referring to solar flares, which can occur at any time, and which release very large amounts of energy for a short period of time. These will disrupt radio communication.</p>

<p>They're not related to the 11-year sunspot cycle. Radio transmission improves as the number of sunspots increases. During the recent sunspot lull, which lasted years longer than normal, long-distance radio communication was abysmal.</p>

<p>- Leigh</p>

[JDMvW]

<p>At one of the sites discussing these flares, it was pointed out that at the last major outburst in the 19th c., <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_storm_of_1859"><em><strong>telegraph </strong></em> stations were affected</a> so I'm not altogether certain about</p>

<blockquote>

<p>There's nowhere near enough energy reaching the surface to damage any electronic equipment.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>I suppose that we shall find out, one way or other. If my digital cameras die or catch on fire, I still have more than a hundred totally mechanical cameras to use. ;)</p>

<p>Just think, if it does in your camera, your computer is also at risk. Cheers.</p>

[paulie_smith1]

<p>I posted/asked about this after having to replace a computer that was scrambled after a major lightning storm. No lightning strike to the house or power line that the power company could find. But, they surmise so much lightning so close that it scrambled a lot of stuff. Wiped out the hard drive on my computer but not the DVD's and CD's. Wiped out some of my cassette tapes as well. I was away photographing and had the digital gear with me so no problems there.<br>

But, with Northern Lights at times bright enough to read by a major display like that 1859 show would be a problem. Probably bright enough to get a suntan... and its predicted effect on the electronics may be worth checking out. <a href="http://www.futurescience.com/emp/emp-protection.html">http://www.futurescience.com/emp/emp-protection.html</a> is one site I have read. Does not sound positive at all. No, I don't know what reality is, just what I read. Maybe it is real or maybe a 'tin foil hat' thing. All I really know is that lightning that did not strike out place forced me to replace my computer and backup computer(both plugged in) and screwed up the 'surge protectors' as well as the electric clocks and tripping every breaker on the circuit panel.<br>

So, if anyone has more info on this and what reality for us may be, would be glad to read it.</p>

[leighb]

<p>Lightning is well-known to cause damage to electronic equipment, primarily due to surges induced on power lines. This problem has been with us since the dawn of the electronic age.</p>

<p>The only practical solution is installation of surge protectors on the power lines going to the equipment, usually in the form of outlet strips with built-in surge protectors. These have some potential hazards of their own, but generally the benefits outweigh the risks.</p>

<p>Lightning surges are completely unrelated to any solar activity.</p>

<p>To give you an idea of the power of a lightning strike...<br /> Some years ago I was an engineer with Motorola. I was asked to investigate a lightning strike at a mountain-top microwave site that put the site completely off the air. When I arrived I found that one six-foot tall rack full of equipment had been blown through the side of the steel building and ended up across the parking lot, about 50 feet away.</p>

<p>As to EMP... This problem has been known for decades. Much of our electronic equipment could be susceptible, although modern components are generally EMP-hardened to minimize the possibilities.</p>

<p>- Leigh</p>

[lad_lueck]

<p>Unless your camera is 100's of miles wide, you don't need to worry about induced current from solar storms...</p>

[tom_mann1]

<p>The photo.net thread on this topic cited above is a good place to start.</p>

<p>If you want to read more, there is a very nice, comprehensive article on Geomagnatic storms in Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geomagnetic_storm#Disrupted_systems . It puts the possible damage to various systems (eg, communications, navigation, satellites, the electric grid, pipelines, etc.) in perspective.</p>

<p>Radiation damage to digital electronics during a solar storm certainly can happen in space, but is negligible on the ground. If the radiation flux on the ground actually ever became so large as to seriously damage my camera, I would be much more worried about what this level of radiation was doing to me, not my camera. There is more detail about this in the above cited Wikipedia article.</p>

<p>The initial post in this thread mentioned power grid problems, eg, "how will I charge my batteries". Yes, a big geomagnetic storm could take out the power grid. If the power goes off, I think you will find you have many more matters of immediate and vital concern to you than than worrying about how to charge your camera's batteries. I won't even begin to list these.</p>

<p>Folks worry that the same processes that can damage the power grid could damage their personal electronics. As I stated in the earlier photo.net thread on this topic (cited above), you don't have to worry about this sort of direct action. The changing magnetic field in such a storm induces voltages in large interconnected loops of wire such as the power grids of the country. The voltage induced by the storm is proportional to the area of the loop of wire. In the case of power grids, the areas involved are tens of thousands of square kilometers (and larger), whereas in the case of personal electronics, the largest area may be at most a few tens of square cm. Do the math: we are talking about area ratios of order 13 orders of magnitude, so if, say, the power grid experienced a huge induced voltage of say 100,000 volts (100 kV), the voltages directly induced in your personal electronics by the same changing field will only be 10^-8 volts (ie, a 10 nanovolts). Obviously, this is entirely negligible.</p>

<p>That being said, if you have some electronics connected to the power grid, and the grid goes down, your electronics will almost certainly experience the usual voltage surges and other transients that accompany any disruption to the mains power. A good surge protector will take care of this.</p>

<p>A more significant problem can occur if your electronics is simultaneously connected to two electric grids, say, the power grid and conventional (ie, not fibre optic) telephone lines. In this case, because of a possible difference in layout of the the two grids, they can rise to two different voltages, and, in poorly designed circuits, that difference could try to equalize itself through your equipment. Again, a good surge protector (ie, one to which you connect both power and telephone lines) should take care of this. Isolated electronics (ie, an unconnected camera), or electronics at the end of a power line, but plugged in through a good surge protector or UPS (eg, a laptop plugged in to the wall through a surge protector) should be immune from problems.</p>

<p>HTH,</p>

<p>Tom M</p>

<p>PS - I hadn't seen the most recent comments about lightning and EMP. Leigh's comments about these were right on the mark.</p>

[Ed_Ingold]

<p>Solar flares can occur at any time, but tend to increase in frequency and intensity when sunspot activity is at a minimum (as at present).</p>

[MichaelChang]

<p>Actually, there is a correlation between solar flares and digital camera sensors which can be inferred from the two links: </p>

<p>Cosmic rays and digital camera sensors:<br>

<a href="../casual-conversations-forum/00Z0sq">http://www.photo.net/casual-conversations-forum/00Z0sq</a></p>

<p>and </p>

<p>Solar flares and cosmic rays:<br>

<a href="http://www2.slac.stanford.edu/vvc/cosmicrays/crsun.html">http://www2.slac.stanford.edu/vvc/cosmicrays/crsun.html</a></p>

[leighb]

<p>Yep, this is right up there with health hazards from 60 Hz transmission lines.</p>

<p>But we'll all die anyway, so why worry?</p>

<p>- Leigh</p>

 

[randy_cooprider1]

<p>I looked at the a few of the web pages listed and learned that "cosmic rays" are not the same as "cosmic radiation" Cosmic rays as defined on Wikipedia are ...energetic charged subatomic particles originationg in outer space... whereas cosmic radiation (maybe gamma?) are electromagnetic radiation of high frequency. The atmosphere will block most of the cosmic rays but not do much to the cosmic radiation. <br>

One of the posters said that we're all going to die so why worry? Reminds me of the story about who wants to live to 90? Answer : a person who is 89. {;<]</p>

[bob_lazzarini]

<p>I believe you have to be within a few thousand miles of the sun's surface.<br>

But then again I've been wrong before. :)<br>

Of course Leigh B. has it right.<br>

Cheers!</p>

[steven_f1]

<p>Many people are aware that nuclear warheads detonated in space will create and EMP (electro magnetic pulse which will destroy most electronics. Solar storms are also reported to create EMP so people think a solar storm could have the same effect as nuclear warhead. However there are some differences between the between solar and nuclear EMP that make Solar EMPs weaker than nuclear.<br>

Nuclear EMPs have 3 basic parts</p>

<ol>

<li>The nuclear blast releases Gama and X-rays which ionize the upper atmosphere. The earth’s magnetic field then directs that energy to ground. Depending on the altitude of the blast and power of the warhead up to a gigawatt of electromagnetic energy (mainly radio and microwaves) may hit 1square meter of land and may only last a nanosecond (a short pulse is generally more damaging than a longer pulse). </li>

<li>Very similar to 1 but cause by slower moving radiation and doesn't have as much power.</li>

<li>The nuclear warhead will distort the magnetic field of the earth. After the blast the magnet field will then snap back to its normal configuration. The movement of the magnetic field across wires will create an electrical current in wires. This effect is much smaller than the other two.</li>

</ol>

<p>With up to a gigawatt per square meter hitting the ground most electronics would fail. Solar storm do produce the same effects as a nuclear warhead but the power levels are very different. </p>

<ol>

<li>Solar storms will create a flash of X-rays and gamarays but the pulse lasts longer. Furthermore the sun is 8 light minutes away greatly reducing the power. When I looked into this I found a document that said a very powerful solar storm would dump about only a few watts of power per square meter into the upper atmosphere. Only a fraction of this energy will make it to the ground. So for items 1 and 2 the amount of power hitting the ground is not enough to cause damage to most electrical equipment. </li>

<li>For item 3 solar storms sometimes have powerful effects on the earth’s magnetic field. Furthermore the amount of power generated in wires is partly dependent on the length of the wires. Solar storms will produce very high voltages and currents in long wires such as transmission lines and telegraph lines. For most electronics (computers digital cameras wires are seldom more than a few inches long greatly reducing the power generated in the wire. Additionally most integrated circuits (memory, sensors, and micro processers) have built in protection against static electricity (which can reach 10,000V). This built in protection against static electricity will likely also help protect against the magnetic effects of a solar storm. </li>

</ol>

<p>So for a powerful solar storm anything plugged into power lines and phone wires could be at risk of damage. In the worst cases the power grid managers may shut down power plants and power lines to prevent damage to the grid and anything plugged in. Anything that is not plugged in will probably be OK.</p>

[jeff_hostetler]

<p>I realize this is an old thread; however I follow solar weather and heliophysics quite a bit. If we were to have another Carrington type event (mentioned in an earlier post- 1860s wiped out telegraph wires, etc) your camera would be the last thing you would be worrying about. The sun produces Coronal Mass Ejections (CME) and a powerful one could have an EMP like effect. The power grid would be down and it would take months to years to get it back up. If your hell bent on saving your camera you could store it in a Faraday Cage.</p>